Foils for Self Defense?

Bandit

Bandit

Joined
Jan 10, 2000
Messages
283
Anyone ever try out a foil for everyday carry? I have been thinking about purchasing one, removing the handle guard, and cutting it down to about 24-36". I have not ever fenced, so do not know if this will work the way I want it to. I am looking for a thin pointed blade that can be coiled just a bit to fit in a jacket. Any recommendations? Or does anyone know of a folding, retracting, or extendable sword? Or maybe a lightsaber? And while I'm wishing I would also like a porsche. But seriously, any ideas?
 
A foil is a piece of sporting equipment. It is not a weapon and really won't serve as the basis for creating an effective one. A foil is designed for scoring points under a set of rules, and is designed to minimize the chance for injury.

A standard foil blade is about 32 inches long, and very thin and flexible toward the point. You would have to cut the blade back to about 12 inches to reach the section that is stiff enough to penetrate an opponent with some degree of reliability if the point is sharpened. This leaves you with essentially a long ice pick, good for thrusts only, no cuts.

Removing the guard is also impractical. The guard is part of what holds the whole hilt assembly together. Remove the guard and you will only have the soft wood or plastic of the handle against steel to hold tight.

A fencing epee has a wider, thciker blade, but still is not really practical for conversion. You would have a single purpose, make-shift weapon that you don't know how to use effectively. Leave the sporting equipment for its intended purpose instead of trying to turn it into something it won't be very good for.

Mark
 
While it would just be silly to bother wearing a foil, I have seen some rather wicked sword-canes made from them. With the tip ground to a point, the penetrating capability is much what you would expect from a two-foot needle.

One gentleman, who used to make the most amazing swordcanes, once demonstrated this capability by putting up an Austin Metro Phonebook as a target. With no more effort than you might use to throw a medium-weight punch, it would penetrate that book.

Of course, the wound channel is miniscule, but this is made up for, I feel, by the fact that a foil at this length is practically impossible to see, even in good light, and almost totally impossible to avoid! It's like dodging bullets, basically. This, coupled with its speed, will allow you a number of very painful jabs, hopefully giving your assailant the idea that he should go and quietly bleed to death, somewhere else!

:D
 
Please remember that swordcanes are classified as concealed weapons in most jurisdictions.
 
Why bother with a cut down foil as a self-defense item. There are so many better choices in edged/pointed weapons. Concealment is not really a viable option with something 24-36". Perhaps a knife is better for such a purpose.
 
What I really looking for is a sword that is light and fairly concealable. I realize that swords are not really meant to be concealed, but a quick weapon that I could pass off as something else would be perfect. Sword canes are out because any one with an IQ over 60 can figure out what they are. I prefer speed over weight and just want something with a good length that can be deployed and used fast.
 
I see. That may be a tall order. Concealment or perhaps disguising that size blade is more difficult. The sword cane seems ideal except for the fact that most places prohibit such and they really aren't all that available to purchase. On the other hand, I suspect that since they are so rare you could carry such (especially at night) and not draw that much attention - except maybe by LEO's. Take a look here for some high quality sword canes... http://www.knifeart.com/swordcanes.html
 
WARNING!

To my knowledge, there is no jurisdiction within the United States that does not either generally or specifically prohibit the carry of a sword, sword cane, or sword-like blade of any sort.

DO NOT DO THIS!
 
NOT a good idea! If you are adventurous with the LEO's.., you'd be better off concealing a firearm than some sort of hacked-up foil or saber.


"Hunters seek what they [WANT].., Seekers hunt what they [NEED]"
 
What you want is a car radio antenna. Don't put a point on it, use it just as is. It's not a stabbing weapon, it's used like a whip. It is a highly effective pain producer. It's usually not seen as a weapon, either, even if carried on your person.
 
Better than a car antenna, check out Newt Livesay's WA-1 sticks. (WA for Whoop Ass?) ;)

They're the 21st century answer to the car antenna, and a little bit easier to explain in the event you may actually need to use it.
 
Chris Reeves, of Sebenza fame, over at CRK makes an awefully nice cane, also. But it is rather more expensive, if much more handsome.
 
Good answers to the query from Mark, and Kalidras.I think that Kalindras is correct for the type of use I thinh your looking at
a good sword cane would be better suited.Cols Steel makes a good one.
Also deep puncture wounds physiologically induce shock more rapidly
than slash wounds,but with a sword cane thats what your limited to.
Also to consider as they are considered concealed almost everywhere
if you have to use it legal bad juju.jmho
 
I do currently own a sword cane (sort of). I have a Paul Chen Zatoichi Sword that I recieved for Christmas. As this is the sword style I am most proficient with, I am very happy with it. However I do not see myself carrying it with me. The sword-cane seems to have a rather sever social stigma attached to it. The reason the foil stood out in my mind, was that I could bend it into a concealable shape and use it as a piercing weapon or a much harder to cut sjambok. Just idle thoughts, but the more I learn about foils, the more I realize that they really arn't made for what I had in mind. Thanks all.
 
Hey, Bandit,

It looks like your best options, legality notwithstanding, would be a sword-cane from the Burgers (South African chaps who make real nice, yet affordable pieces--with some slashing ability, as well!), the WA-1 stick mentioned previously (I'd never seen that before, so if it's much different than a sjambok, I couldn't attest to its use), or one of the offerings from Bladeriggers (who have a couple of nasty little tricks that hide in belts and such).

If you're at all concerned about legality, though, I'd take the time to simply learn a few useful techniques with a plain ol' cane. Hooked or not, a good, stout cane can be incredibly useful in keeping an assailant at bay, as well as offering you a wide range of options in controlling a situation, especially non-lethally (which is good...we like non-lethal). If you already have any training in sword, then it carries over almost directly to cane (or stick, as Eric seemed to prefer--canes have hooks, stick are straight, I guess).

Another $.02 from yours, truly.

Kal
 
Wellll....(I say in my practiced southern drawl)...I have a WA-1 stick and had one of my students break one...so, they're out. I have 2 hickory combat canes from Canemasters and a Walkabout from Cold Steel as well as plenty of practice canes. I studied Hapkido Cane Fighting for 3 years and currently teach it to my students. And I have the aforementioned sword cane. So, I feel I am pretty set with all those suggestions. LOL. Please don't think me an ass or more specifically a bragging ass, it just amused me how on the money the previous post was. It seemed to be an item by item list of different things I have done.
 
[Puts on best Scots accent] Nah, Laddie...yer only braggin' if ye wear yer kilt down [points to ankles] ta THERE!!

Well, heck, Bandit...you seem pretty good to go, anyway. With your skillset and assortment of toys, why would you want to bother with a foil, anyway?!? :confused: :D

I know, I know...it's a path, not a destination. I'm hip. We passed on the road, a ways back, it seems... :cool:

Kal
 
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