Fall shut

R

raymond454

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Jun 10, 2016
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I see much said of folders that are so smooth, they fall shut. It seems to be preferred by many as a sign of quality. Could one make the argument that it's simply a looser (not smoother) action? Wouldn't you think it actually is less safe to have a blade that can catch a finger from drop shutting?
I own several customs with blades that will fall with a very slight assist. I'm not so sure I would want one that free fall and I'm not knocking ones that do. Interested in opinions.
Ray
 
I don’t buy based on action. All else being equal, my preference is a light, smooth shake-shut. I don’t consider guillotine dangerous, because I position my hands to safely close from the start.
 
In my limited experience (mostly just ZT’s) I have gotten a bunch that will fall shut, the 0452 or 0562 is a good example. I feel that if the blade drops shut so easily and quickly that it might be a little loose (or will loosen up after some use). My solution is to tighten em up just a tiny bit so you have to shake the knife once or twice to drop the blade. Just my personal preference tho.
 
My favorite one handed operation is my CRK Inkosis'. I have the pivot tightened so that the blade never rotates by gravity or a light shake alone, no matter how I hold it or even the lockbar being off the blade.

The result is a knife that is still very easy to open and close one handed, with opening and closing both always being the same consistent, controlled action. I like to concentrate on other things than a loose knife blade swinging around.

I have ball bearing flippers and some of them seem to have the lockbar tension weak in order to achieve "drop shut" action, which is detrimental to how I use a folding knife. More lockbar pressure would result in a more secure locking function, better in-handle retention and more controlled closing.
 
I think the fall shut obsession is part of the Shabazz culture in the knife world. for some reason this has been focused on as a performance bar set for folders . IDK I guess it can mean precise tolerances . for me it wouldn't be a deal breaker on a knife at all. I don't really understand the obsession with it. but most people don't understand my obsessions so I accept it and respect those that its important to and leave it at that
 
From a design standpoint there's the issue of a framelock detent that almost acts like a half-stop and if not accustomed to the closing action (which most of the time I'm not with a hundred or so in rotation) on a particular knife closing gets clumsy.
Recently I've been drawn to other than framelocks though and with those I don't mind a drop shut action.
 
I dont mind it on a compression lock such as a pm2 as the way I disengage the lock no fingers are in the way. other knives I dont care for it. bearing knives without flippers to stop it i dislike. just due to how i handle them. not that it cant be done safely.

I dont see it as higher quality myself just it's that way or it isnt.
 
jbmonkey said:
I dont mind it on a compression lock such as a pm2 as the way I disengage the lock no fingers are in the way. other knives I dont care for it. bearing knives without flippers to stop it i dislike. just due to how i handle them. not that it cant be done safely.

I dont see it as higher quality myself just it's that way or it isnt.
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These are my thoughts exactly.
 
If all your folders had drop free blade action it wouldn’t be a big deal, however, if you have knives with both action, then yes, you could be easily bitten. Now, think about the co-worker that wants to check out your new knife and it happens to be one of those free fall blades, what are the chances it’ll bite him despite giving him a warning :eek:. Yeah, I don’t do that any more. I’ve got some free falling blades and I don’t care for them at all. I want to be able use a folder without having to think about whether it’s going to bite me if I don’t pay attention to the action of the blade.
I’ve never equated a free falling blade to quality, but that’s just me.
 
I think that "fall shutty" action tends to be over-rated. I personally like a little bit of resistance to closing in all of my knives, especially if due to a well made detent.

I think that a lot of people mistake "fall shutty" as evidence of precise tolerances rather than letting their eyeballs and fingers demonstrate precise tolerances. It's kind of become a common meme among internet reviewers to demonstrate "fall shutty" to prove quality and it's really meaningless to me. I enjoy knife reviews but find them mostly useless in terms of what I like or don't like.
 
I don't think there's any difference in safety. I've been bitten by both, and in my thinking the knife that's easiest and requires the fewest manipulations to close is going to cause the fewest/least damaging injuries.

That said, I don't care about drop shut actions, but they're at least a little pleasing. What I don't like about them is that they seem to be dependent on low lockbar tension. I like a lockbar that can travel all the way across a blade tang to adjust for wear and provide for more secure lockup.
 
I'm an old dog and not interested in learning new finger tricks. I have muscle memory invested in closing lock backs, slip joints and friction folders, none of which fall shut.

This is a primary reason I don't use frame/liner locks.
 
I definitely don't equate "fall shut" action to quality. I actually prefer a little bit of tension on the closure. CRK is about perfect for me. If I depress the lick bar with some extra force, the blade will gently fall shut. But, I typically never close them this way. I had a ZT 0808 that was a pure guillotine and I ended selling it due to the free falling blade. Just not my style.

I guess I like a blade that will shut gently and fluidly with a little jiggle. But, I don't mind a knife that is tighter.
 
It is not something I look for in a knife. I prefer to control the blade through pressure , though with not a lot of effort.
 
I have seen plenty of knives that when you disassemble them you can see the lockbar won’t go all the way over to 100% in the course of wear because they were trying to get low lockbar tension.

That is less of a problem on knives with steel lockbar inserts due to very long wear life but on a ti faced uncarburized lockbar it is a big issue in my eyes.
 
Lapedog said:
I have seen plenty of knives that when you disassemble them you can see the lockbar won’t go all the way over to 100% in the course of wear because they were trying to get low lockbar tension.

That is less of a problem on knives with steel lockbar inserts due to very long wear life but on a ti faced uncarburized lockbar it is a big issue in my eyes.
Click to expand...

i find this worry of framelocks wearing out very weird.
a lot of people mention it and some do seem to worry about it, but no one ever actually has it happen?

for me it seems rather hard to achive.
i've had my 0920 for a year now, and it's by far my most carried, used and more importantly most flipped knife.
i play with this knife pretty much every day and must flip it at least 100 times a day.
that comes down to around 36.500 flips ( but i would guess closer to 50.000-100.000).
after all this the lockbar is still in the same position as when i got it out of the box, i cannot see any change in lockup %.

it's also the knife with the best action i have ever had and fall shut under it's own weight without any movement or assisting.
 
I could see a fall shut action representing a sign of quality as long as the lockup is solid and there's no blade play in any direction. I wouldn't go as far as saying it's dangerous as long as you're familiar with keeping the slicey part away from your tender bits. My ideal action is to have the blade open/close easily, but stay in the position I leave it (held by the pressure of the detent mechanism) until given a light shake.
 
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