First Knife Project - multiple threads merged

Hey zingo156,

It's your design. I only smoothed out a couple of lines that were unnecessarily complex. A lot of times distilling your idea down to it's simplest and most elegant form is the answer. And that's all I was suggesting to you. I don't say that my suggestions are the way to go or that it doesn't need additional refinement. That is for you, the artist to determine. It was more of a suggestion of how to look at your drawing when trying to see what your design needs or doesn't need. Always ask yourself why. Why does that line need to be like that? What purpose does that feature or line shape serve? If you can't find an answer to that question, or if the answer is "it doesn't need to be like that" then change it. Just remember that whatever you make has to work comfortably in a human hand. If it is an awkward shape it will likely feel awkward in the hand. If the edges have pointy areas or sharp direction changes it will likely cause hot spots on your hand in use. There is a reason the vast majority of handles have shapes or features in common. Don't try to reinvent the wheel. That said there is still room for creativity and innovation. If you can combine practicality and comfort with some style you are doing fine.
 
Grind it before heat treating but make sure you leave the edge thick enough. The thickness of a quarter should be fine. Grind, file, sand the rest after HT. With your limited experience you may overheat the blade and ruin the temper if trying to grind the whole thing after heat treatment. If you don't have proper equipment for the heat treat you can send it out as you know. Clint Eastwood said it best, "a man's got to know his limitations". Like I suggested in your other thread, think about putting large blades aside for now. Get some smaller ones under your belt before tackling a big knife. A small knife will be plenty of a challenge for you at this point.
 
I started out with a Grizzly grinder, and at 3450 rpm it was, IMHO, way too fast for a beginner.

Tim
 
Thanks guys! I think I may start on a smaller knife. I also think I might use a file. Any recommendations for brand name files. The files I have suck, the last time I tried to file some weld splash off a bolt it took forever and ended up pulling out the dremel which took all of 2 seconds. My files are worn out and dull. Copy on the Grizzly being too fast.
 
The blade shape from your link looks pretty cool.

Seriously though. A big camp chopper in 3\8? Holy balls heavy.

Post a pic though I'm sure it could look bad a**.
 
Thanks!

I like the look as well. I really wanted this to be heavy. I have been using an Ontario RD9 the 1/4" thick version as a camp chopper. It cuts ok, but not quite well enough. I wanted this new one to be at least 32oz finished possibly more. I guess I will find out the weight when I am done with it. I have not yet begun cutting it out but plan on starting later today or this week. I will probably use my dremel since I have the more accuracy with that than my angle grinders. I also bought some new 12" files, (I may file this knife instead of use a belt sander), that likely means loads of time and blisters but with a file jig I think I can get the most accurate bevel and since I am a complete noob, a file being slow should minimize mistakes. Hopefully I have this done by summer 2015. I will be sharing pics when I have it cut out and likely along the way for others to tune in and help out.
 
I would bet you cook that dremel before you get anywhere near cut to shape. I would rough it out with the angle grinder and then clean up with files. On stock that thick a dremel will not be effective at all.
 
zingo156 said:
Thank you both for your replies. The steel says it is annealed, definitely not hardened, there are instructions for the exact methods for critical, quench, and then HT. Angle grinder it is! I will likely leave about 1/16" steel on all the edges I can so I can touch it up with a grinder with a few different grits. By the way if anyone is interested, I have posted the pics of my idea of the blade design drawn on the steel. http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/s...awn-on-steel-Open-to-suggestions-and-critique

I really appreciate the help.
Click to expand...

Looks like a Busse FBM.......Be aware the "Talon Hole" behind the Choil is a Busse trade mark item....don't get into hot water even if you think it looks cool.....
 
Grayzer86 said:
I would bet you cook that dremel before you get anywhere near cut to shape. I would rough it out with the angle grinder and then clean up with files. On stock that thick a dremel will not be effective at all.
Click to expand...

I had the same thought, I have some new 4 and 1/2 cutting wheels on order. You might be surprised what I have cut through with a dremel. I could get it done with my dremel but it would take forever and probably would cost $50 in cutting wheels...
 
Busto said:
Looks like a Busse FBM.......Be aware the "Talon Hole" behind the Choil is a Busse trade mark item....don't get into hot water even if you think it looks cool.....
Click to expand...

~You got it: The Busse FFBM is what I was looking at while drawing my handle. The FFBM is a knife I love the look of but I don't feel like paying $1300 for (more like can't or the lady friend might snap my neck), don't get me wrong, if I had the extra cash to burn through I would buy one.

Would I get in trouble if this is a personal use knife only? It will not be sold. If I ever make my own knives to sell, they will not use that "Talon Hole". I do not wish to get into legal trouble over a personal knife. I did think about removing that hole.
 
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zingo156 said:
~You got it: The Busse FFBM is what I was looking at while drawing my handle. The FFBM is a knife I love the look of but I don't feel like paying $1300 for, don't get me wrong, if I had the extra cash to burn through I would buy one.

Would I get in trouble if this is a personal use knife only? It will not be sold. If I ever make my own knives to sell, they will not use that "Talon Hole". I do not wish to get into legal trouble over a personal knife. I did think about removing that hole.
Click to expand...

I don't believe Jerry will come after you for a personal use knife...however there is that 1 in a million chance that someone offers you the "Kings Ransom" for the knife you just finished
and its the one with the "Talon Hole"...Do you lose a possible sale that puts enough cash in your hand for that new grinder or is just enough to pay for that Heat treat oven....I think if you go
through with the build and don't put the talon hole there you are in fact building "YOUR" dream blade not copying theirs....:thumbup:

I have a FFBM Wicked Chopper!!!!!
 
I found a thread about it here: http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showthread.php/273449-Talon-holes-Trademark-of-Busse

Jerry Busse said:
YES, the lower front guard hole is a REGISTERED TRADEMARK of Busse Knife Co.

When we discuss legal matters with other manufacturers we prefer to handle these issues in a private and professional manner.

I can tell you that ALL of the manufacturers who have used the mark and who were contacted by us, have been very cooperative in removing the mark from there product line. In all cases thus far, the behavior of the gentlemen contacted has been commendable.

Some of the manufacturers that were mentioned in this thread as still using the mark, DO NOT continue to use our trademarked guard hole.

Jerry
Click to expand...

I think I may just remove it. I planned on using the hole to help keep the knife in the sheath though... Back to the drawing board.
 
zingo156 said:
Thanks for the info Busto
Click to expand...

You got it Brother...better to be safe and than sorry.....The original design you have is fine just don't drill the hole.....there are lots of ways of retaining
a large blade in a sheath....been done for years with Large Bowie designs dating back 100+ years...just have to be creative...;)
 
Busto said:
You got it Brother...better to be safe and than sorry.....The original design you have is fine just don't drill the hole.....there are lots of ways of retaining
a large blade in a sheath....been done for years with Large Bowie designs dating back 100+ years...just have to be creative...;)
Click to expand...

This exactly. Not drilling the hole saves me about 2 minutes of time on the drill press, a little hardship on the drill bit and a few less drops of oil. Like you say, in that one in a million chance someone wants this knife and offers enough to buy a HT oven or a nice KMG grinder, it would be hard to not sell it, especially considering with better tools I could remake the same knife much quicker.
 
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zingo156 said:
This exactly. Not drilling the hole saves me about 2 minutes of time on the drill press, a little hardship on the drill bit and a few less drops of oil. Like you say, in that 1 in a million chance someone wants this knife and offers enough to buy a HT oven or a nice KMG grinder, it would be hard to not sell it, especially considering with better tools I could remake the same knife much quicker.
Click to expand...

Now you're thinking ahead.....I always try to make my next knife the "ONE" the flagship and honestly as its completed it's usually already spoken for or will be....So to have
a great knife design that you might be reluctant to sell is not ideal simply because of a HOLE....Best of Luck on a great design hope it brings you some hefty cash!!!!
 
Busto said:
Now you're thinking ahead.....I always try to make my next knife the "ONE" the flagship and honestly as its completed it's usually already spoken for or will be....So to have
a great knife design that you might be reluctant to sell is not ideal simply because of a HOLE....Best of Luck on a great design hope it brings you some hefty cash!!!!
Click to expand...

Thank you. Even if it doesn't bring a ton of money, it is sure to be an adventure that I would consider "fun" and a learning experience. If this one goes well, I am certain there will be more to follow. I think I have caught the bug. This one seems like enough knife at the moment but as soon as it is done, I am sure there will be something I will want to change to make it a better knife next time.
 
And that my friend is why we are here....making the next one better than the last one!!!
 
Here it is after 1.5 hours of angle grinding and a bit of filling just to get rid of the burrs. Obviously a long way to go. Also holy heavy! The handle ended up rounded (swooped) on the top and bottom, I tried the straight cut on the top and I think it would hurt after a few minutes of use. The handle is actually comfortable in it's current shape in one hand and I can get 2 fingers of my left hand around the end of the rounded tang, I can get a good swing with 2 hands quite easily, for 1 handed it is on the heavy side but I am hoping the bevel takes it down quite a bit.

Here are the pics:

https://www.dropbox.com/s/6awap3gvjys51ba/IMG_0291 (Medium).JPG?dl=0

https://www.dropbox.com/s/z27vu6np17j0p9w/IMG_0292 (Medium).JPG?dl=0

Leave some comments and suggestions. Thanks!
 
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Here it is after 1.5 hours of angle grinding and a bit of filling just to get rid of the burrs. Obviously a long way to go. Also holy heavy! The handle ended up rounded (swooped) on the top and bottom, I tried the straight cut on the top and I think it would hurt after a few minutes of use. The handle is actually comfortable in it's current shape in one hand and I can get 2 fingers of my left hand around the end of the rounded tang, I can get a good swing with 2 hands quite easily, for 1 handed it is on the heavy side but I am hoping the bevel takes it down quite a bit.

Here are the pics edited for pics in page:





Leave some comments and suggestions. Thanks!
 
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