Fighting the super steel tide?

I admit a great fondness for S30V, but VG10 is fine, and all of my most recent knives have been 440C, 12C27, or good old 1095 or 1084.
 
SilverFoxKnows said:
Even ATS-34 can be a pain to reprofile without diamonds. I can't imagine reprofiling CPM S90V.
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Use an x-coarse SiC waterstone, it easily reprofiles S90V and does it faster than diamond abrasives. There is no steel that needs a belt sander for sharpening, and any small utility blade can have the edge recut from 20 to 10 and sharpened in under five minutes with waterstones. ZDP-189 is no exception and it takes an edge readily on natural chinese waterstones which is one of the oldest known sharpening abrasives.

Esav Benyamin said:
Given the uses we have for an ordinary pocket knife, anything from 440A or AUS-6 is fine. Moving up to 440C or AUS-8 means the edge will get slightly sharper and hold slightly longer.
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It isn't about getting sharper, the difference in sharpness is only really evident to people like Clark and those who strive for shaving above the skin sharpness. The main advantage of better steels is to allow knives to cut better as you can run more acute cross sections. This is of benefit even if you use a knife sparingly because it reduces the force required which makes the cuts more stable which makes the knife safer to use besides the fact that the cutting is easier. The additional edge retention is of benefit as well, how much so depends on how much cutting you do and how sharp you like your knives.

-Cliff
 
1095, 52100B, A2,D2, M2, and 440C or better in SS all have worked very well for me.
I don't care for AUS-6, AUS-8, or that cr*p SS that Case uses
 
One of these days all our steel knives will go the way of the horse-and-buggy.

It has already happened in the medical field and it is just a matter of time before it will filter down to we knife users.

What will be the replacement knife be you ask?

It will be a very small but powerful laser beam button knife with an extremely narrow cutting width and an adjustable beam length of between 1.99 (legal in Calif) inches to about 10-12 inches for the Bowie guys.

It will never get dull and will cut much quicker than anything we have today. Yes it will shave arm hair above the skin. They will split hair if you care to hold it while splitting.

So hang onto your steel knives as they will be worthwhile some day in antique auction sales.
 
DGG said:
What will be the replacement knife be you ask? It will be a very small but powerful laser beam button knife
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Nothing that requires a battery is ever going to replace a physical blade for casual use. Supplement, possibly. Replace, not likely.

I do expect that materials science will continue to give us better and better blades, though.

--Bob Q
 
When they come out with a pocket light sabre I'll consider that over my folder. I envision something with an adjustable beam that can be from 1" up to 6" in length or perhaps even from 1" or less to sword length. It would be kind of nice to be able to replace tools like my chain saw with it come cutting season for fire wood. I guess it would replace my log splitter also since I could just do both with the sabre right?

I guess it would be fine until you went to slice an apple and ended up cutting the kitchen counter in half. :D
 
I got along fine for years and years with my old Sears Craftsman stockman, a Schrade LB7, and Queen Cutlery Big Chiefs for commercial diving. It wan't until I found this place that I got interested in what the actual steel was. To be honest, I like my Boker carbon blade stockman and my Vic Tinker just fine too. Though I have a D2 mini-grip and a few other BM's in 154cm, I don't mind "lesser" steels. They get sharp, handle everything I need to cut and hold an edge fine.

It's all personal preference anyhow, get what works for you and be happy.
 
There are people who can't sharpen 440A or softer steels. So They shouldn't make knives from harder steels because some people might not be able to sharpen them? Assuming most people can't sharpen their knives to begin with, a knife with a modern super steel that will hold an edge longer than something with 440A, or some other cheap steel, would be a plus wouldn't it?

I haven't come across a steel I can't sharpen. With an EdgePro with it's aluminum oxide stones (some say they cut faster than diamond), it makes short work of super steels.
 
DGG said:
One of these days all our steel knives will go the way of the horse-and-buggy.

It has already happened in the medical field and it is just a matter of time before it will filter down to we knife users.

What will be the replacement knife be you ask?

It will be a very small but powerful laser beam button knife with an extremely narrow cutting width and an adjustable beam length of between 1.99 (legal in Calif) inches to about 10-12 inches for the Bowie guys.

It will never get dull and will cut much quicker than anything we have today. Yes it will shave arm hair above the skin. They will split hair if you care to hold it while splitting.

So hang onto your steel knives as they will be worthwhile some day in antique auction sales.
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I agree with you, but I think that day is far off. The technology for a pocket "light saber" may be near, and it may not be long before the price is low enough to make it practical. But knife owners tend to be a traditional bunch, so I think knives will be around for a very long time just because of the tradition and history of them. I can only speak for myself, but I think a lot of the people here will agree: Even if a light saber hit the market tomorrow, cost the same as a cheap knife, and worked perfected as we all invision it, I would still buy steel knives at the same rate. I *would* be standing in line for that light saber, though :P

Plus, a steel knife can pry, turn screws, dig, pick etc... while a light saber cannot.

Perhaps we will see steel knives with a light saber integrated into the handle?

I don't mean to argue. I agree with what you are saying. But because of the tradition and "cool factor" of steel knives, I don't think they will fade away to collector-only status in my lifetime no matter how far technology progresses.
 
I think it is great, that we have the opportunity to try out all these different steels. I think the problem is more with the consumer not with the steel. There is no such beast as THE PERFECT STEEL. But you can optimize the material for a specific application.

And for the record: ZDP is not hard to sharpen, rather the exact opposite. I love the ZDP stuff precisely because it sharpens just like a highly hardened HC steel...beautiful!
 
I have succumbed to demand and I make knives from 1095/1084/D2/ATS34/RWL34/BG42/CPMS30V. However, for my own purposes (and apparently many others agree, too) I have never found the need to go past a well-made blade of O1 carbon steel. Heck, when my test choppers of O1 steel can routinely whack 5x pine 2x4's and still shave, why do I need more. ? (PS.- this is with fairly basic heat treat methods - Any knifemaker can do it, not just me...)

For me, resharpening is a major issue. No matter what the steel, ALL knives eventually need to be resharpened. A knife is supposed to be a basic / bottom-line concept tool. If you simply can't sharpen your knife it ceases to be, and becomes a pry bar... My 2 cents and then some. ;) Jason.
 
I may have to invest in some quality waterstones. Right now I've got a Sharpmaker (good) and some nameless benchstones from Home Depot (not as good). The Sharpmaker took a while to thin out the ATS-34. And I'm still getting the hang of sandpaper and mousepad. I'm a long way from being a sharpening guru.

Frank
 
The Sharpmaker is a nice way to microbevel, and fairly versatile in what it can sharpen due to the nature of the stones. However for actually changing the angle of an edge it is really inefficient. With the correct grade of waterstone you are looking at the nature of 100:1 speed improvement in reprofiling.

-Cliff
 
Two of my all time favorites are 12c27 and 440C. I put a point back on a friends BM Bali before I knew what one was. I used a file and swept it back and made a pretty good point. Then I sharpened it. I also sharpened my Buck at the same time. The difference in the edge was amazing. I later found out the steel of the bali was 12c27. I was dissappointed when BM switched on the 42. I tried the Random Task when they first came out. That was a good edge holder, in 440V (CPM S60V now I think). When it finally got dull, I reprofiled it on 220 grit sandpaper, and touched it up on the sharpmaker until I sold it. I dropped it in a concrete floor in a freezer and broke about 1 mm of tip off. Took about 2 minutes to grind back and sharpen. I am now leaning toward O1 and whatever Cold Steel used for Carbon V about 10 years ago. The only problem is the edge will rust away on these if you're not careful. VG-10 is nice on my Delica, AUS-8 on a Cold Steel or BM Ambush is fine as well. The knife that took the longest to sharpen was a Cold Steel Safekeeper. The add says "ground extra thin." I'd hate to see what a thick edge looked like. The edge geometry seems to make the most difference in sharpening time for me. Thin edged cut better, longer and sharpen easier in terms of folders. Bigger knives and hard use folders/survival knives may need more metal at the edge, but I dont beat up my folders. Ok, there was once I used a BM Ares to cut sheet metal by batoning w/ an axe head, and the other day I used a TSEK to chip a weld. I'd say for me, 12c27 and up work fine. I really noticed a difference in edge holding on the 440V. 1095 works great, if it can be kept from rusting at the edge, although I think it could be a bit harder than most commercial makers run it, because the knives I have with it tend to have the edges roll fairly quickly. I'm really impressed by the Cold Steel Carbon V Scalper I bought for $15. 440A and AUS 6 tend to loose their edges a little too quick for my taste, but they will still work for a couple of weeks w/o needing sharpening, I just tend to use them lighter.
 
I'm fine with a lot of different steels, but my favorites for now are 1095, D2, AUS8, VG-10 and S30V. These steels will do everything I really need them to do, but I'm always looking for something better. ZDP might be the answer, but I haven't tried it yet.
 
One of these days all our steel knives will go the way of the horse-and-buggy.

It has already happened in the medical field and it is just a matter of time before it will filter down to we knife users.
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Not at the hospital where I work.
The metal-blade scalpel is alive and well, as are medic-scissors, bone saws, and cast saws.

We do use lasers but only for a very small percentage of cases.
The scalpel is used everyday.

Allen.
 
As long as the harder steels are sandwiched warikomi-style with a softer steel they aren't hard to sharpen simply because the hard part of the blade is thin. I believe the Calypso is that way and the upcoming Delica will be that way. It's too expensive to make a blade from solid ZDP-189 for a machine made knife.

I sharpen solid shirogami carbon steel blades all the time. They are hardened to about RC64 or so. I don't find them particularly difficult any more than I do the ZDP/Cowry type steels that are sandwiched.

To answer your question, there is nothing wrong with 440C as a knife blade material so the super steels are hardly necessary. I doubt VG-10 will go out of style any time soon. It is a good solid product for knife blades - one of the best.
 
I really need to hone my sharpening skills (sorry about that ;)). Several years ago, I didn't even know the difference between carbon steel and stainless steel, and I thought that stainless steel couldn't get dirty, hence the name stainless.

Now, I'm dismayed about my Buck Stockman and Buck Cadet having 420hc steel. I've really pared down my collection, and really like the knives I have left, which include my Spydercos and Benchmades. I really like the H1 on my Pac Salt, and the 154CM on my Apparition, but I haven't used them for any hard tasks.

I don't hunt, I haven't put my fishing knives through the hard paces yet, and I haven't really used my knives for chopping, except for my Cold Steel kukri machete. I use mine to open boxes, clean my fingernails, as a utility in my truck, and basically I could get by with 420hc. I like carbon steel better because it is easier to sharpen, although that might just be my novice sharpening skills.

That still hasn't stopped my buying. In the past 8 months, I've sold or traded off most of my collection and have gone for more expensive production and custom knives, that suit my perceived needs, and that is fine with me. I keep on trying not to become a steel snob, but I think that wanting a better steel is fine.
 
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