Endura 4 or "Late to the Party"

I bought an Endura4 by accident before I bought a 3 (the dealer sent the wrong knife by accident). I have since reground the blade a bit to get a more pointed tip, and I have debated more work to raise the grind or even go full flat (if I had something better than a benchstone to do this, it would be done already). I like the E4 handle, but I prefer the E3 blade, with the finer tip and higher grind. I guess there is just no pleasing some people :o

In this case, we're in the same boat. I also like the older blade style better. And yes, an Endura in full flat grind would be awsome (hint, hint).
 
I understand what you guys are saying. I too liked the penetrate anything look of the E3 blade. The E4 somehow looks blunted. Has anyone done penetration test to see how the E3 and E4 stack up against each other.
I really like the E4 handle redesign. Those liners add a real substantial feel to the knife.:thumbup:
 
I carried an E3 for a while, and then got to check out the e4. Personally I like the upgrade. I have an old G2 endura and the E4 is just the improvements it needed. I bought a 610 a few months back. A nice knife but I'm still itching to get an E4 or Manix. Spydercos just feel more comfortable in the hand to me. Except this old g2 endura which should probably be buried. Anyone else got one of the old ones? Condtion?

mine no longer locks, scratched up blade, missing plastic clip. The funny thing is it still cuts. Cutting tool right to the end.
 
Haven't done the penetration test, but I do own two E3's and an E4. From what I've experienced so far, the E4 works fine for what I do. I initially thought the blunter tip would be a hindrance, but in reality I really haven't missed it that much either. I initially bought an E4 in a CE and was going to get a PE when they got stock but I never did in the end. The CE one is more than adequate - I also have other blades in this size range:D Usually, when I'm using either the E3's or E4, the weight difference is negligible for me, as I don't carry as much - usually during gardeing, home reno stuff, etc. I still like my E3's, but I feel that the E4 was definitely a good move. Now the Delica is a little different because I EDC the Delica every day. I miss the "pointiness" a bit more. Not that the D4 doesn't get the job done, but the D3 just did it better there. I still like the D4 better.

- gord
 
Like most Spyderco's, the E4 sells on experience, not on first sight. I really did not like the new E4 either for reasons mentioned. I bought one and kept it in the drawer at least 3 months before giving it a second chance. After the third chance, the SS E4 is my favorite.
 
Like most Spyderco's, the E4 sells on experience, not on first sight. I really did not like the new E4 either for reasons mentioned. I bought one and kept it in the drawer at least 3 months before giving it a second chance. After the third chance, the SS E4 is my favorite.
...this is reassuring and good to know ! I also appreciate reading others experience with the Endura models 3 and 4.

[Spydercos just feel more comfortable in the hand to me. Except this old g2 endura which should probably be buried. Anyone else got one of the old ones? Condtion?

mine no longer locks, scratched up blade, missing plastic clip. The funny thing is it still cuts. Cutting tool right to the end.

AMEN.......Owning the older G2 version, PE, it has gone through HELL and still locks up as tight as the day it was made. It has been asked it do tasks NO knife should be required to perform, let alone a folding knife......and still it has never failed. ( I can post photos of it later....naturally the tip has been "altered" by time and abuse ). I am probably one of the few who actually like FRN...I have always found the handles on my old Endura to be tough, secure, and most welcoming-ly light weight and slim. Yes, there is some flex when greatly torqued...but NEVER have I experienced the slightest hint of failure or "fatigue". I very much admire Spydercos FRN handles...there....I'm out of the closet !

I want a new Endura not because this old one is "unusable", but because I would like to own an Endura with "upgraded" blade steel. I have yet to experience the pleasures of VG-10 on any knife.

-regards
 
I carried an E3 for a while, and then got to check out the e4. Personally I like the upgrade. I have an old G2 endura and the E4 is just the improvements it needed. I bought a 610 a few months back. A nice knife but I'm still itching to get an E4 or Manix. Spydercos just feel more comfortable in the hand to me. Except this old g2 endura which should probably be buried. Anyone else got one of the old ones? Condtion?

mine no longer locks, scratched up blade, missing plastic clip. The funny thing is it still cuts. Cutting tool right to the end.

I do not yet have a G2 Endura, but if you are ready to bury yours, I'll send you a postage paid, self addressed box for it! :D
 
I must say that I sold the first Endura 4 I purchased mail order to a friend as his first Spydie. I liked the 3 hole clip and the ss liners but I liked the handle shape and blade shape of the Endura 3 better. Perhaps I do not like change. LOL The ONLY problem I have ever seen with Endura 3 is the clip getting turned sideways, the liners and 3 hole clip solved this.

I now have a right and left hand Endura 4. In my left I do not feel like there is as much handle to grab out of the pocket, in the right the difference is not very noticeable. I also like the Pacific Salt because of the handle shape but also the grooves on the back of the blade where the thumb goes.

I think the Endura 4 will grow on you if you give it an honest try. It has on me and it is overall stronger I think.
 
I like the enlarged hole and jimping on the thumb ramp of the Pacific Salt.

However, I favour plain edges and H1, while taking a wicked edge, does not hold it for long compared to VG10

For me a VG-10 Pacific Salt would be the ideal work knife.

Can we have a run of VG-10 Pacific Salts....it could be called the Superior Fresh :D

(Lake Superior / Freshwater) ;)
 
thats the funny thing about these enduras. Can't seem to put them down. Its in my pocket right now, even though their is no clip, lock isn't completely secrure but something about the shape thats always been useful and just what I need. I suppose I'll keep using her till she turns into a finger trap. Its not her fault, she's been neglacted and probably abused.

time to go see if she can still cut it.
 
I wasn't too excited about the Endura 4 when it first came out. I think it is inevitable when a classic design is so beloved, when you change it, people are guaranteed to piss and moan. But I'm with the folks above who mention that they've warmed to the 4. I believe my first post about the 4 said something like "Endura 4 is garbage", which I now strongly disagree with. I too have warmed to the refined design.

The more time I spend with the knife, the more I understand and appreciate the refinements. Especially the handle. It is brilliant. I especially enjoy the way the pocket clip lines up perfectly with the center logo medallion either tip up or tip down. This makes it easy to clip the knife into or take it out of your pocket, without damaging the fabric with repeated use. Same goes for the blade shape. The tip may not be as sexy as it used to be, but it is much stronger, and form certainly follows function with all Spyderco designs. Every one of the refinements to the Endura 4 is a step forward, the new knife is a virtual exhibit of the benefits of incremental engineering. It is a mirror of Porsche's engineering philosophy of continual refinement. There is a reason why the 911 is so good, and why Porsche's quality is now rated #1 in the world. They just keep making their product better, and better, and better while sticking to the core concept. And the responsiveness of Spyderco in general and Sal in particular to ELU feedback is an inspiration. Several times I have been personally contacted by various folks at Spyderco in response to my posts since I discovered the forums just a couple of months ago. Including Sal himself. That kind of attentiveness to the individual customer is very rare indeed!
 
The tip may not be as sexy as it used to be, but it is much stronger, and form certainly follows function with all Spyderco designs.

This was one of my major hang ups, that it would not be as precice in use. In fact in practice, it is as slicy and splinter-pickin as the old one, and it is stronger to boot. It doesn't look like it should work as good as it does, but that is just how Sal does 'em.
 
Hi Gramps,

I would suggest that you look again and more closely. The new 4th generation designs are the result of thousands of hours of comments from customers, and hundreds of hours in design.

sal

Listen to sal man. As someone who carried various enduras for an entire decade (the 90's) I can tell you the changes are needed. The endura four has better construction (screws so you can take it apart), better steel (aus-6 and ats-55 sucked! aus 6 dulled to easy and ats-55 was too brittle), a better clip (it won't cut into the plastic or move around because it's held in by three screws), and a better blade design (half of my enduras I carried ended up with broken tips because of the extreme point and the fairly thin blade. the e4 is stronger and still fairly pointy for precision).

In fact, I'd buy and carry an endura 4 if spyderco hadn't already came up with a "BETTER" endura years ago. It's called the military.
 
I wasn't too excited about the Endura 4 when it first came out. I think it is inevitable when a classic design is so beloved, when you change it, people are guaranteed to piss and moan. But I'm with the folks above who mention that they've warmed to the 4. I believe my first post about the 4 said something like "Endura 4 is garbage", which I now strongly disagree with. I too have warmed to the refined design.

The more time I spend with the knife, the more I understand and appreciate the refinements. Especially the handle. It is brilliant. I especially enjoy the way the pocket clip lines up perfectly with the center logo medallion either tip up or tip down. This makes it easy to clip the knife into or take it out of your pocket, without damaging the fabric with repeated use. Same goes for the blade shape. The tip may not be as sexy as it used to be, but it is much stronger, and form certainly follows function with all Spyderco designs. Every one of the refinements to the Endura 4 is a step forward, the new knife is a virtual exhibit of the benefits of incremental engineering. It is a mirror of Porsche's engineering philosophy of continual refinement. There is a reason why the 911 is so good, and why Porsche's quality is now rated #1 in the world. They just keep making their product better, and better, and better while sticking to the core concept. And the responsiveness of Spyderco in general and Sal in particular to ELU feedback is an inspiration. Several times I have been personally contacted by various folks at Spyderco in response to my posts since I discovered the forums just a couple of months ago. Including Sal himself. That kind of attentiveness to the individual customer is very rare indeed!

....having read your response over several times, I have already forgot I wanted to find an Endura 3 !! You need to be writing copy for Sal......and I mean that as a complement in the nicest way, with no hint of sarcasm. It's very persuasive and well communicated. thanks for taking the time to give me your perspective......as well my gratitude to everyone else who gave me their "take". I like you Spyderco guys as much as I enjoy their knives !

-best to all

In fact, I'd buy and carry an endura 4 if spyderco hadn't already came up with a "BETTER" endura years ago. It's called the military.
...yeh....I got one too. Tough as all-get-out and cuts like a laser.......light weight, quick to deploy, big secure grip, enough blade for practically any task......just a real workhorse !
Hell-of-a knife ! Whenever I think about the primary purpose of a knife....."to cut"....the Military always comes to mind first.

-regards
 
I understand what you guys are saying. I too liked the penetrate anything look of the E3 blade. The E4 somehow looks blunted. Has anyone done penetration test to see how the E3 and E4 stack up against each other.
I really like the E4 handle redesign. Those liners add a real substantial feel to the knife.:thumbup:

While I don't have an E4, I do have a D4 in SS and just wanted to see how the tip would do against a penny and I was able to drive it through with NO damage to the tip. NONE. At first, I did it with a mallet then I did it by hand(gloved in case of my hand slipping). Same result. About 8years ago, I broke the tip off my FRN Delica at work trying to re-set a fire alarm pull station. Being that I'm off duty right now, I figured I'd try something similar involving some light prying and the blade had no problems. I think the loss in tip is a major up-grade if the knife is going to see any "non-knife" activity at times.
The last couple of "tests" have made me wonder why I've been looking for a heavy-use folder as the D4 has had no problems for anything I would expect from a folder.And it does it at a great price.
 
....having read your response over several times, I have already forgot I wanted to find an Endura 3 !! You need to be writing copy for Sal......and I mean that as a complement in the nicest way, with no hint of sarcasm. It's very persuasive and well communicated. thanks for taking the time to give me your perspective......as well my gratitude to everyone else who gave me their "take". I like you Spyderco guys as much as I enjoy their knives !

-best to all

-regards

Thanks Gramps, I appreciate your kind words. I've seen your posts around a lot and you seem like a cool cat. I do wish Sal would ask me to write copy for him. I'd do it for free. Designing knives is a life-long ambition of mine, and I really look up to Sal and the other folks at Spyderco, because of their design philosophy. (I'm already a professional designer, just not of knives) Spyderco design is thoughtful and pure, which is extremely rare in any manufacturing field and is to be commended. My words about Spyderco are not simple fanboy ass-kissing, I really mean what I say.

But of course, don't take my comments about the 4 to mean that you shouldn't still look for an Endura 3. The 3 is an excellent knife, and if you're a collector you may thank yourself for picking one up while they're still around. It's just that the Endura 4 is better.
 
Thanx much for all of the kind words, especially Moonwilson. We appreciate that some understand and appreciate the effort that we spend in the details of a design. More often than not, most ELUs do not look that closely. It usually takes a closer look and some use time to see.

I've had many conversation with many knife designers and what we do is apparently not common, and many feel is "not really necessary, as most knife buyers purchase by looks".

Many hours went into speaking with our cusomers on "what do you like, what don't you like?" questions.

Many hours were spent in studying that information.

Many hundreds of hours (mine, Eric's & Peter's) went into the D4 & E4 designs. Sizes, weights, thickness, balance, etc. Nothing remained the same.

Many hours with the makers, models, hand carvings, etc. The mold makers, FRN shooters and knife makers all did a commendable job. We appreciate their efforts.

We're glad that you appreciate our offering.

sal
 
Thanx much for all of the kind words, especially Moonwilson. We appreciate that some understand and appreciate the effort that we spend in the details of a design. More often than not, most ELUs do not look that closely. It usually takes a closer look and some use time to see.

I've had many conversation with many knife designers and what we do is apparently not common, and many feel is "not really necessary, as most knife buyers purchase by looks".

Many hours went into speaking with our cusomers on "what do you like, what don't you like?" questions.

Many hours were spent in studying that information.

Many hundreds of hours (mine, Eric's & Peter's) went into the D4 & E4 designs. Sizes, weights, thickness, balance, etc. Nothing remained the same.

Many hours with the makers, models, hand carvings, etc. The mold makers, FRN shooters and knife makers all did a commendable job. We appreciate their efforts.

We're glad that you appreciate our offering.

sal

See? That's what I'm talking about. It does seem that too many designs these days are based upon what looks "cool" or threatening, or "tactical".
Examine the new Boker "Reality Based Blade", the MOD CQD Mark V, or any of the all-too-easy to criticize Dark Ops products. One of the design parameters for all of these knives appears to be that they must look as mean and pointy as possible, which to me is superflous outside of a movie prop. A box or length of cord does not care how mean your knife looks. Wing walk inserts are not going to compensate for poorly thought out ergos in long term use, and they will tear apart anything they rub against. Using quillions as some sort of compliance tool? What about the 7" blade sticking out in front of those quillions- wouldn't that tend to get in the way when grappling with an "adversary"? There are dozens of critiques I could apply to each of these blades, and many more on the market.

The set of design parameters for Spyderco products is short and center around the actual mechanics of efficiently cutting material, and how to efficiently carry and use the cutting device.

The shorter your set of design objectives, the more efficiently each of them can be addressed. Every design, for any product, whether it be a watering can, a hydraulic pump, a toothpaste tube or a knife, has to be a balance of characteristics that address the needs that will make that object useful for its intended purpose.

When you look at any manufactured product, you can see the design goals behind it when looking at the form. A watering can, for example, needs to carry water, and deliver that water to a specific point when tipped. It's form is determined by the above usage goals, along with the requirement to be easily carried, filled and used. The common form of the watering can has been determined by the efficient balancing of all of the above factors, combined with current material and manufacturing technology. If you were to add an additional requirement to the watering can- say, "it needs to whistle when it pours", you add another layer of complexity that can only detract from the purity of the design. A whistle on a watering can would detract from the lines of the design, would add cost in manufacturing, and could get clogged or broken, impeding the intended function. So it's not a good idea to make a watering can whistle, just as it's not a good idea to make a knife look threatening simply from a visual perspective. The more you look at anything, and think about why it is the way it is, the more interesting that thing becomes. Of course, the "look mean" aesthetic is brought about by market forces at work, which more than offsets the damage to the purity of design from a business perspective. Manufacturers are going to make what sells, they are business people after all. They have families to feed, and their employees have families to feed as well. Spyderco is remarkable in that they have mangaged to be very successful while sticking to a purist core design philosophy.

This is the way I look at and think about knives. The more efficiently it achieves what I perceive to be its design goals, the more successful it seems to me, and thus more appealing.
 
Gramps:
It sounds as if your old Endura was older than the 3rd model. If that's the case, exchanging an E4 for an E3, my still not satisfy you.

Darrel
 
I just purchased my very first Spyderco today, it’s a Endura 4 Wave, I absolutely love it!. For a long time my EDC was a Kershaw Leek, infact that was the knife that got me into EDC. For a long time I was wanting a knife very similar to a Leek only larger and I started carrying a Buck 110 around to supplement it. About a week ago my brother asked me to find him a decent knife, infact he wanted my Leek, well that wasn’t going to happen ;) , but I was considering getting another one just for him. I started doing some research and was hearing some good things about Spyderco, how there very ergonomic, easy to open etc.

so I go into this big knife retailer back home, he has Benchmade, Kershaw, Buck, Case, Emerson and of course Spyerdco .. basically all the big names, high dollar and cheapos. I look around he shows me a quite a few, I take my time, I looked at several designs that have “round holes” for opening, but it seemed to me that Spyderco was just better at it, size and placement. I started looking them over and the Endura 4 was offering all the features I liked, Easy to open, a drop point tip (so it doesn’t get broken as easy,) pocket clip, light weight “I was worried that the long plastic handles would be flexible, NOPE! They were rock solid! :) ” then the dealer showed me one of the new Endura 4 Wave models, Holy crap I thought to myself this knife is the size of my buck only lighter and easier to carry, it also has a very similar profile to a Leek!, and after he demonstrated the wave feature a few times, and I was able to try it out for myself I was sold!, about $20 over my budget I was planning on but hey I feel good about the purchase! My brother sure isn’t going to be getting this Spyerdco,….. maybe a different one though after he sees it :D
 
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