Ethics and legality of copying designs

Excellent points, @E.Carlson , and reminds me that the biggest reason I did not hesitate to make the Street Beat upon request (and why I have accepted additional orders for some) is because the knife is not otherwise available (that I could find), and Spyderco discontinued it. But now thinking about it I wonder if M. Perrin is still in the game? Second guessing myself now. If M. Perrin is still making couteaux then I may need to rethink the ethics of agreeing to do any more of them in the future. Of course, I have to fulfill the orders I have already agreed to make, since I don't believe injustice (if it indeed be such to make this knife) is made right by another injustice (backing out of an agreement made in good faith). Questions, questions... :eek: How would I find out if M. Perrin is in fact still working at the bench?
 
Lumanid said:
Hi, what are the general ethics and legalities of copying other people’s knife designs?

- In general, is it looked down upon?
- Does it put someone in potential legal jeopardy for violating intellectual property laws?
- What if you change the design somewhat?
- Are CNC designs considered intellectual property and require permission or licensing to use?

The reason I ask is because there’s a knife maker who made a design that I greatly admire, but it was a custom job so there are none for sale. I’m interested in making my own version.

I’d appreciate any feedback or insight. Thank you.
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If there is nothing patented in the design, and there is no intellectual property stolen- no marking or branding that does not belong to you, there is nothing illegal about copying a design. Ethics are another matter.
 
For personal use you can make whatever you want.

For slipjoint knife companies and makers have been copying each other from the beginning and it is fine.

Many folder makers use Michael Walkers designs and never give him credit, yet they will throw a fit if someone makes a knife that looks like theirs.

Fixed blades have been made for so long some makers just rely on ignorance of people and other makers not recognizing the designs they have borrowed from the past and claim as their own.

You should never intentionally copy a design exactly, be inspired and do your best.

If you ever walk through museums like the Getty, Norton Simon or Huntington Library you will see the Masters often using each other for inspiration and many time doing almost the exact painting time and again.

Some knife makers have delusions of grandeur, I once had a knifemaker claim a Bob Lum blade with a Loveless handle was his intellectual property. When I showed him Bob Dozier had been using that exact combination for years he threw a fit and blocked me.

So do your best and pay homage to those who inspire you.
 
Best practice is to ask if possible and give credit where it's due. I believe Bob Loveless was very free with sharing his designs and didn't mind at all if people wanted to use his patterns.
 
A.McPherson said:
Look a bunch of pics knives you like, then draw a knife afterwards. Then you'll get something of your design, inspired by others.
Nothing illegal about that.
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I've only "designed" a couple of my own blades so far. My basic approach has been to find 2 or 3 different knives with different qualities that I liked and then draw my design and include the qualities I liked. I wind up with a blade that is a nod to a couple others but is still mine to some degree. Inspired by.
 
If it's truly for personal use only, go for it. I wouldn't feel comfortable selling someone else's design without their express permission. I don't want my knives to look like what other people make. People buy my knives because they like MY designs. I enjoy the design process greatly and have no desire to reproduce the designs of others.
 
I got a hold of M. Perrin, and notified him I had made one Street Beat, and had orders for three more. His response was, make the order, cite the design. Problem with ethics of copying a design is big trouble, he said, if customers never contacted me. His advice was don't lock myself into making that copy and find my own design (a common theme! and one I agree with and normally do anyway). Now if I am asked to do a Street Beat in the future, or any design known to be from a particular maker, I will only take the job if the customer is willing to allow some changes to the design so that it is not a carbon copy.
 
Legality, enforced legality and would someone care and ethics are all different things. I think if you stick to the would someone care and ethical side of things you are probably fine. There are probably some biblical quotes that would fit well in here if you are into that. It's sorta simple.

Another way to think about it is that if you are good enough to make a exact copy you probably know whats right and should know what to do and it would be a good idea to do what's right.

If you just want something like something you have seen and want to do your best to have something like it, then your own skill level will probably limit you to being "inspired" with whatever you end up with.

If you make exact copies of someone else's work to benefit from it in a way that hurts them in some way its kinda a scumbag way to do things even if you never receive any legal issues from it.
 
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