Forge fuel efficiency

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PoorestBoy

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Jul 2, 2016
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I have a few questions about forge fuel efficiency. How much does your forge cost to run? Whats the cheapest fuel to use, and do you have any tricks that help increase fuel efficiency? I know a well insulated forge is needed, but besides that does anyone have any suggestions? Thank you.
 
Lot of variables. My 6" venturi forge ran at about 12psi. My 10" blown forge runs at about 2psi....both on propane, both 2" kaowool and ITC.
 
Depending on what temperature you are running the forge at, how efficient your burner is, and how efficiently you use your forge - most folks get from 1 to 3 pounds of propane an hour. If I had to guess an average use, a 20# tank will normally run a small forge about 6-10 hours of forging.

Tips to get better efficiency:
Manually turn down the flame when not heating the steel, or make an "idle" valve. This is a by-pass shut down that reduces the fame to a per-set minimum. It can be a simple ball valve and lever valve setup, or a more elaborate solenoid and foot pedal setup.

Insulate the forge with 2" of wool and use ITC-100 as a final coat over the satanite.

Only run the forge as hot as needed. No need to have it running like a jet engine when you are just doing some regular forging.

A blown burner is more efficient, as it can be run at a lower setting.

A bulk tank is more efficient because it is often cheaper to fill and won't freeze up. A 100# tank is the most popular because you can take it to get filled yourself, but larger tanks and getting the truck to come and fill it is often the best price in some areas. It really depends on your use and need.



As to what fuels are the most affordable, that somewhat depends on where you live and how resourceful you are. You can make your own charcoal and forge with that for very little money, but a lot more effort. If you live in a coal filed area where they have the right type of coal, that is a fuel option. Most folks find propane the vest choice for simplicity and availability. Chech around for the local prices. The big-box club stores are often as cheap as driving to the propane supplier.

There are waste oil forges that will burn almost any flammable oil ( fry oil to motor oil). These are not really beginner projects, and also require a more elaborate setup.
 
I run a venturi Z-burner, my forge is a 20lb propane tank with the ends cut out, insulated with 2" wool and satanite (no itc yet) and I run it between 3 and 15 psi. Most of my forging has been done at 5 psi and I will get 10 to 12 hours of run time at that setting. I have a ball valve on my burner and if I'm walking away from it for more than a minute or two I just shut it off, as it's very easy to relight and depending on how long I'm away, sometimes doesn't even require relighting as the inside is still hot enough to ignite it.

So that doesn't really give you an efficiency rating, but maybe a practical idea of how one particular setup works in reality.
 
CWendling said:
Lot of variables. My 6" venturi forge ran at about 12psi. My 10" blown forge runs at about 2psi....both on propane, both 2" kaowool and ITC.
Click to expand...

IM assuming that the blown forge has a blower attached to it? Which one of your forges do you think gets more mileage on a tank of propane?
 
Stacy E. Apelt - Bladesmith said:
Depending on what temperature you are running the forge at, how efficient your burner is, and how efficiently you use your forge - most folks get from 1 to 3 pounds of propane an hour. If I had to guess an average use, a 20# tank will normally run a small forge about 6-10 hours of forging.

Tips to get better efficiency:
Manually turn down the flame when not heating the steel, or make an "idle" valve. This is a by-pass shut down that reduces the fame to a per-set minimum. It can be a simple ball valve and lever valve setup, or a more elaborate solenoid and foot pedal setup.

Insulate the forge with 2" of wool and use ITC-100 as a final coat over the satanite.

Only run the forge as hot as needed. No need to have it running like a jet engine when you are just doing some regular forging.

A blown burner is more efficient, as it can be run at a lower setting.

A bulk tank is more efficient because it is often cheaper to fill and won't freeze up. A 100# tank is the most popular because you can take it to get filled yourself, but larger tanks and getting the truck to come and fill it is often the best price in some areas. It really depends on your use and need.



As to what fuels are the most affordable, that somewhat depends on where you live and how resourceful you are. You can make your own charcoal and forge with that for very little money, but a lot more effort. If you live in a coal filed area where they have the right type of coal, that is a fuel option. Most folks find propane the vest choice for simplicity and availability. Chech around for the local prices. The big-box club stores are often as cheap as driving to the propane supplier.

There are waste oil forges that will burn almost any flammable oil ( fry oil to motor oil). These are not really beginner projects, and also require a more elaborate setup.
Click to expand...

I have studied a lot about waste oil burners, charcoal and propane. I have used propane and charcoal. I tried making my own charcoal but it didnt seem like something i would want to do very often, because it puts off so much smoke. I live close to other people and commercial businesses, and im afraid the smoke will not be welcome. I burned raw wood in my forge as well and it works as long as im using pine. It doesnt smoke as much and burns pretty clean. Pine wood burns fast and hot and turns to coal quickly. THe only drawback is that it gets very hot to stand next to. Burning wood is an option if i could find someone who sold pine firewood. In the end however, i do prefer propane because it is more convenient. I built a small propane forge using an old fire extinguisher. I think it was about 7" round. I insulated it with homemade refractory, 4 parts perlite and one part mortar. IT works ok but i know the ceramic wool is better because thats what everyone says. I made my own burner as well. I followed plans i found ion the internet. Its a venturi burner. I attached a cheap Harbor freight weed burner to the burner that i built and it acts as my valve. It has an adjustment nob and an on off lever. I just turn it down or release the lever when im not heating metal, to save on feul. IT works well but im wondering if another burner might be better.

HOw much more efficient are blown style burners? Would you have any idea? WHat about a ribbon burner? I have heard people claim that they are more efficient and heat the steel more evenly as well.
 
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kuraki said:
I run a venturi Z-burner, my forge is a 20lb propane tank with the ends cut out, insulated with 2" wool and satanite (no itc yet) and I run it between 3 and 15 psi. Most of my forging has been done at 5 psi and I will get 10 to 12 hours of run time at that setting. I have a ball valve on my burner and if I'm walking away from it for more than a minute or two I just shut it off, as it's very easy to relight and depending on how long I'm away, sometimes doesn't even require relighting as the inside is still hot enough to ignite it.

So that doesn't really give you an efficiency rating, but maybe a practical idea of how one particular setup works in reality.
Click to expand...

I have that same style burner, i believe. I think i got about 8 hours of use on 20 lbs of propane. IT could be less though, and i didnt time it to see. I only used my propane forge once. I was kinda shocked that it used so much propane. Im guessing that if i want to get cheaper fuel i'll need to get a huge tank and a better price per gallon.

My burner is similar to this one, but not exactly the same.

Venturi.jpg
 
lol, i mispelled homemade, i spelled it as pomade. That's fitting, given me user name. It was Po-made (never mind) :D
 
That works on the same principle but I believe it's slightly less efficient.

zburner.jpg


To reduce the expense of forging, I'm trying to get my Co-Op to install a fill connection on my 500 gallon tank, since I supplement heat with propane in my house. If I could fill my 20 lb tanks myself at 1.20 a gallon I'd be money ahead of an exchange. Exchanges here are about $15-20, or lets say $1/lb. There are 4.2 lbs in a gallon of LP, so off my bulk storage it's roughly $0.28/lb.

Second option is to put in another tank that they just fill on request when they're already out at my place.
 
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kuraki said:
That works on the same principle but I believe it's slightly less efficient.



To reduce the expense of forging, I'm trying to get my Co-Op to install a fill connection on my 500 gallon tank, since I supplement heat with propane in my house. If I could fill my 20 lb tanks myself at 1.20 a gallon I'd be money ahead of an exchange. Exchanges here are about $15-20, or lets say $1/lb. There are 4.2 lbs in a gallon of LP, so off my bulk storage it's roughly $0.28/lb.

Second option is to put in another tank that they just fill on request when they're already out at my place.
Click to expand...

If i could get propane for $1.20 a gallon that would great. That's exactly what i need to do. I need to buy in bulk. I need to check into that. As it is, it costs about 15-20 dollars to fill a 20lb bottle here too. That's about $3.50 a gallon (or higher) and thats not economical at all.
 
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Go to Home Depot or Lowes and get a 100# tank. Have it filled at the local propane supplier. You didn't fill out you full location ( Canton, Akron, Columbus, or ?), so all I can suggest is Suburban Propane.

I made a wooden cradle that my tank sits on horizontal, and it fits in the back of the mini-van. There is a strap that holds it down tight.
 
Stacy E. Apelt - Bladesmith said:
Go to Home Depot or Lowes and get a 100# tank. Have it filled at the local propane supplier. You didn't fill out you full location ( Canton, Akron, Columbus, or ?), so all I can suggest is Suburban Propane.

I made a wooden cradle that my tank sits on horizontal, and it fits in the back of the mini-van. There is a strap that holds it down tight.
Click to expand...

To be honest, im not comfortable putting info on the net. Maybe its just me, but it makes me feel uneasy. Anyway. I was given that same suggestion by other people too, about the 100lb tank. I was considering it until i called a guy about filling the tank, i think he quoted me around $3 a gallon. I think he may not be the best deal in town though, so i'll check into other suppliers. If i could get a cheap rate on a 100lb tank fill, it would be worth it to buy a tank.
 
I would call around for pricing on filling a 100lb bottle first, the only reason I haven't done that is that our Co-Op charges the same rate they do for a 20lb bottle, so the only advantage for me is fewer trips.
 
There are several benefits to a 100# tank. The tank will not freeze up when running for long sessions is the biggest.

A 250# tank may be available from the home delivery propane folks where the truck comes out and re-fills it on site. In many places, these are the best deal for a small to medium size shop. You can run the shop heater off it, too.
 
kuraki said:
I would call around for pricing on filling a 100lb bottle first, the only reason I haven't done that is that our Co-Op charges the same rate they do for a 20lb bottle, so the only advantage for me is fewer trips.
Click to expand...

Yes, if i were going to use a smaller tank i would go with a 100lb tank. The problem though is that i will pay about $100 to fill it, and its only about 23 gallons. Forging only 4 hours a day i would spend about $250 each month that way. If however i buy in bulk i can get it at a much lower cost, and i could forge all day for that same price. I dont need to forge every day for 8 hours, but i dont want to pay $250 to forge only part of the day either.
 
Stacy E. Apelt - Bladesmith said:
There are several benefits to a 100# tank. The tank will not freeze up when running for long sessions is the biggest.

A 250lb tank may be available from the home delivery propane folks where the truck comes out and re-fills it on site. In many places, these are the best deal for a small to medium size shop. You can run the shop heater off it, too.
Click to expand...

I called amerigas. They quoted me just a little over $2.00 a gallon at current prices, but i need to buy at least 50 gallons to get that price, and to lock that price in i need to use at least 900 gallons a year. 50 gallons is about a 200lb tank, i think. Im going off of memory, and im not sure the exact tank size but it around there somewhere.
 
Actually now that i think about it. it may have been a 100 gallon minimum i needed to purchase in order to get the $2.00 a gallon price. I cant quite remember now. I know they told me the tank would cost over $100, and the first bill would be $200, or $240. Something like that. Either way, i think that's what i'll need to do. I'll need to buy in bulk, at $2.00 a gallon. Im not sure if i can do the 900 gallons a year or not, and if thats the case i wont have that price locked in, and i'll be at the mercy of fluctuating market prices. If the price goes up when i need to refill my tank, i'll be needing to wait till it goes down or willing to pay a high price.
 
Forging 4 hours a day is more than most full time large shops do. 900 gallons a year is a LOT of propane. I don't know that I use 900 gallons in 10 years.

You are overthinking this. Just get a 100# tank, fill it, and forge. Don't worry about how much it costs an hour, of a gallon. Just make blades, have fun, and work on quality. If you get your skills down, the money to re-fill the tank will come from knives you sell.
 
A 30K BTU Atlas runs about 14 hours on a 20lb. tank. I've spent years trying to make it the most efficient forge possible. It has almost no flame coming out of the front, but the infrared heat coming out will warm up your hand quickly.

I agree with Stacy that you are way overthinking this.
 
Stacy E. Apelt - Bladesmith said:
Forging 4 hours a day is more than most full time large shops do. 900 gallons a year is a LOT of propane. I don't know that I use 900 gallons in 10 years.

You are overthinking this. Just get a 100# tank, fill it, and forge. Don't worry about how much it costs an hour, of a gallon. Just make blades, have fun, and work on quality. If you get your skills down, the money to re-fill the tank will come from knives you sell.
Click to expand...

Maybe your experience is a factor. I'm still learning and I probably waste fuel in that process. Yes, perhaps you're right. Thank you.
 
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