Forged Blades! What next?

Stephen F

Stephen F

Joined
Sep 28, 2003
Messages
1,235
I, like many here, love the forged blade, bowies, fighters, utilities, hunters .... you get the picture. I think the ABS has done a wonderful job in promoting and developing this area of knifemaking. As a collector I have a wide variety of pieces in hand from many makers. I love them, some more than others admittedly, but I still have a passion for them.

But, and heres the rub, over the past few months I have started to ask myself where can I take the collection. What can I add to the collection that will increase its value to me. I have a few higher end pieces in the works, and that is always an obvious development, but I can't help feeling something is missing.

What do I think is missing? ........... Innovation!

I cruise the web looking for new designs, new angles, something that I have not seen before from the forged blade.

Study the books (eg. Points of interest) and magazines of old and you see alot of what we see today.

Don't get me wrong, I am not saying that stag carver southwest Bowies, or iron wood hunters are boring and outdated ..... they never will be. But if the ABS and the forged blade is to maintain its momentum, attract new collectors, and retain existing ones, there should be some complimentary evolution in my mind.

So ... how about some new award categories eg:

Most innovative use of materials.
Most Original design.
Award for technical achievement.
Annual Award for most Innovative Maker (voted for by registered Collectors).

Fire away fellas, tell me I'm wrong or add any new ideas to the pot.

Cheers,

Stephen
 
Stephen, I think that there are some new developments on the horizon that just aren't seeing the lower to mid range collectors yet. Steve schwarzer started it years ago with the powder damascus that we are starting to see other makers get into look at what shane taylor is doing with pictures. i think that the forged folder end of things is just getting underway with some of the new materials such as timascus being utilized more. This is just a couple of examples and my humble opinion take it for what it is worth.......Erik
 
There are a lot of innovative smiths.

Tai Goo
Ric Furrer
Jake Powning (Viking styles)
Al Pendray (Persian styles)
Bailey Bradshaw
Vince Evans
Don Fogg
J. Arthur Loose
Ulrich Hennicke
Ric Palm
Andre Andersson

To name but a few.
 
How about looking to the past?
Some of those classics in Flayderman's book are drop dead gorgeous.
 
As a relatively new maker, I'm just starting to develope something close to a "style". Innovation is very much on my mind, though. I think the proposed catagories would add incentive in the intended direction. One thing I find to be difficult yet very rewarding is making reproductions of classic early American knives. Technical Acheivement may apply here, I think. I like the idea. :) Lin
 
All excellent responses and Keith's list is spot on if you are looking for a knife beyond the norm yet with sound lines and design. Putting together a collection from each of those makers turning them loose with maybe an idea or maybe not would result in one very unique and beautiful collection. Some folks make fun of safe queens, but all of those makers create knives as functional pieces of art that could be put to work. That list would be a great start and there are others that you could easily add to keep you busy for more than a few years.:)

There are a lot of excellent makers that would love to have a commission based on some loose thoughts on the style or no input at all if you know their work well and feel it would work out better to turn them loose. Most have more fun making knives that way and the work reflects it.

I have had one knife by Tai for a couple of years that still stirs me as much now as when I first saw it if not more. Another semi recent knife of his that got to me was the topsy turvy integral Coop posted a while back. (I say recent since he has been making for around 30 years)

It is funny that I have a passion for traditional work (especially multiblades daggers and historic styles) and although I do own and highly appreciate a few bowie style knives, I prefer the more creative styles in larger knives.

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I guess I have started on Keith's list without knowing it considering what I have on order or have been pondering. It is going to take years for me.
 
Very good thread Stephen.
Don Fogg and Tai Goo would be at the top of my list for Innovation and Fikes also. I have made 40 - 50 forged bowies/fixed blades in the last 2-1/2 years and the pieces that were out of the norm or non-traditional were exciting and refreshing for me. I will be moving more in this direction as time and orders allow.

I do like a nice clean traditional bowie but I'm ready to move on to something different.

Bastid, that Goo bowie is super cool :thumbup:
 
I liked this post the moment I read it.

Fortunately, there will always be a place for 'traditional' patterns and clean, near-perfect fitments. That's the level one needs to elevate to to compete in today's forged market. That will remain home base.

But there always come a 'WOW!" factor knife that simply stops us dead with the work. That may come from a design or materials or the complexity of execution. Probably all three.

New versions of older, period work always excite me. I like the gadget factor (Really, Coop...? :rolleyes: ), and if it's fresh, its appealing.

And, sometimes less is more. Cool topic.

####

Gus, that bowie is a siren that sings out to me. WOW!

Coop
 
Stephen Check out the work of Christoph Deringer, I've always loved his knives. L.B.
 
Another couple of makers that do some pretty innovative things are Ron Newton, and for pistol knives, Bruce Bump.
 
Many of the names posted above (and some others) I would agree have demonstrated an innovative approach, and I am not for one minute suggesting that innovation is not part of the ABS/forged psyche.

What I would like to see is a formal recognition and promotion of innovation (such as the awards), together with explanation and discussion on why it is innovative. I would find that very interesting and an avenue I would like to follow in part of my collection. It may also help stimulate additional interest in the ABS.

Cheers,

Stephen
 
More than once now you've mentioned the ABS, twice in the first post! Is your interest in the ABS, or the "forged blade"?
There are other organizations than the ABS and makers who exhibit fantastic creativity beyond what many collectors have become accustomed to.
As avid as you are, I'll place a bet your serach will reward you with what you seek!
 
As others have mentioned, there are plenty of makers out there whose work strays from the traditional lines already well-represented in your collection.

The mention of Christof Deringer got me to thinking that I don't recall to very many full size integrals in your stable. Here is one of his (Bladegallery pic, I think):

orig.jpg


orig.jpg


Of course, there are a number of makers doing great work in this area, including Don Fogg, Burt Foster, Bailey Bradshaw, Don Hanson III and the Brazilians, to name a few.

And of course, there is much to explore in the world of forged blades beyond bowies (did I just say that?) including folders and swords.

Roger

Gus - thanks for another look at that fantastic Goo bowie!
 
Innovative designs are already rewarded by the market. Makers sure like an award, but what feeds them (and I hope satisfies them) is sales. Sales are the most hard-earned awards one can get.

In other words, creating a separate award would probably not change behaviors unless it changes collectors' tastes.

Personally, I don't value innovation for innovation's sake. It has to add something to the esthetics and / or convenience of the knife.
 
"Personally, I don't value innovation for innovation's sake. It has to add something to the esthetics and / or convenience of the knife."


Very well said!
 
I'm not sure I would characterize making historical reproductions innovative, but it has already been mentioned several times in this thread.

Can someone tell me what's innovative about making a viking sword that was designed 1100 years ago? What's so innovative about making integral mediterranean dirks similar to those made 300 years ago? What's so innovative about making civil war era bowies? Or traditional Brazilian Gaucho knives? There's nothing wrong with this, mind you, I just wouldn't call it innovative, even if only one or two guys are currently doing it.

But it does raise an interesting point. Some will tell you that there isn't a fixed blade knife on the planet that hasn't been made before, save for perhaps a wild and entirely unpractical fantasy knife or variation on an old design that merely substitutes materials or adds some embellishment.

And to a degree, they're right.

Ultimately, every knife still needs to have a cutting edge and a handle. There are established, highly refined designs suited to just about every imaginable cutting task out there, and it's very easy just to say that until you show me something new to cut, there's nothing new you can do with a knife. And quite honestly, a knifemaker can build a highly rewarding and fulfilling career making a whole lot of nothing new, and even flex his creative muscle while doing so - recombining various materials, choosing complimentary design features and color combinations, embellishments, etc.

But as difficult as it may be for the rest of us to imagine, there will always be a few makers that do something no one else has ever done or even thought of before. And then people will be saying "OK, other than that, there's nothing on this planet that hasn't been done before..." :)

These makers deserve recognition, and I agree that innovation should be encouraged by the community. New designs, new materials, new processes, and new accessories keep the market dynamic and vibrant. It benefits all of us.

As Joss mentioned, the financial incentive for innovation may be all the recognition some makers need. After all, licensing agreements and exclusivity can translate into significant financial rewards.

But some formal recognition from the knife community would be nice too. :)
 
"Theres nothing new under the sun................." Solomon




Where is that STeve guy when we need him??? :o :confused: :o
 
It seems that shorter knives could be an interesting alternative for the smiths :

- 'plain' lockback with forged blade and good looking stag ( or ironwood or 'your choice')
- 'personnal carry' models - (boot - hunter)
- forged danglers as the japanese makers made in the 90'

ELDE
 
tom mayo said:
"Theres nothing new under the sun................." Solomon
Click to expand...


“Learning and innovation go hand in hand. The arrogance of success is to think that what you did yesterday will be sufficient for tomorrow.”

~ William Pollard

"The greatest danger for most of us is not that our aim is too high and we miss it, but that it is too low and we reach it."

~ Michelangelo

:thumbup: ;) :D
 
"The individual, the great artist when he comes, uses everything that has been discovered or known about his art up to that point, being able to accept or reject in a time so short it seems that the knowledge was born with him, rather than that he takes instantly what it takes the ordinary man a lifetime to know, and then the great artist goes beyond what has been done or known and makes something of his own." Ernest Hemingway
 
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