ELMAX Steel.

The SCRAPMAX knives I used to own handled lots of kitchen duties very well. Not a hint of corrosion or patina although I care for my kitchen knives pretty well.

The thin blade profile would have made for a very effective cutter no matter what the steel, but mine held an edge better than my carbon steel knives and VG-10 ones too. No chips or rolls but I left the Hubbard squash butchery for a much bigger knife!

Not difficult to sharpen and touch up either on an EdgePro system.

I wonder how it would fare in some outdoor activities. I shied away from bushcrafty stuff because of the thinness though and I've got better knives for that purpose.

If I were to find a design that would work for me and it was made of ELMAX, I'd buy it without reservation.

I wonder what hardness Scrapyard shoots for...
 
Smokinape said:
I think the issue wasn't the heat treat it was burned edges specific to ZT Elmax. I have a 0561, but I haven't ran it hard so I can't really say if it is junk or not... I do like the knife so far.

Based off what I have seen, and it's more than jdavis's video, I wouldn't by any ZT Elmax until I see evidence that burnt edges are a thing of the past. I am convinced there was an issue...
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What? How many burnt edges have you seen so far? I have lots of ZT Elmax knives and none of mine had burnt edges. Saying you think the HT isn't an issue doesn't mean much in the context, unless you were to get the blade Rc tested.
 
I'm not a steel expert but in my experience with Elmax I am happy with it. I have a ZT 801 that I have been carry everyday off duty since i got it Aug-8th. I have used it to cut cardboard, clam packing, food, zip ties and such and haven't had to sharpen it yet. I guess it depends on what your EDC is like.
 
J_Curd said:
It doesn't blow my socks off like a few other steels but I've been happy with my Kershaw/ZT's in this steel. Seems a step up from S30V. I would like to try some that has a bit higher RC as well.
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On my zt I chopped a couple of thick weeds with it, chipped the edge in 3 places, small chips. I would say its a couple steps down from s30v , don know if I'll ever buy a knife with Elmax again. But that is the only knife I had in elmax so my experience is limited.
 
I find it a very good balance between ease of sharpening and edge retention on my zt knives. It is extremely resistant to rust. Sure my zdp189 or s110v knives hold an edge a bit longer... But they are also a bear to sharpen.
 
Krav said:
On my zt I chopped a couple of thick weeds with it, chipped the edge in 3 places, small chips. I would say its a couple steps down from s30v , don know if I'll ever buy a knife with Elmax again. But that is the only knife I had in elmax so my experience is limited.
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KAI's service is SO good...why not let them replace the blade and see if you end up satisfied.

As Thomas once told me, regarding a respected competitor's (painful) knife failure ..."All of the top tier makers want to know when things go wrong so they can test, learn, and improve".
 
Krav said:
On my zt I chopped a couple of thick weeds with it, chipped the edge in 3 places, small chips. I would say its a couple steps down from s30v , don know if I'll ever buy a knife with Elmax again. But that is the only knife I had in elmax so my experience is limited.
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How many times did you hit the dirt while chopping at these weeds?
 
J_Curd said:
As Thomas once told me, regarding a respected competitor's (painful) knife failure ..."All of the top tier makers want to know when things go wrong so they can test, learn, and improve".
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This is true. Unfortunately we've yet to see one "burnt edge" or a bad performer come back to the factory. We're unsure how to asses that. As to the few folks that have voiced concern, why haven't you sent them in for evaluation? Complaints without the chance to confirm are difficult for the manufacturer to address.

As to Elmax, we monitor it closely. If I remember it correctly, we introduced it at the production level, and worked with it for years now. We're quite familiar with it, and are satisfied with it being a more than solid all-around steel.

As to the HT and it being "softer" than it could be, well we've had many talk over the years on this max-hardness subject. My opinion is that you're not going to see many manufacturers go for max hardness too often. Max hardness can bring on it's own set of potential issues. There will always be give and takes wherever you take a steel on the Rc scale. Today we run Elmax at 59-61 Rc.

As to expectations, well those can be difficult to live up to. :)
 
I have had and used my 561 everyday for the last year and a half. It was a gift from ZT, thus allowing me to take it places and do things with it that others might not venture to.

I am very happy with the edge retention and ease of sharpening. Since I've had it, I've sharpened it maybe 6 times. Its in my pocket always and is used to trim tree branches, whittle, cut straws, clean fingernails, and cut up food. As well as much, much more.

Everyday for a year and a half, 6 sharpenings, and I still haven't found another knife that will kick it outta my Proppers.

Moose
 
J_Curd said:
KAI's service is SO good...why not let them replace the blade and see if you end up satisfied.

As Thomas once told me, regarding a respected competitor's (painful) knife failure ..."All of the top tier makers want to know when things go wrong so they can test, learn, and improve".
Click to expand...

I don't know if its a problem with the knife so much as maybe the steel, just giving my experience, maybe it was a bad one that slipped threw the crack, it does get super sharp. I put it one the wicked edge, she'll fix any problems.....
 
RevDevil said:
What? How many burnt edges have you seen so far? I have lots of ZT Elmax knives and none of mine had burnt edges. Saying you think the HT isn't an issue doesn't mean much in the context, unless you were to get the blade Rc tested.
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I dont want to get into an e-argument. What I said was that based off what I have seen there were knives with burnt edges, the same info is avaliable to everyone. I didnt say they all had burnt edges, just some which seems within the realm of possibility given folks working with new steel. As far as I know heat treat would effect the whole blade the same, what I have seen are folks who have sharpened off the egde get a better performing knife.
 
Real world testing from one person to the next is no way to confirm or deny the ability of any steel.
The only way to test it properly would be in a lab in a controlled testing enviroment.
Anything else is pure speculation & opinion. imo
 
Kai Corp. said:
This is true. Unfortunately we've yet to see one "burnt edge" or a bad performer come back to the factory. We're unsure how to asses that. As to the few folks that have voiced concern, why haven't you sent them in for evaluation? Complaints without the chance to confirm are difficult for the manufacturer to address.
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I can't say I'm surprised that no one has sent one in. It's easier to complain on the internet about a perceived flaw than to risk being proved wrong.

It's like the 0560 detent issue all over again. Small vocal minority who couldn't figure it how to open the knife properly bitched and moaned about the detents being too strong. They were encouraged to send them back to kai whereupon it was found to have no issue besides operator error.
 
Tell you what Kai, send me everything ya got in Elmax and I'll gladly evaluate it for issues!

All kidding aside, I can't speak unilaterally regarding whether or not there is an existing issue as I simply don't own any knives with those issues, and if I did I would contact Kai. Personal experience with their customer service leads me to believe they'd help me out.
 
I've had great performance from my Kai/Kershaw/ZT Elmax knives. A 551, and a Speedform 2. It's pretty tough for stainless. The steel is clean and takes very nice edges because of it in my knives. Even thinned out, high polish stuff in the Speedform 2. I have no idea what hardness is at but it's performance is excellent. If someone claims poor performance but refuses to let W&R look at it I get suspicious. If that person has a history of doing that exact thing with two other manufacturers I know what it is. I'll stick with my own experiences. They are very good so far.

joe
 
EBHM4 said:
, I can't speak unilaterally regarding whether or not there is an existing issue...
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While I understand forum and YT life, that can take an individual situation(s) and run with it, I can say with certainty that there is no "existing issue". If there were, we'd most likely know about it before it left the factory due to our spec testing that we do with every HT batch that we deal with. We have volumes of information on each batch that we keep. This is not to say there won't be isolated issues, but to negatively label and then spread as gospel with a vid or a post is not exactly fair.

If you feel like you have an issue with any steel (from any manufacturer), you should send it in for evaluation. Why wouldn't you, especially on a premium knife? We'll be happy to address the situation and give you the results of the findings.
 
Uddeholm Elmax is a Swedish powder steel thats been around for quite some time now , its quality is well established .

Its stainless , tough & wear resistant at the same time , like some have already pointed out send it back to the company for testing,
because if there is something wrong with "burnt edges" or the heat treat , they need to know about it.





1234,,,:)
 
solomon666 said:
Real world testing from one person to the next is no way to confirm or deny the ability of any steel.
The only way to test it properly would be in a lab in a controlled testing enviroment.
Anything else is pure speculation & opinion. imo
Click to expand...

CATRA doesn't always reveal problems either.
 
Kai Corp. said:
This is true. Unfortunately we've yet to see one "burnt edge" or a bad performer come back to the factory. We're unsure how to asses that. As to the few folks that have voiced concern, why haven't you sent them in for evaluation? Complaints without the chance to confirm are difficult for the manufacturer to address.

As to Elmax, we monitor it closely. If I remember it correctly, we introduced it at the production level, and worked with it for years now. We're quite familiar with it, and are satisfied with it being a more than solid all-around steel.

As to the HT and it being "softer" than it could be, well we've had many talk over the years on this max-hardness subject. My opinion is that you're not going to see many manufacturers go for max hardness too often. Max hardness can bring on it's own set of potential issues. There will always be give and takes wherever you take a steel on the Rc scale. Today we run Elmax at 59-61 Rc.

As to expectations, well those can be difficult to live up to. :)
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I sent mine in last week for the poor performance of my 560. The service was great. I am still getting a Elmax blade back which I paid $30 for which I was told if i wasn't satisfied i could get credit to another product. I really hope that the blade on this one is performs much better.I absolutely love this knife but am extremly disappointed in the steel.
 
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