Fit and Finish on a Southard

[clockman]

Both Southards I've owned moved side to side when closed, minimal but definitely noticeable. When open, no blade play at all of course, very solid.
F&F is good, but not as good as some people make it out to be.
Here are some noticed issues:
1. Milling can be seen in the thumb cut out.
2. Milling can be seen in the titanium liner sides.
3. Finishing inside is good but not great. Could have seriously used chamfering.
4. Better fitting of the lanyard tube.
5. Fit on the knife is very good but not great, yes it's tight but it isn't because tolerances are tight, it's due to the pressure in the lockbar holding the knife in place not tolerances.
6. Fitting of the pivot is poor imho, plenty of play of the two I owned. Made playing with the pivot to center the blade a bit toy like.
7. Pocket clip is sharp and will poke through denim jeans.
If you take a Southard, properly disassemble and reassembly or tighten or loosen the pivot it properly you can affect the blade play, and centering easily enough.
.

I think you are being very picky about the Southard!

I have a little side to side play in mine too. I didn't even check it until I read about sts play in your post.

The list goes on about being overly critical of an excellent knife IMO.

I could say a Lot more about some critical comments in your post.

I don't think most members checked out their Southard's as tho they were trying to find 'tiny defects'....and then post them on this thread.



One of our most famous president's said " you can't please all the people, all the time."................................

 

[Locutus D'Borg]

I thought P.T. Barnum, Circus impresario, said that. I could be wrong.

Buy the knife. If you don't like it, sell it.

 

[Luis G.]

I think you are being very picky about the Southard!

I have a little side to side play in mine too. I didn't even check it until I read about sts play in your post.

The list goes on about being overly critical of an excellent knife IMO.

I could say a Lot more about some critical comments in your post.

I don't think most members checked out their Southard's as tho they were trying to find 'tiny defects'....and then post them on this thread.



One of our most famous president's said " you can't please all the people, all the time."................................

I don't hear how my points are invalid, just that they are overcritical which at $260 (a bit over ten fold more than what most people would spend on knives) I would say some people may expect more for their money specially costing less to manufacture in the country of origin than it is in the USA.
For $260 I do expect better and have received better in that price range. For an resale price of $210 I think it is fine.
You can try to come out and say oh but they use high quality steel... So does Benchmade, at nearly 1/2 the cost. They use carbon fiber or G10, M390, premium designers and titanium. Plus made in the USA.

I was pleased with the knife I sold it purely due to to cutting performance with wide materials (wood, and carboard) due to the 4mm stock and the edge not being wide enough to split the material as it cuts to make way for the thicker spine.

Just because you like a knife doesn't mean you cannot be critical of it. And just because you are critical of a knife, doesn't mean you don't like it.
Refusing to be critical about it and taking it however the mfg gives it you is how manufacturers can get away with using low end materials in very expensive knives. For some brands like Boker, Gerber, and not so reputable knife brands people are very objective but for brands like Spyderco, Benchmade, Kershaw, ZT, and others people seem to have built their cult following which is not good.

I've seen this happen in another sharp related forum involving certain brands or forges. People paying $300 for what another mfg was selling for $100.

EDIT: I am not pointing fingers or saying that any of the mfg's mentioned above are ripping people off. I am simply explaining the concept of not being critical of what you buy hurting the consumer in the end.

 

[dcmartin]

Both Southards I've owned moved side to side when closed, minimal but definitely noticeable. When open, no blade play at all of course, very solid.
F&F is good, but not as good as some people make it out to be.
Here are some noticed issues:
1. Milling can be seen in the thumb cut out.
2. Milling can be seen in the titanium liner sides.
3. Finishing inside is good but not great. Could have seriously used chamfering.
4. Better fitting of the lanyard tube.
5. Fit on the knife is very good but not great, yes it's tight but it isn't because tolerances are tight, it's due to the pressure in the lockbar holding the knife in place not tolerances.
6. Fitting of the pivot is poor imho, plenty of play of the two I owned. Made playing with the pivot to center the blade a bit toy like.
7. Pocket clip is sharp and will poke through denim jeans.
If you take a Southard, properly disassemble and reassembly or tighten or loosen the pivot it properly you can affect the blade play, and centering easily enough.

Take a Sebenza. Disassemble, and reassemble properly. You will end up 100% in the same place you had it. Same friction, same centering, same lock up.
That is real tight fit. Plus the finishing is well done. Not the best finishing, but darn good.

Anyways let's not get hyped up into buying a product, take a look at it for what it's worth.

Imho the Southard @$260 is too pricey for me. But at after market prices, think it's a solid value buy that will be hard to beat.

Bummer that you had not 1 but 2 bad samples.....I just don't see any of the problems you've mentioned in my Southard. I'm sure i could find something if i really look... I do agree with you that some chamfering to the lock side Ti would have been very nice. I've taken my Southard apart several times and each time it goes back together the same exact way wether i start from the pivot and work my way back or start at the rear and work my way forward to the pivot. I would say the tolerances are pretty good... I still think the CRK's are higher but the Southard is no slouch... Once the scales and pivot are snug... there's no play.

As far as the lock bar holding the knife in place?? The lock bar does no such thing... The lock bar creates tension for the detent when the knife is closed and up until the blade is completely deployed... Once fully open it locks against the tang. If you depress the lock bar so it creates zero tension on the blade (while still closed), there should still be no side to side play or effect on the centering... It's only when the pivot is still loose and the bushings or bearings sandwiched between the scales are not seated fully that the lock bar can effect the centering or side to side play. There is no need to leave the Southard's pivot loose enough to have side / side play.

The secondary mkt has them at about $210 - $220, I think that is a fantastic deal if you like the look and size. I don't think you can find too many Ti lock back, bearing pivot, flippers with CTS 204P (or comparable) steel even near that price. Now granted, i'm not cutting linoleum, carpet or breaking down tons of cardboard boxes but it does get it's fair share of use and I haven't had to sharpen it in over 2 months... still shaves

While some may view the Southard as being hyped up, time will tell... This is probably one of the knives i will hold on to and have no intent of selling.

 

[Luis G.]

Bummer that you had not 1 but 2 bad samples.....I just don't see any of the problems you've mentioned in my Southard. I'm sure i could find something if i really look... I do agree with you that some chamfering to the lock side Ti would have been very nice. I've taken my Southard apart several times and each time it goes back together the same exact way wether i start from the pivot and work my way back or start at the rear and work my way forward to the pivot. I would say the tolerances are pretty good... I still think the CRK's are higher but the Southard is no slouch... Once the scales and pivot are snug... there's no play.

As far as the lock bar holding the knife in place?? The lock bar does no such thing... The lock bar creates tension for the detent when the knife is closed and up until the blade is completely deployed... Once fully open it locks against the tang. If you depress the lock bar so it creates zero tension on the blade (while still closed), there should still be no side to side play or effect on the centering... It's only when the pivot is still loose and the bushings or bearings sandwiched between the scales are not seated fully that the lock bar can effect the centering or side to side play. There is no need to leave the Southard's pivot loose enough to have side / side play.

The secondary mkt has them at about $210 - $220, I think that is a fantastic deal if you like the look and size. I don't think you can find too many Ti lock back, bearing pivot, flippers with CTS 204P (or comparable) steel even near that price. Now granted, i'm not cutting linoleum, carpet or breaking down tons of cardboard boxes but it does get it's fair share of use and I haven't had to sharpen it in over 2 months... still shaves

While some may view the Southard as being hyped up, time will tell... This is probably one of the knives i will hold on to and have no intent of selling.

Lock bar holds it in place when disassembling. It was in regards to comments mentioning the fit being very tight. It's just the tension of the lockbar when the knife is open, when you remove the pivot/handle screws.
The pivot affected the blade centering on both. The pivot has a flat portion milled out, as well as on the liners. This milled out portion does not fit tightly and has a bit of play. Two southards I owned had this issue. Also msged some people on youtube, and they had the same thing. There was play in the pivot, you could rotate it a little bit even with the screw tightening down.

Anyways I am sure if you play with the pivot you can cause it to center or be off, yet remain solid.

Yeah at around $210-$220 that's a good deal there, I may pick a 3rd one and suck it up and mod it.

 

[bld522]

It's not a Jasmine, Maleta. But I've got a Southard and Slim EDC and I'm not planning on selling either one.

 

[RetiredGuns]

2 of my all-time favorites below. I would not give up either of them. All others have come & gone and some multiple times. No other Spyderco has made me this happy, nope, not even the P2 of which I've had 5. The Southard is not only an extremely solid knife but very ergonomic as well. The shape makes it curve away from being a nuisance in the pocket and the flipper is the best I've had.

 

[choombak]

It's closest in finish to the other knives that Spyderco has coming out of the same plant. Have you handled a Sage, Air, Bradley folder, BushcraftUK, Szabo, etc.

Oh you missed the Techno. Actually, I find the Southard's fit and finish (including the finishing of the edges, and the tumbled wash, etc.) very close to that on the Techno. And yes, it is better than I've seen on Golden-made knives.

 

[atony]

Like Rev pointed out the Taichung made knives are very well made, FF has been great on all the ones I have owned. At 225.00 for the Southard (what I payed) it is a very clean and well made knife. Plus you can always have it made better.

 

[Deputy572]

The fit and finish is beyond first rate. It is a pretty perfect knife. I'm selling mine but only because it literally was too nice for me to use. Around the house if I needed to cut something I'd reach for a beater because I liked the Southard too much to dirty it up. That is a problem as I didn't want to carry something I wasn't going to use. In my opinion the quality is right on par with midtech's and lower end customs.

 

[Lo/Rez]

Like Rev pointed out the Taichung made knives are very well made, FF has been great on all the ones I have owned. At 225.00 for the Southard (what I payed) it is a very clean and well made knife. Plus you can always have it made better.

That looks really nice. Where did you get the scale and screws?

 

[atony]

That looks really nice. Where did you get the scale and screws?

Thank you!

Barry H here on the forums made the scale. I bead blasted the screws, clip, and back spacers.

 

[La_Maleta_Azul]

The fit and finish is beyond first rate. It is a pretty perfect knife. I'm selling mine but only because it literally was too nice for me to use. Around the house if I needed to cut something I'd reach for a beater because I liked the Southard too much to dirty it up. That is a problem as I didn't want to carry something I wasn't going to use. In my opinion the quality is right on par with midtech's and lower end customs.

Really? I think the finish couldn't be more conducive to hard use - deep stonewash, brown peel ply g10 (won't show dirt). If I had to get a beater, this would be the one.

 

[nccole]

Really? I think the finish couldn't be more conducive to hard use - deep stonewash, brown peel ply g10 (won't show dirt). I I had to get a beater, this would be the one.

I couldn't agree more. I do worry a bit about getting gunk stuck in the bearings, but otherwise it is a user for sure. I have a fixed blade that I felt this way about, and it has sat for a few years. I decided that this year, I am going to use, no sense in having a knife that you don't use, and I find it hard to sell knives.