Forced patina thread

[CJZ]

Hey everyone,

So i've seen a lot of good looking patinas in the patina thread a while back, and I *assume* most of those were natural.

So let me explain my predicament and the reason for this thread:

It's way too humid by me, coupled with the fact that I live in a salty canal. So my knives rust constantly, I can't keep up. The only cure is to hit them with steel wool when rust forms.
Wiping down with oil doesn't work.

I can't try to get natural patinas, rust forms before the patina can set in.


So I tried forcing, and the results were....
Let's leave it at that.

So I was wondering if you guys had any tips/ tricks, or any pictures of nice looking forced patinas.
(or any tips/tricks to help keep rust away)

Anything would be nice, thanks!

 

[pertinux]

Anything would be nice, thanks!

How 'bout this?

(7th result as of now; a search for "forced patina" would have gotten you there even faster.)



~ P.

 

[powernoodle]

Use some alcohol or other solvent to remove your invisible fingerprints from the blade, or they will be memorialized forever in the patina. Heat up some vinegar until it boils. Dunk the blade for 15 seconds in the vinegar, wipe it off, observe and repeat. The blade may emit bubbles when being dunked. When you think you are about where you like it, which for me is 2 or 3 dunkings, let the blade sit there for a couple of minutes because it seems to me that the patina can continue to change for a short while. If you care to, hit it with some 000 steel wool, or some Mother's Mag Wheel polish to adjust the appearance.

Yes, this is cheating, and I don't feel good about it. So lets keep this just between us, please.

There are plenty of other ways to do it, and some guys get a good look with gun bluing. You can also stick the blade in an apple and leave it there, checking every 30 minutes.

 

[LeatherMan64]

How 'bout this?

Like magic!!

 

[kamagong]

...some guys get a good look with gun bluing.

These knives were cold blued.

- Christian

 

[sitflyer]

I had the same problem in the hot humid NC summers, and have had the best results with blueing...




top and bottom knife above are blued...


Another option I have used is to keep the knife in the kitchen, and use it for peeling potatoes for a month or two...




the 73 pictured above was used solely for peeling potatoes for a couple of months, it has a nice deep grey natural patina. I think the actual peeling helps because of whatever abrasion occurs from the skin, I would just wipe it off with a paper towel, then clean it with a sponge and soapy water after the meal.

 

[jwren]

Just a heads up if you go the boiled vinegar route - be prepared for your kitchen, and possibly your whole house, to stank somethin' fierce for a while....
This was my experience anyway, YMMV

 

[Obsessed with Edges]

Use some alcohol or other solvent to remove your invisible fingerprints from the blade, or they will be memorialized forever in the patina. Heat up some vinegar until it boils. Dunk the blade for 15 seconds in the vinegar, wipe it off, observe and repeat. The blade may emit bubbles when being dunked. When you think you are about where you like it, which for me is 2 or 3 dunkings, let the blade sit there for a couple of minutes because it seems to me that the patina can continue to change for a short while. If you care to, hit it with some 000 steel wool, or some Mother's Mag Wheel polish to adjust the appearance.

Yes, this is cheating, and I don't feel good about it. So lets keep this just between us, please.

There are plenty of other ways to do it, and some guys get a good look with gun bluing. You can also stick the blade in an apple and leave it there, checking every 30 minutes.

This is pretty much how I produced the patina on my 8OT's clip blade, though not quite to boiling temperature. I took advantage of the vinegar & water mix left over in my coffee pot, after using it to de-scale the coffee maker. Used roughly 1 part vinegar to 2 parts water. It was at about 180°F as it sat in the pot, and I dunked the blade and held it in there for maybe 30 seconds - 1 minute at a time, and repeated this about 3 times. Did see the bubbles from the blade too, which is pretty impressive and just a wee bit scary. Lifting the blade out of the liquid (exposing it to the air), you can actually watch the steel darken before your eyes as well. Blade will be BLACK after this; rinse thoroughly in cold, running water, and then scrub it with baking soda, which neutralizes the acid (very important; you'll get RUST if not doing this, and being thorough about it). After scrubbing with baking soda and otherwise cleaning everything up (plus some stropping, which shines up the edge), my blade looks like this:

Just a heads up if you go the boiled vinegar route - be prepared for your kitchen, and possibly your whole house, to stank somethin' fierce for a while....
This was my experience anyway, YMMV

I've come to rather enjoy the smell of (nearly) boiled vinegar in the morning ("...smells like VICTORY!" ).


David

 

[powernoodle]

I've noticed that if I don't take a shower for about 5 days, I don't even notice the vinegar smell. Just a helpful hint.

 

[Professor]

I've noticed that if I don't take a shower for about 5 days, I don't even notice the vinegar smell. Just a helpful hint.

I've noticed the same. When my teeth go unbrushed for that long, they develop a patina also.

 

[thawk]

I like both patina on a carbon steel or stainless blades as long as it is clean and cuts. This is a knife I got in a group that had not been cared for so I cleaned it and helped the patina along. It is one of my favorites. If I would have taken the flitz to it it would look like crap.

 

[VictorLouis]

Will D2 steel take hold of either cold blue(applied hot, LOL) or the vinegar method? Or, is it 'too close' to stainless?

 

[Obsessed with Edges]

Will D2 steel take hold of either cold blue(applied hot, LOL) or the vinegar method? Or, is it 'too close' to stainless?

There was a thread in the Maint forum a while back, with pics of a (non-traditional) D2 folder with a patterned mustard/vinegar-induced patina. That was the first confirmation to me, that it can work. A blade with a less-polished finish will likely respond better to it (sanding the blade might help).


David

 

[VictorLouis]

Hmmmm.interesting...Thanks.

 

[trevytrev]

I've used the heated Apple cider vinager and it gets a good dark patina on the steel.

 

[dannyp]

A blade with a less-polished finish will likely respond better to it (sanding the blade might help).


David

I believe you might be correct in this, David. This Queen Canoe that I just gave away was sanded a little bit before I forced a patina with vinegar.


I was originally going to give the blades a satin finish, but after beginning to sand, I noticed there was a very faint patina that was forming. It seemed kind of silly to me to go through all the trouble to sand it if it was going to patina anyway, so I decided to force it instead. I wrapped a vinegar soaked paper towel around the blade and left it for a couple hours (mostly because I forgot about it). I had to do it a couple times and make sure the paper towel was wrapped tightly and evenly to avoid splotching. This method works much faster with simple carbon steels.

I had just the opposite experience with a Mountain Man. I didn't sand it at all before trying this and it ended up very uneven. It seemed as though there were spots that just wouldn't darken. I ended up sanding it down to a satin finish instead to make it look nicer before giving it away.

I don't know whether or not it was due to the sanding that the Canoe came out more even. It's too small of a sample size to come to any conclusion. I've often wondered if it's just the nature of D2 to patina strangely because of the high chromium content.

 

[Obsessed with Edges]

I believe you might be correct in this, David. This Queen Canoe that I just gave away was sanded a little bit before I forced a patina with vinegar.


I was originally going to give the blades a satin finish, but after beginning to sand, I noticed there was a very faint patina that was forming. It seemed kind of silly to me to go through all the trouble to sand it if it was going to patina anyway, so I decided to force it instead. I wrapped a vinegar soaked paper towel around the blade and left it for a couple hours (mostly because I forgot about it). I had to do it a couple times and make sure the paper towel was wrapped tightly and evenly to avoid splotching. This method works much faster with simple carbon steels.

I had just the opposite experience with a Mountain Man. I didn't sand it at all before trying this and it ended up very uneven. It seemed as though there were spots that just wouldn't darken. I ended up sanding it down to a satin finish instead to make it look nicer before giving it away.

I don't know whether or not it was due to the sanding that the Canoe came out more even. It's too small of a sample size to come to any conclusion. I've often wondered if it's just the nature of D2 to patina strangely because of the high chromium content.

Somewhere here, I recently saw a pic or two of what I think was a D2 blade that'd been stained somewhat differently (don't remember how). The patina that resulted appeared to show contrast between the steel matrix and the (assumed to be) chromium carbides in the steel, which can be large and irregular in shape at times. I'm pretty sure D2 has a reputation for large, bulky carbides (excluding CPM-D2, which uses a powder metal process to refine grain size and reduce the size of carbides). I wouldn't be at all surprised if the presence of the heavy carbides affects the appearance or uniformity of the patina on a D2 blade.

I got acquainted with the method of using a paper towel wrapped around a 1095 blade, in my first 'attempt' at putting a patina on it. Used pickle juice, instead of vinegar (right after dinner, during which I consumed the last pickle in the jar; just too convenient ). Left it wrapped around the blade for maybe 2 hours. And you're exactly right, that was a lot longer than necessary ( ). Had to clean a lot of red rust from the blade, but the resulting patina turned out pretty nice.


David