Feather damascus hunter, african blackwood frame handle (damascus making pics added)

[Bama]

That damascus us stunning, That is some of the best feather pattern I have seen, love the knife also

 

[Manuel Quiroga G.]

Thanks!

I forgot I had some pictures of the damascus making process, so here they are:

 

[betzner]

Do you use stabilized woods for your handles?

 

[Knifeologist]

Very nice, clean lines.

 

[canineforge]

Great looking hunter. Nice feather and the wooden frame adds some flair. I like the result. :thumbup:

- Joe

 

[betzner]

Perhaps it's because I don't have a great affinity toward damascus that I am focusing on the handle materials, while everyone else is praising the beautiful damascus.

But isn't something rather important being overlooked here? Here we have a blackwood frame and blackwood scales that appear to have some checking. No one had questioned whether the wood was stabilized or not.

And it's not. I don't quite understand why what is arguably a gorgeous hunk of damascus has been paired with wood that will more than likely change because of lack of stabilization. New collectors take note - you had better be asking this question if you ever buy knives with wood handles.

 

[canineforge]

Wooden framed handles are not the norm, but I like the way this turned out. Some maker input will show up I am sure, but it is my understanding Africian Blackwood is used quite often without being stabilized. More stable than ebony, I believe. Every wood has its own properties that are unique. I know that ringed gidgee does not need to be stabilized, but some makers do so to cut down on the dust while shaping.

If it were mine, and knowing the blackwood wasn't stabilized, I would treat it like ivory and give it a little more care than others.

- Joe

 

[B . Buxton]

Joe Your are correct, I talked to professional stabilizer about getting some African Blackwood stabilized and he told me African Blackwood was not a real good canidate for the stabilizing process because of the natural oils in it. He told me it wouldn't hurt it and that it may benefit from it some but for the most part African Blackwood was quite stabile as is. Myself, I now don't use any woods including African Blackwood that aren't stabilized except for Ironwood and gidgee because I like to remove as many of the possibilities of movement as I can BUT I have used African Blackwood that was not stabilized in the past and never have had any issues ever being reported back to me.
I do agree with Betzner, that all knife purchasers should inquire about the wood handle materials and if they would benefit from professional stabilizing, if the answer is yes and it hasn't been stabilized I would order one with stabilized wood rather then buy one without. But let me make this clear, not all woods benefit from being stabilized. The best advice is to be knowledgeable of what your buying, and that goes for everything, not just knives.

 

[Manuel Quiroga G.]

I was pretty sure that blackwood wasn't stabilized, but I didn't know why, thank you Bill for the info.

Buy the way, as I see it, if a wooden scale is gonna move it will move whether it has a steel frame, wooden frame or a full tang. In fact if the frame is the same piece of wood I think they will move "together".

 

[Manuel Quiroga G.]

I don't mean that that will neutralize any potential movement but I don't think it will be worst than other handle material that moves over a regular tang or metal frame.

 

[betzner]

Wooden framed handles are not the norm, but I like the way this turned out. Some maker input will show up I am sure, but it is my understanding Africian Blackwood is used quite often without being stabilized. More stable than ebony, I believe. Every wood has its own properties that are unique. I know that ringed gidgee does not need to be stabilized, but some makers do so to cut down on the dust while shaping.

If it were mine, and knowing the blackwood wasn't stabilized, I would treat it like ivory and give it a little more care than others.

- Joe

My experience is that ebony moves the least, and I agree that a great wood to use is blackwood, for the same reasons. I really didn't want to get into the geographics of this issue, but see I should.

If the blackwood is harvested/coming from an equatorial area, ie, a very humid location and takes up residence in a much less humid location (ie, coming from South America to the US), the probability of stability over time is a bit diminished. In fact, expect some movement. This is from direct experience I've had with knives from South America where the wood moved more than one would like to see - wood that wasn't stabilized. And I know I am not the only forumite who has experience with issue, too.

I really didn't intend to bring the issue of geographics up, but obviously it's necessary here in this case. Collectors need to know what to expect.

 

[pap11y]

Thanks for sharing the pics. That's just awesome..

 

[B . Buxton]

Manuel , I hope you don't think I was saying anything negative about this wonderful knife. I think its a fantastic piece as I posted earlier in this thread. I wouldn't be afraid to use African Blackwood on any knife I make, stabilized or not just as long as it was well seasoned.


Betzner, I've found just about any material will move if taken from one extreme to another. I once sent a knife with canvas micarta to the northwest territories, took it 3 weeks to get there and when it did the micarta had shrunk terribly, something I would have never throught possible. The buyer contacted me and I told him to send it back, when I received it the pins were really proud but after about 2 weeks on my dresser they were flush again.

I apologize Manuel for side tracking your tread. I didn't mean for that to happen.

Bill

 

[betzner]

Manuel , I hope you don't think I was saying anything negative about this wonderful knife. I think its a fantastic piece as I posted earlier in this thread. I wouldn't be afraid to use African Blackwood on any knife I make, stabilized or not just as long as it was well seasoned.


Betzner, I've found just about any material will move if taken from one extreme to another. I once sent a knife with canvas micarta to the northwest territories, took it 3 weeks to get there and when it did the micarta had shrunk terribly, something I would have never throught possible. The buyer contacted me and I told him to send it back, when I received it the pins were really proud but after about 2 weeks on my dresser they were flush again.

I apologize Manuel for side tracking your tread. I didn't mean for that to happen.

Bill

And what we are, indeed, dealing with are the extremes, when discussing the geographic differences. New collectors need to know that if wood is selected as a choice, the collectors have a choice to require stabilization if they wish to protect their investment. This is an educational issue, but seems to be taken more as an argument for or against something. It's not. It's educating collectors, which doesn't seem to be happening here otherwise.

I, too, am sorry this is derailing this thread. It could have been avoided with a simple answer to my original simple question in post #23.

 

[Manuel Quiroga G.]

Bob and Bill, I don't mind the side tracking.
I'm sorry Bob I couldn't answer before, on sundays I can not be online all the time, its family day
I'm glad this came up, never imagine a material like micarta could shrink.

Thank you pap11y for your words.

 

[canineforge]

New collectors need to know that if wood is selected as a choice, the collectors have a choice to require stabilization if they wish to protect their investment.

Bob has a valid point and I didn't mean to take away from it in my post. As he and Bill point out, it is imperative to know your materials as well as possible when investing in custom knives. A lesson for all of us.

- Joe

 

[betzner]

I'm glad this came up, never imagine a material like micarta could shrink.

Thank you pap11y for your words.

Bill and Manuel, the micarta story was worth the price of admittance to the thread! Man, try as hard as we do to keep problems away from our knives, and to find out even micarta can suffer, WOW!

Best,

Bob

 

[Turtlecreekknives]

Well done! You can't beat them scales. And interesting pattern on the Damascus. I like it!

Tanner-TurtleCreekKnives

 

[B . Buxton]

Thats the only time I ever had a problem with micarta moving, but I've not sent any more knives with micarta to the northwest territories either. As you stated Bob, we can try to do our best when it comes to preventing materials from moving around, but extreme changes can even cause unexpected problems. I'm a strong believer in taking every precaution available to prevent problems and I know other knifemakers do too, but sometimes even the best intentions have problems. The best advice I can give is, talk to a professional stabilizer and see what they suggest, they will be able to tell you what woods benefit from their processes and what woods don't.

Bill