first time making a sheath and working with leather

[ausher]

here is some pictures of how and what I've done so far.

leather i used was 8-9 oz and 9-10 oz for the main front and back pieces .

i made a back piece to lash paracord or a boot string through. i first punched holes in all the corners. used 8-9 oz

completed

stitched it to the main back piece

sewing i broke 4 needles for this small part.

all i need to do now is trim and finish the edges. i'm going to try and use a bandsaw to cut the edges and make them square.
i'm not looking foward to stitching it all up and plan on drilling all the holes. probably take all weekend to finish..

thanks to everyone for their advice and helping me out with all my questions. I'm sire ill have more for ya

 

[leatherman]

So far so good! I like your thinking outside the box as well. If you dont take a chance at something different, you wont get anywhere.

I look forward to seeing how this one plays out.

 

[Omega Leather Works]

Very cool!

When you broke the needles, why do you think that happened? How did you make the holes for the needles to go through?

I can't imagine why it would take more than a couple of hours to drill and stitch. Imo, you've got the hard part done. The rest (for me) is the fun stuff. Spend a lot of time on the edges and you'll knock it outta the park!

Seriously bad-ass Busse too btw. A Busse is one of the few knives I've yet to own. A must on my bucket list for sure.

 

[Chris Pierce]

If you have a belt sander I'd try that before using a band saw to square the edges. Goes a little slower but it's harder to take off too much.

PS Your sheath looks great!

 

[ausher]

Very cool!

When you broke the needles, why do you think that happened? How did you make the holes for the needles to go through

I used an awl to make the holes and they kept closing up making the eye of the needle with the thread hard to pull thorough and they would break at the eye. I had to keep opening up the holes with the awl as I stitched.

If you have a belt sander I'd try that before using a band saw to square the edges. Goes a little slower but it's harder to take off too much.

PS Your sheath looks great!

If I had access to a belt sander that's what I would use, but I don't
I'm going to shave the edge off with the band saw then hand sand it.

Thanks for the complements and feedback guys

 

[leatherman]

Are you using those "Big Eye" needles? If so, yea they break so easily because the eye flexes every time its pulled through the hole effectively weakening it.

When you get a chance give harness needles a shot. Tandy carries two sizes, get the larger, or both if your using thinner thread. They are a pill to thread but last so much longer.

I use smooth jaw pliers, those smaller "jewelers" types from Sears, the curved nose types are really nice to use.

 

[ausher]

I got a package of needles from tandy that look pretty heavy duty. The needles I was using had pretty thin eyes. And they would break at the eye. I used needle nose pliars to pull the needle through.


I also have the crazy idea of staining the leather with old motor oil and then washing it with soap and water real good to get rid of any leftover residue... will motor oil affect the leather in a bad way?

 

[leatherman]

Just to give a visual, here are the harness needles:
http://www.tandyleatherfactory.com/en-usd/search/searchresults/1192-030.aspx

And these are the big eye needles, they call them stitching needles now:
http://www.tandyleatherfactory.com/en-usd/search/searchresults/1195-033.aspx

The big eye, you can see where they are weak, I broke so many of those back in the day before a mentor turned me on to the harness needles. Back then they were provided with a paper board envelope with the maker listed, not so much now. I've got to tell the story of my mentor back then, he was Native American and had a wealth of knowledge, when he passed so did a huge reserve of old and hard to find native insight. It was a sad day.

Motor oil would indeed make for an interesting color on leather, but, and its a big but, used oil is stuffed with really bad chemicals and burnt petroleum products all of which are really bad for your leather. It gets in the fibers and starts to break them down.

 

[ausher]

Did something crazy and didn't lose a finger went to dad's to use his band saw and it was gone. So I went home and used my table saw like a disk sander and finished out the edge. All is left is to drill all the holes and tidy it up and add some color to it.

 

[ausher]

What can I put on all the edges to keep them from splitting apart? Some sort of glue?

I think I might drill the holes from the back side because the back edge is pretty thin and I'm afraid one of the holes may end up off the edge. Think it be a problem for the front side?

 

[Omega Leather Works]

What is with all the resistance to using proper dye? First Rit dye, now motor oil? I'm no expert in much of anything, but I know motor oil is a bad idea. First, I would never do that to leather. I have too much respect for the animal for that. Put something on the leather to keep motor oil OFF the leather, yes.

If, for whatever reason, you don't want to use dye, or just want to play around, look up vinegroon.

All of my knives see food contact at some point, that's another reason to not use motor oil.

I use a needle with a big eye, but only chucked up in the press. Harness needles work well. You should see an improvement.

No comment on using a band or table saw. If you can do it safely and it works, go for it.

Use contact cement between layers. Lots of posts about edge finishing. Burnish and use something like gum tragacanth,or beeswax to hold the edge fibers.

 

[Bigfattyt]

Tip, for edge finishing with no tools?

A piece of jeans material to polish the edge.

I have edge slickers now, but some of the best edges I have done have been by spending a long time slicking the edges with a damp piece of edge.

Punching the holes is very trick by hand, when using leather that thick. I know, I have punched some thick sheaths. I don't have a drill press, or a cordless drill to use. I just use a sharpened punch. Often with a hammer and pliers.

Do you have a groover to set the line for the stitches and recess them?

Honestly, on most of my sheaths, I don't dye them. I use a bees wax treatment (Aussie leather treatment? ) or neats foot oil till it won't absorb any more while warm, then I finish it with atom wax. The sheaths darken over time and look more natural, which I like.

I have used Vinagroon to color the leather black, and it works. Gets very black, and even, but I can't really get rid of the smell (look up vinegroon. It is very easy to make, using only Steel Wool, and vinegar, supposedly the recipe is thousands of years old).


Looks great so far. Please don't ruin it with motor oil. You will be sorry you did all the work, and then turned it gross.


I started making sheaths a while ago, and it has been a great skill to have, especially for some one who buys Busse's, SwampRats, or Scrapyards.

 

[ausher]

No resistance to using leather dye, just that I don't have any at the moment. I don't think I said anything using rit dye... the motor oil idea came from my work boots. I liked the color it produced on my boots. Right now I think I'm going to leave it plain and work on the edges. Let it naturally get colored. Really don't like the belt loop part so I'll remake that when I get another piece of leather.

 

[Bigfattyt]

No resistance to using leather dye, just that I don't have any at the moment. I don't think I said anything using rit dye... the motor oil idea came from my work boots. I liked the color it produced on my boots. Right now I think I'm going to leave it plain and work on the edges. Let it naturally get colored. Really don't like the belt loop part so I'll remake that when I get another piece of leather.

The leather will darken with age.

Do you have any wax leather conditioner? That will get the process started, and make the leather more resistant to water.

 

[ausher]

I got some saddle soap somewhere. .. I do have an edge grooved and the tool to mark the holes out every 4 mm. I do have a drill press to use.

Just working on it the leather has been darkening up nicely. I just hope I did a good enough job gluing the layers together so they don't split apart. So far seems to be holding up. I just hope when it gets wet it don't swell up and when it dries the layers pull apart.

 

[Omega Leather Works]

Sorry man, there's another thread where the guy wanted to use Rit. I should have explained that better.

Leaving it natural is a viable option, but I'd still put something on it like an acrylic sealant, sno-seal, or at least mink oil or neatsfoot or something. Others with more experience can advise on that.

I guess I'm just surprised that people would buy good leather, then go to the trouble of making the sheath then not use a $4 bottle of dye to make it perform at its best.

Find a local shoe repair shop if you don't like buying online. I don't like buying online personally. I bought my initial dyes online but I've found a local source and will buy there from now on.

Edit- I just re-read what you wrote. If you dig the color that motor oil left on your boots, I've heard of diluting both spirit, and oil based dyes. I don't have a recipe, but maybe someone else does?

If it were me, I'd try some neatsfoot oil on a scrap of your leather to see if the darkening it produces suits your taste. If not, maybe you could try adding drops of the leather dye until it tints the oil enough to produce the finish that you're after.

I apologize if I came across harshly. It dawned on me that the other thread that I referenced wasn't even in this forum. I believe it was in Shop Talk. Had it been here you probably would have seen it, and seen that dye is the most suitable product to use.

In that thread, an offer was made by a fine gentlemen to send the op some dye. I wish I could make that same offer to you, but I only have about 2oz of black dye left, which probably wouldn't even start to cover your needs. On the other hand, if you want it to try mixing with neatsfoot oil, and can wait a few days (I'm working nights) I'd be happy to ship it to you. I can get more for myself from the store I mentioned. Just pm or email me if you're interested. I'll cover shipping.

 

[ausher]

No problem man.. I do thank ya for your input. I'm learning as I go. I'm going to leave it this natural color. I have saddle soap I can use. I live in a small iowa town and there is no shoe store or leather shop here. We have a farm fleet store that sells horse tack and saddle care stuff. Closest place is 35 miles away. I'm not too worried about ruining this sheath. The total cost of the leather and all the tools and misc. Stuff used was about $40. Most of the stuff was the cheapest I could find on eBay. I bought needles and thread from hobby lobby. I went cheap just in case I screwed something up big time and I wouldn't be out a lot of money.

If I wanted to make another sheath there are a few design changes i'd make. Mostly cosmetic like a couple seams and gaps. Overall I'm happy with what I did.

But i have a couple spots where the barges contact cement is separating and was thinking of using a small dab of super glue to fix, but want it to able to flex. Every time it bends it separates. ...

 

[Omega Leather Works]

I'm surprised to hear that about the cement. Was surface prep good?

If you have a walmart, they sell Weldwood contact cement, and I've found it to be very strong. The fibers of the leather tore apart before the glue failed, but I found the same to be true with Barge. Only big difference is that the Barge requires clamping, while the Weldwood doesn't. At least not under the conditions that I put it through. I believe there would be even less chance for the need of clamping on your design as it doesn't have the two pieces of leather trying to pull itself apart (folded over for a pouch design). In any case, surface prep is usually the key when I have a failure be it glue or paint.

 

[spike116]

I wouldn't worry about the spots that are separating, the stitching will hold it together.

 

[ausher]

Surface was clean, but I wonder if I should of roughed up the smooth side of the leather first. I didn't know barges needed clamping.... hopefully stitching will help tho...