Fantasy knives?

[CUTS LIKE A KRIS]

I really like the whole process of making knives (my finishes suck though). Often I am approached by others who want me to make them a wall hanger, and often they are turned down, usually because it will be too much work for me to make if financially worth my while for the quality of product they will get. However I do want to do the project in order to learn, as I am very new and want to undertake everything I can.

Eventually I want to be more professional about knifemaking and have a website and all of the other trimmings associated with it. I would like to know what the opinions are of having a separate section for wall hangers? Kind of a "Black Tyr Knives Fantasy Relm" or such, where the steel used is not heat treated as a labor saving step. The materials would be stated up front and I would make every effort to not misrepresent the items as actual cutting implements. Would this (in your opinion) hurt my "career" as a legitimate knifemaker, or would the separation bring in more customers, or have no effect. It would not be what I would want to do as the majority of my projects, but just as an opening for another set of choices for my customers, while not tempting me to set off to do something that I am not ready for.

Has anybody else done this with good or bad results?

 

[balibalistic]

Regardless,i would heatreat everything! even if it wont be sharpened.the steel will take a finer finish when hardened,and if bumped or dropped wont dent or bend.

 

[sunshadow]

if it don't cut it aint a knife, simple as that.
if someone wants a fantasy piece I'll make it, and I'll make it sharp. If they do not want to pay for the work they don't gt the knife
ymmv
-Page

 

[Stacy E. Apelt - Bladesmith]

This question is more of personal ethics than business.
Why do quality jewelery stores not carry cheap costume jewelery? Surely they would make more money (It sells at Wally World). - They do not want their customers to confuse the quality of that jewelery with the quality they make and sell.

Same with knives. If you made a piece once in a blue moon ,just for fun, it probably wouldn't do much harm. If you made that kind of stuff on a regular basis, people would start to associate junk with Kris.

Take China for example. They make some good tools, and they make some good knives and swords,too. But the vast majority of the stuff they export is cheaply made. When someone looks at a katana and says, "It is a Chinese sword.", they are assumed to be saying ,"It is junk.".

The real clues here are in your post -
I am very new...
I want to undertake everything...
Eventually, I want to be more professional...
......something I am not ready for...
My finishes suck.....

First thing you need to do is rent "karate Kid" and watch it. There are some good learning skills in that movie.

The worst enemy of a new maker is the desire to do it all. Take one style that you do fairly well. Make mainly that style until you master it.....finish and all.Then branch out into other styles as your mastery becomes more pronounced. This is not a mater of days or weeks, but usually years.

You won't be a new maker forever, but professionalism starts on day one. If you consider , " It is not quite right, but is good enough" to be accaptable.....take up some other hobby. Your skills will improve, but every knife you make should be the best you can make at that point in time. Sadly, professionalism often decreases in many who want to make money at something. Start with a work ethic......Learn with it....and keep it for life. If you end up making money at it, all the better.( But knifemaking is ,usually, not a place to turn for a profitable career)

MY finishes suck...", well..there you have it......you know where you need to be gaining skill, and it isn't in making more types of knives, or by cutting corners.

" Will it hurt my career?..... bring in more customers....confuse my customers....", At this point you don't have a career, and I don't know about how many customers you have, but in my opinion, branching out into cosmetic fantasy weapons would not be the way to get there.

Stacy

 

[Rob!]

Kris

I think it would be fun and something of a specialty niche that might be a fit for you. Having said that, Fantasy blades would be a very bold move for a new maker, particularly with limited equipment.

I would say go ahead and have fun with it, but keep the quality high - ie; the best you can produce at any point in the evolution of your skills. Heat treat, in particular is not that expensive, and if you are using stainless, the corrosion resistance is minimal without heat treat.

Rob!

 

[Bruce Bump]

I say you should make the style of knife that interests you the most. Before long you will be known for that type of knife. It goes without saying that if you do crappy work you will be known for that too.

OK with that being said,

I think there is a niche market ready for a fantasy knife of quality. Look what Gil Hibbon has done.

If its a wall hanger people will see it and handle it. The owner has bragging rights on the high cost. He doesnt want to display a piece of chit on his wall. Let the other customers buy the china junk, we make the "Real Thing". My advice is make it and make it the best you can including the heat treating to the best of your abilities. The early Kris knives may not function superbly but You will soon get better skills and the prices will go up accordingly.

 

[Tad Lynch]

Kris, make what you want to make--but consider the possibility of that knife changing hands. It still has your name on it, and someone might try it out--if left unhardened, your name is associated with a crappy knife. Make sure you are willing to stand behind everything your name goes on.

 

[Dan Gray]

usually because it will be too much work for me to make if financially worth my while

that gives me chills already first and formost
with 1,309 Posts: and a gold membership and have been here with us for most of 3
years now. I wonder why these question now ?
anyway

just to add to the good advice here.. a few more things to build upon

if you like to buy quality tools and know the difference in them and always enjoyed what they can do and have done for you, then common sense will answer most those questions for you..

if you are not in that category to help you be more rounded
find a maker that will take you under his wing and one that is making it in the trade and learn from him, that will guide you a long business wise and other wise. read everything you can find then ask for opinions, anyone that says "this is the only way to do IT " will limit you.. please find someone else to play with most of the time he can teach you things but
don't believe everything you hear, try it, test it, learn it, see for yourself, what may work for someone else may not work well for you.. but it's not a bad thing to know other makers ways to build yourself upon..
part of why I mention above is due to
it's very important to learn the business end of this if you want to make money in this TRADE,, many a Good man has gone down the tubes not being able to handle money there or the lack of it..
Once you feel you know it, you've just stopped learning..
good luck and learn well on your journey it's a fun and interesting one at the very least.

 

[CUTS LIKE A KRIS]

Thanks for the opinions all. I had a (probably) confusing, long drawn out post that was erased due to loosing internet signal when I posted so I'll try to explain myself better.
I try to please everybody and hate to turn people down. I have had to many times as what people are asking for is beyond my skill level. My thoughts for the "fantasy division" (poor term perhaps) was to offer a low cost alternative for those that want a wall hanger/trainer... of their idea but cannot/will not afford high prices for something of the kind.
I do believe that if it not made with quality materials then it is a knife shaped object, but that seems to be what many people want. From what I have been asked to do it seems that there is a lack of the middle range for items. I have many friends in the martial arts that want a quality trainer or reasonable facsimile of a weapon that is not made from tin, but is not a $1000 item either.
I will still put out each item to the best of my ability, finish and overall quality wise, regardless of what I do, as that is the only way to improve myself and that is what I am truly after, not riches or fame. I do this for the fun of the hobby and as a way to advance our passion into more mainstream acceptance, usually by winning over the ladies, who seem to be more accepting of it than most "urban" men that I meet. I am going back to school in the fall as a massage therapy so I do not see knifemaking to be a future full time job, but am working at deciding what business path I want to take in order to become at least a self sustaining hobby where what I sell helps to pay for what I make.

Sorry if this is just incoherent rambling, I am fairly medicated to to my surgery last week and just wanted to try and clarify my position on things.

Thanks all
Kris

 

[Rob!]

that is what I am truly after, not riches or fame....

I like when you are medicated Kris. If you are quite sure you don't want the riches, you have my address and I will dispose of them to the best of my ability - for my sedated friend.

Rob!

 

[Dan Gray]

I have many friends in the martial arts that want a quality trainer or reasonable facsimile of a weapon that is not made from tin, but is not a $1000 item either.
I will still put out each item to the best of my ability, finish and overall quality wise

That my freind is called a niche for yourself if you can make trainers and make reasonable money from it..depending on what you consider reasonable.. go for it.. but remember, the materials in a well made knife is a minimal part of it, so why down grade an otherwise good knife ? and make so much less for it for a few bucks saved ? I'd have to ask of myself..

you said before ( worth your time ) with this said and sticking in my mind ( what's left of it ) , then saying I will still put out each item to the best of my ability.. the two seems at odds to me. but I know what you mean, just for the fact that you are relatively new to selling and making, it's a bit confusing right now for you but
it will come in time with open ears and once knowing what you want in making knives..

I'd like to add, concerning prices which seems to be a concern but not enough concern IMO,, kind of...
we all would like to get top dollar for our works but to do so in most cases you do have to achieve a certain amount of fame hence the so called paying your dues go hand in hand with the trade.. but then some times if you are well enough known it seems that this situation can sell knives better than the quality of work itself ... so why does this happen?

is it a trust issue , hey he must be good everyone knows him,, or
he must be good, look at the web presents he has, or
he is famous,, I just have to have it,,, maybe it will worth more later on in time?
fame
could be just a small part of it or a very big part of it.. it depends..

but most of all IMHO
it's just seems to be a fact that if you can show to be consistent in your work, do good work, show your work, and you have an artful ability and it shows in your work you will pick up buyers that like seeing you in your art and your art it self.. some will like it some won't , there is a lot of buyers out there,, first and for most though if no one sees your work you for sure will not sell your work.. it's all in a well rounded recipe to work well..
I say this stuff just for information to think about and nothing more.. just one opinion