Ergonomics

Lorien

Lorien

Nose to the Grindstone
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Knifemaker / Craftsman / Service Provider
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To me, the ergonomic possibilities are enough reason to get a custom, handmade knife over a production knife. This coming from a guy who uses knives in the bush for hours at a time- just to set the context of where I'm coming from:)

For now, my small collection of handmade knives consists of those with practical design, with an emphasis on comfort, and efficiency for its intended tasks.

In order to gain more knowledge on ergonomics in relation to custom knives, I'm hoping that you folks will help by posting pictures or referencing knife makers that you feel take strongly into account ergonomics- that is, designed to maximize efficiency and comfort.

I thank you in advance for your contribution to this thread!:)
 
Burt Foster makes a very comfortable handle. Of course, this is all personal- I've (almost) decided not to buy any more knives unless I've held them first.
 
Lorien said:
In order to gain more knowledge on ergonomics in relation to custom knives, I'm hoping that you folks will help by posting pictures or referencing knife makers that you feel take strongly into account ergonomics- that is, designed to maximize efficiency and comfort.
Click to expand...

I can't speak from the context of custom makers as I only own 1 custom puukko knife, but I do place a strong emphasis on ergonomics when I review a knife. Here are a few things I've noticed in smaller knives used for cutting. Note I generally review folders, but a lot of what's said applies to all sorts of knives and tools in general really.

1. The distance from thumb to point, as well as how far the point drops below the thumb play a big role in tip control.

2. The closer the handle gets your hand to the cutting edge the better. This increases control during cuts and has obvious benefits in regards to leverage.

3. The butt end of the handle is tricky to get right. Having a poorly design shape or a handle that is too short or long can cause discomfort or make your hand not feel supported enough during heavy cuts. Having too much curve where your fingers rest can bite into your hand, having too little will make the knife not feel secure while cutting.

4. Thumb ramps can be very good or very bad. If properly design they work well to enhance cutting control and grip security. If poorly implemented when I try to use them my hand can cramp because of too little space for my grip or I simply won't have anywhere comfortable to place my thumb, causing me to get rid of the knife or reshape the handle.

5. The more specific the handle shape, the less comfortable other grips often are. If a knife is heavily indexed for finger placement and designed solely around saber grip, chances are other grips will lack the high degree of comfort saber grip offers. More general grip shapes like a Mora, SAK, Kershaw Leek or the Spyderco Centofante excel in various grips for this reason.

6. It must be hell as a knife designer trying to make handles that fit the huge range of hand shapes and sizes, finger lengths and grip styles. :D
 
You beat me to it.As i was going to ask the very same question.

Being a new knife maker im curious as to what is a comfy handle for a wide range of people.
The ones ive made for myself are very comfy in my hand,as i can file and sand until its a perfect fit for my hand.

But how to FIT a LARGE range of hands is as of yet unknown to me.

Hopefully this thread will clue me in.

Thanks for posting it !
FOG
 
Jody Samson's knives have some of the best ergo's going, IMO. Balance and feel have always been a high point of his custom knives......

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Another was Sean McWilliams.....

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Tom Maringer did a nice job, too....

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great points Vivi! Thanks for your insights:thumbup:
 
From an ergonomics standpoint, this Fisk would be the top in my collection, and definitely among the most proficient in this area for all medium to large knives I have handled.
Those of you who have handled a Fisk with his trigger style handle know the comfort and control if offers. That combined with the balance and power of this piece makes it quite outstanding from a ergonomics prospective.

Fisk_B07_01-ww.jpg
 
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Love that Fisk, Kevin:D
 
Dawkind; those Sean McWilliams knives are fantasticc! Gotta check his stuff out a bit.
 
lorien....i can tell you from holding them and using some.....two names that immediately come to mind are burt foster and dan farr....both great people to tlk to....excellent bladesmiths and seriously take ergnomics and design into their knives.....ryan
 
I don't have many hunters and this is really the only knife I own with this kind of handle. I have not used it but it feels great. The photo doesn't show the contours of the handle but they are really nice.

Burt Foster from Blade Show.
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First of all, I agree with you completely on the importance of an ergonomic handle design.

Dan Farr did an excellent article for Blade on handle design. It will surprise you not even a little bit to hear from me that his handle designs are superb.

It's not every contoured handle that works well ergonomically - in fact, it's pretty easy to screw things up. Other guys who really nail a contoured handle include Burt Foster, Jason Knight, Nick Wheeler, Bailey Bradshaw and Jerry Fisk (particularly his Woojack and Rojo models). Russ Andrews takes a more subtle appraoch to handle contours, but I have always found his handles very comfortable.

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Roger
 
wow that last fisk is off the charts...i love it...what is that called roger......how could i forget to mention nick wheeler.....the knife i have from him as a very countoured handle...reminds me very uch of jason knight....melts in your hand and u could hold it all day.....ryan
 
I'd like to throw both Matt's into the mix,Lamey and Roberts.
IIRC,Lorien,you have one of Lamey's awesome cutter/choppers.
Palm swells and flared butts do it for me.
As Roger already mentioned,Dan Farr did an excellent article in Blade on handles.

Lamey
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Roberts
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Doug
 
Wow, I'm overwhelmed. I'm going to have to go back and look at all those pictures! Thanks you guys for hooking it up:thumbup:

And I really don't mean to choose favorites, as all the makers mentioned in this thread are exceptional when it comes to the topic at hand, (sorry for the pun:oat least it was puny:rolleyes:) but I have to say that Nick Wheeler and Jason Knight seem to be on another level when it comes to handle design and execution. At least from what I've seen in my cyber journeys.
Maybe one day...:thumbup:

Time for bed. After working 12 straight days 'repairing' department store bikes, with soft tissue damage and a bad attitude, I need to rest up for tomorrow's ride. Why do I do this to myself. I know, I love the pain:)

Can't wait to check this thread out tomorrow, so much great stuff in here! Thanks again, brothers!:)
 
Virtually every knife here is a slightly different approach to one man's designs. The most prolific knife designer of our time. Yet, as I would expect, his name is not mentioned. Shame! If he were a Forging Smith Rather than a blade smith, his name would already dominate smith. Even the different Tom Maringer Vorpal Fighter is his design. Any one here willing to give credit where credit is due?Hint, he was the originator of the palm swell. The fawns foot, sometimes called sheep's foot or as pointed out here, the flared butt. He insist on softly rounded edges so that the knife feels like a part of the users own anatomy. Believing that no part of the knife, from blade tip, to butt should be offensive the the users hand.

Further that finger groves should be avoided whenever possible. Feeling that a knife should not only be able to be comfortable in the classic edge down, or "Whittling grip, but just as importantly, held edge to the side, as in skinning, or edge up. Not to mention the Ice pick grip. He is the most copied maker in the world. I see a myriad of knives at shows all over the globe of his design. With most makers proud proclaiming their own input. Having re-inventing the wheel. With the show goers taking in every work in wide eyed excitement. Never having a clue. I shouldn't blame them. As most makers out there now days don't bother studying what came before. But perfectly willing to reap the benefits of the studies in art follows function, carried on by those who came before. With out a word of credit ever being given where credit is due.

We all owe him a lot. In the last dozen or more cutting competitions I witnessed, each and every grip, or handle there was his designs!

My wish, is that the makers and collectors alike will study the designs, and hopefully gain a bit of knowledge and understanding as to why the designs work. Why they are make the way they are. And be able to look at a Makers knives and really finally know what to look for. Not just what looks crisp, and catchy. But how it feels int eh hand. In all if its intend "using" positions. Not just in front of the Camera, BUT IN THE HAND!!!

Anyone willing to give "The Man" credit?



No One? Any One?

Mike Lovett
 
Bob Loveless is the man you are referring to. Great designer! Took the best aspects of the Marbles hand axe and applied it to knife design. Worked with Thomas Lamb, I believe, and created the two finger groove handle. Would need to check his book for the proper name, but I believe it is something like the Lamb Utility handle.

Having said that, I believe that in the last 20 years, makers have refined, refreshed and modified handle designs, some of them even improving on what Mr. Loveless started. Having handled many of Bob's knives (not as many as you, I'm sure, Mike!) I believe that I have improved upon his handle design in small ways. Some may agree, some not. I'm willing to bet that Bob Loveless felt the same way when he created the handle for the dropped hunter.

Most of my handles still incorporate a palm swell and the drop at the back for pinky leverage. That's all Bob Loveless, no doubt.
 
Well said RJ. I know that Dan credits you with influencing his handle designs, and having put big knives made by both of you to hard use, I can both see it and feel it.

Roger
 
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