First use of Spyderco Sharpmaker

S

soldierofchrist35

Joined
Dec 10, 2015
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25
Have never sharpened a knife before and just got a SSM. If I have an S30V or Elmax folding knife which was highly sharp and now after alot of use is just sharp but not as sharp as before, should i still go through all 4 steps in SSM or just one of the last steps to bring it back to super sharpness?
 
But since you do not have experience with the SM, please practice on cheap throw-away knives first. The steel will not be as hard, but you need to get the hand/arm motions down first. When you can successfully get the cheap blades to shaving sharp, you are more likely to not mess up your nice steel. Just remember that the S30V and Elmax are much harder steel, so a little more time may be needed.

If you are really just cleaning up edges that are still fairly sharp, you may just need to touch-up potential edge roll or add a micro bevel. Keep the pressure light and go slow in the beginning. My most used stones for touch-up is the fine (or ultra fine). I only jump to the medium for blades that I want a bit toothy. I also use the rod corners more than the flats, with VERY light pressure. Just personal preference as I find it difficult to keep the edge totally level (contact wise) on the flats, and have somewhat inconsistent results.

Enjoy the sharpening bug and be sure to let us know the results....good or bad.
 
Ok, thanks. So, if I have a knife that will raggedly cut paper but not slice it evenly and thinly like it did when it was razor sharp, I should first try steps 3 and 4 with the white "fine" stones? When will I ever need the ultra fine or the diamond ones?
 
I only use the diamond stones for repair or changing bevels. Don't own and have never need the ultra fine. The basic set up with the brown and white are an excellent pair for maintaining decent edges to very sharp.

Going through the 4 steps (I find that a really good EDC edge rarely needs step # 4) will likely take your worn edge to good as new. 1) brown corners - approx. 40 passes, 2) brown flats - 40 passes) 3) White corners, also 40 passes. Strop if you have the option. If you want still sharper 4) 40 passes on the white stone flats then strop. All these last passes and strop need only be light pressure. Practice on other knives is an excellent piece of advice. Get the muscle memory going before you take in on your good knife. Watching the videos is a good idea too.

Good luck.
 
Skip the corners entirely. They really aren't that useful for normal shaped blades. I think the small contact area also makes for imprecise contact pressure, location, and angle. I far prefer using just the flats.

You will find that, if you have a truly apexed edge, the brown/grey stones can make a blade EXTREMELY sharp. I've push cut phonebook paper at 90 degrees, both directions, after just the grey flats.

Don't bother counting strokes. That's just a beginner technique to give you something to aim for. It's really not useful. Either use the reflected light technique to see the edge bevel as it becomes apexed, or generate a burr on each side of the blade and then remove it. I like the burr technique.

Watch JDavis' video on how he uses the SharpMaker. It changed the way I do it for the better.

[video]https://youtu.be/-MHe_8wTHmg[/video]

Brian.
 
bgentry said:
Skip the corners entirely. They really aren't that useful for normal shaped blades. I think the small contact area also makes for imprecise contact pressure, location, and angle. I far prefer using just the flats.

You will find that, if you have a truly apexed edge, the brown/grey stones can make a blade EXTREMELY sharp. I've push cut phonebook paper at 90 degrees, both directions, after just the grey flats.

Don't bother counting strokes. That's just a beginner technique to give you something to aim for. It's really not useful. Either use the reflected light technique to see the edge bevel as it becomes apexed, or generate a burr on each side of the blade and then remove it. I like the burr technique.

Watch JDavis' video on how he uses the SharpMaker. It changed the way I do it for the better.

[video]https://youtu.be/-MHe_8wTHmg[/video]

Brian.
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I suggested counting - because he is a beginner AND because, I think, the tendency is to do minimal strokes when in fact the tool works best with more passes than you'd expect. 20 or 30 per side is not too much. As you learn the tool, as with all techniques, you can skip the rules.

As for the corners - I , like one other poster above, find it easier to control the knife on the limited area - especially depending on the type of blade. Serrated? you need the corners. I use the flats too but the corners serve a purpose. Just sayin' - my way is certainly not necessarily the best. I have deviated from Sal's videos too but as a beginner there is something to be said for establishing the basics.
 
RayseM said:
I suggested counting - because he is a beginner AND because, I think, the tendency is to do minimal strokes when in fact the tool works best with more passes than you'd expect. 20 or 30 per side is not too much. As you learn the tool, as with all techniques, you can skip the rules.

As for the corners - I , like one other poster above, find it easier to control the knife on the limited area - especially depending on the type of blade. Serrated? you need the corners. I use the flats too but the corners serve a purpose. Just sayin' - my way is certainly not necessarily the best. I have deviated from Sal's videos too but as a beginner there is something to be said for establishing the basics.
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I agree, I also found that the corners cut a little more aggressively. I rarely use the SM any more as I've moved on to more versatile systems. However the sm does come out now and then for touch ups, as long as the knife in hand matches one of the two angles available on the SM and that rules out all of my kitchen knives.
 
Megabassx7 said:
Just hope your edge is close enough to the fixed angles or your are in for a night of fun
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To expand on this a bit... you need to insure the angles on your knife are at or lower than the Sharpmaker angles, or it won't matter what you do. Easiest way is to mark the edge with a Sharpie and make sure the stone(s) are reaching the very edge. If you're not reaching the edge, (a common problem), no combo of steps will improve the sharpness.

I also suggest skipping the corners, but if you use them, make sure you don't drag the tip across the flat as you come off the corner, or you'll grind the tip off. Even on the flats, try to stop with the tip on the stone.

Chances are pretty good that the first time you sharpen, it will take a while to get the knife "conformed" to the angles of the Sharpmaker, so don't be surprised if you don't see improvement right away. (And if you don't with the brown stones, don't move on to the white stones until you do).
 
bgentry said:
Skip the corners entirely. They really aren't that useful for normal shaped blades. I think the small contact area also makes for imprecise contact pressure, location, and angle. I far prefer using just the flats.

You will find that, if you have a truly apexed edge, the brown/grey stones can make a blade EXTREMELY sharp. I've push cut phonebook paper at 90 degrees, both directions, after just the grey flats.

Don't bother counting strokes. That's just a beginner technique to give you something to aim for. It's really not useful. Either use the reflected light technique to see the edge bevel as it becomes apexed, or generate a burr on each side of the blade and then remove it. I like the burr technique.

Watch JDavis' video on how he uses the SharpMaker. It changed the way I do it for the better.

[video]https://youtu.be/-MHe_8wTHmg[/video]

Brian.
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I'll 2nd the ^above, especially as it pertains to counting strokes. The number of strokes required to apex the edge is completely variable from knife to knife and situation to situation, and is therefore not reliable as a set goal. Work to form a burr instead; that's the easiest verifiable way to ensure the edge gets apexed fully, and also the easiest for a true novice to accomplish without the ambiguity of wondering if enough strokes were taken. If a burr is formed and verified from both sides, it's apexed; if not, it's likely not apexed. Simple as that. I wish I'd known that about ~25+ years ago, when I was still a sharpening novice trying to figure all this out...

The Maintenance forum is abundant with posted questions from many who've counted an arbitrary number of strokes on the hones and then wondered why their knife still won't cut well. The answer and the 'fix' is always the same: keep going until a burr is formed and verified from each side, no matter how many strokes it takes. Then you'll know you're 'there'.


David
 
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^ Yes, David is right - the burr is the key, counting is mostly to satisfy the OCD in some of us :D
 
I'm still not sure how to tell if there is a burr and then how to remove it once I know it's there. I'm really a visual and tactile learner and all these words are nice but mean almost nothing. Is there anyone on this huge forum who knows how to use a SharpMaker well who lives in the Dallas/Ft Worth Texas area that would give me a few lessons?
 
Take your finger nail and run it from the spine of the knife to the very edge on the side opposite of the stone side. If your nail catches at the end its formed a bur. You can start from the shoulder of the edge too or run your finger pad straight off the edge and feel for one. Dont worry about messing up your edge..with the sharpmaker it's very hard to do so.also you can run the opposite edge with edge trailing pass along some microfiber cloth or even a towel and it will catch a bur
 
Google "the burr knives" or some such and and you will find tons of info, but basically one side of a v edge opposite the stone will start to curl over when you are done on that side. Burr that whole side, then move to the other, then remove the burr and you are done.
I think the idea of counting strokes on these type sharpeners is to keep the edge even, as the second burr usually comes way faster. So might take 80 strokes right side then 10 on the left. Most people I would guess always start on the same side, and could push it pretty far one way always doing it that way. Me, I try to remember to switch starting sides on my often carried knives.
Today it's time to start on the right side of my RAT 1.
 
I feel like giving up. I've used the medium grit stones for dozens of strokes,at least 100 each side and probably more plus the fine stones on my ZT 0566 Elmax steel and it won't even cut printer paper. I've used Sharpie on the edge and my strokes are removing the Sharpie. I can't tell if I'm making a burr but if I'm stroking that much and hitting the right place, wouldn't one assume a burr had formed? I've watched several videos and can't see anything different that they're doing than me. So frustrating.
 
soldierofchrist35 said:
I feel like giving up. I've used the medium grit stones for dozens of strokes,at least 100 each side and probably more plus the fine stones on my ZT 0566 Elmax steel and it won't even cut printer paper. I've used Sharpie on the edge and my strokes are removing the Sharpie. I can't tell if I'm making a burr but if I'm stroking that much and hitting the right place, wouldn't one assume a burr had formed? I've watched several videos and can't see anything different that they're doing than me. So frustrating.
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You mirrored my first experience almost exactly. I watched the video and thought sharpening would be fail proof. One of my issues with any freehand methods was one stroke could be perfect, then the next could be off by just a hair. Totally destroying previous strokes. And most factory grinds are seldom perfect angles from heel to toe, let alone exactly 15 or 20 degrees as the SM is set up for. But I was determined, and ended up researching and buying multiple guided systems.

I still use the SM on a regular basis for touch ups. But my current favorite is the KME. With the blade clamped in place, and the stone guided, even a mechanical dummy like me can get awesome results.
 
soldierofchrist35 said:
I feel like giving up. I've used the medium grit stones for dozens of strokes,at least 100 each side and probably more plus the fine stones on my ZT 0566 Elmax steel and it won't even cut printer paper. I've used Sharpie on the edge and my strokes are removing the Sharpie. I can't tell if I'm making a burr but if I'm stroking that much and hitting the right place, wouldn't one assume a burr had formed? I've watched several videos and can't see anything different that they're doing than me. So frustrating.
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That's the downside of the Sharpmaker. If your existing edge isn't yet profiled within the 40° outside limit of the Sharpmaker, it could take a very, very long time to get it there with just the ceramic rods (medium & fine); more so with wear-resistant steels like your Elmax blade, which grind even slower. This is also why counting strokes usually isn't helpful; with some knives, it could run into thousands of strokes over the span of hours and hours of work. It's possible you're not there yet, and a more aggressive set of rods may be needed to get close. The optional diamond or CBN rods for the Sharpmaker could help with that. Additionally, the longer it takes with just ceramics, the greater the likelihood of fatigue creating error in holding the angle steady. If that happens, a burr may never form, as the edge will just become more rounded with more error in each pass. I'd suggest using a good magnifier of 10X or better, under a very bright light source, and examine the edge to see if it's rounding off, or if it's still short of a full apex, or both.


David
 
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