First false edge attemp

blgoode said:
I have 2 knives of this shape so I hate to keep them all for me.........how do we go about deciding what to sell anyways :D
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I had a simple rule: if it was essentially free of flaws like that divot, it got sold. If it was nice except for a ding, I kept it. If the ding bothered me too much, it got trashed.

I'm sure most all knifemakers have a few more "shop knives" than they ever need! :)

Does the formation of the "clouds" have something to do with torch heating? Cause alloy banding or something? I've never used a torch for hardening, only for drawing the spine.
 
Fitzo,

I am not sure what exactly c auses the clouds. If you look the cloud formations only occure where the steel has been heated. My guess is that this is part of the cell structure or the hokus pokus of that crystaline....."stuff" that happens to make the steel hard. Fitzo - from what I have read here on the forums you can tell me better what that is.

I think its nothing more than the etch eating hard material (black) away and when I hit it with 1500 grit it highlights the light part.

What I will do is start making a mental note of what color and how far up the blade is glowing while I am hting. Then compare the blade to my notes after etch.

Mark - What else would a young pup use to HT easy but a torch :D I just need not have those "burn bumps" from over heating and I am in the clear.

I need to show you what I am doing at tackrock....will they have a o/a set there? I hate to drive with combustables but I could bring them?? Dont know if it would really help or not....I do want to look at the HT coloring with you as far as daylight coloring. I dont have enough experience to judge temp and color without shutting the shop doors.......

Sounds like an STD - I got the burn bumps :D :D
 
Brian, do you heat the edge with the torch or is the "clouds" the area the torch is hitting? Do you use propane torch or oxy/acetylene? And, finally, do you get the whole blade to non-mag, or just the edge portion, and then "edge quench"?

Sorry to be a PITA, but I find that an intruiging effect. I've HT'd any number of forged O-1 blades, but since my methods are different, I've never experienced that effect.

I wish someone like mete would offer an explanation or conjecture........

Thanks, Brian, for answering my questions. :)
 
blgoode said:
how do we go about deciding what to sell anyways :D
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once you make another, you like better, you sell the others :D

fix her up it will make good practice on other stuff you can play with too.
fit and finish and you get to monkey around with differant things without feeling to bad about it if you mess up more.. you can alway give it to a buddy to TEST IT OUT for you.. :D .

once you get good time wise you'll say
dang another hour and a half down the drain :grumpy: :D
 
Fitzo - I start with the fluffy part (orange) portion of the o/a torch hitting the top 1/3 and just behind the ricasso area. I heat the whole blade some to try to minimise any worpage but I dont let any portion of the blade get hot enough to glow except for the lower portion twords the edge. Now when I say glowing I dont mean twords the orange side of things. Once the bottom half gets a little red then I start the flame moving along the cutting edge but closer in distance so the heat is hotter than the fluffy red portion. I guess around 1" or so. It really depends on how thick the steel is.....

When just the cutting edge area gets to non magnetic......I judge by color but I do use a mag. some.......I quench in preheated oil. The whole blade not just the edge. Since the edge is in the critical area its the only portion that will ge hard. I let it sit in the oil and then check with a file.......

That sums it up... I want to get better at controling the temper but at this point I am more focused on getting everything an even heat and let the temper line happen where it may.
 
Thanks, Brian. I'm hoping we can get mete to comment on what's giving that appearance to the blade. I'm quite intruiged.
 
Takes a while for me to translate things like 'fluffy ' part of the flame !! Alloy banding is caused in the early stages of making the steel, undesirable from the steel makers point of view. It cannot be produced by heat treating.....With O-1 you start out with sheroidized annealed material.From the desciption the spine is not heated above the critical so that stays spheroidized.So he is differentially hardening by austenitizing and quenching the edge and of course the edge will be tempered [I assume he tempered]martensite.The transition zone is going to be more complex .He's going to have partially dissolved carbides which would give low carbon martensite and perhaps pearlite .If there was any alloy banding that might accentuate it.And of course each different structure would act differently polishing and etching. Looks nice though !
 
Sorry about my descriptions :D but its hard to describe certain things :D

Thanks Mete for trying to clear it up for Fitzo.

Yes I am tempering after HT. I have a whole new batch to ht sometime this week so I'll document everything as well as I can...see if I can learn to control the transition line :confused:
 
Thanks, mete!!! Appreciate your explanation. With a chemistry background, metallurgy intruiges me. Obviously the differences between metals and organic molecules are sufficient to make my knowledge base nearly useless. I'm working on it, and find examples like this add much to my understanding.

Thanks, both of you, Brian and Robert, for putting up with my questions! :)
 
Thanks for everyone being patient with my descritpions :D :D

You guys are very helpful and I am glad something I am doing is helping others learn as well...who'd ah thunk it?
 
Engrave over it? Or run a small groove all the way from the point, tapering as you go then it should take out the ding. Either way it dosent look that bad, it certainly does'nt warrant thinking about not finishing it up.
 
BL,

There is no hocus-pocus to the steel or your heat treating. It is true that the steel, being man made, possibly could not be consistant about its area but usually trust that it is and the rest is physics, which is flawless in consistancy. I may be behind current events but aren't you still austenitizing O1 with a torch?

I vote you the most acheived beginning knife maker since my joining BF and I sincerely believe you not investing in more expensive HT equipment would be a disservice to yourself and others.

RL
 
Looks pretty good to me, I love the hamon, lots of activity there. If your worried about a little bobble here and there, switch to a corse grit sand paper and re-define it and go from there hand finishing, doesn't take as long as you'd think, though it is a pain in the wrist!
 
RL - yes I am still using 0-1 and an O/A torch to HT. I thought about getting / building a heat treat oven BUT - after some research there are a few makers that I look up to that strictly ONLY use the same set up as myself. I will in time get some other HT equipment. What would you recomend?

Oh yeah :D Ii was just teasing about the hokus pokus :D :D
 
rlinger said:
BL,

There is no hocus-pocus to the steel or your heat treating. It is true that the steel, being man made, possibly could not be consistant about its area but usually trust that it is and the rest is physics, which is flawless in consistancy. I may be behind current events but aren't you still austenitizing O1 with a torch?

I vote you the most acheived beginning knife maker since my joining BF and I sincerely believe you not investing in more expensive HT equipment would be a disservice to yourself and others.

RL
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Hey hey leave that O/A alone pick on Butane :eek: :D :D
 
Or the gas from Outback....Man that was brutal Sunday morning!! :D :D
 
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