Fretless Bass Questions

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Vivi

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I'm planning on buying a Fretless 6 string bass sometime soon. I had a couple of questions about them.

1. I was planning to purchase some flatwound strings so that the bass would have incredibly smooth slides. Does anyone know a good brand for 5 string basses they could link me to?

2. Has anyone here played fretless? I've only gotten to mess around with it for a few hours. I really like how it feels overall, but one area I feel it really excels in is fingertapping. It makes a huge difference for that. I've only been playing bass for half a year now, so I was kind of curious if going to a fretless this early sounded like a bad idea to anyone with more experience.

3. I'm probably over-thinking this one, but I had one question concerning fretting. When you fret a normal bass at say, the 3rd fret, your finger is under the dot on the side of the fretboard. If you play the 3rd fret on a fretless bass with your finger in the same position, wouldn't the note be wrong? Because the string is being held down by the dot, or in the very middle of the fret. On a normal bass, the string is held down there, but the fret in between the 3rd and 4th frets is where the string "ends" as far as the note is concerned. So on a fretless would you need to move your fretting finger down the board slightly to compensate? I hope this question made sense.

I'm reading about them all I can really. I'm pretty set on this bass because I'm in love with how it feels compared to a fretted bass and I know I want to buy a 6 string at some point. Found a nice 6 string fretless for 375$ and figured if I could kill two birds with one stone, why not?
 
I have been playing guitar for about 20 years and at one point had decided to buy a fretless bass; it ends up that I didn't, and sometimes I regret it. I think it depends on the type of music you play to know if it is right for you. I play mostly rock and metal on my electric guitar and if I needed a bass to go with it, I would stick with a good ole 4 string with frets.

A fretless bass with flatwounds does sound awsome though. I love the way the notes take a little longer to come to full volume than on a fretted bass. It almost sounds like you're doing volume swells.

It's been a while, but I think that you do have to compensate when "fretting" a note on a fretless.

A 6 string fretless is a pretty specific and specialized type of bass. If you are just starting out, I would recommend a 4 string with frets, then move up to the fretless. Check out Stu Hamm to see what can be done with a 4 string bass. That guy is awsome.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H8Q_J2fIKPI
 
You have to have good intonation when playing fretless bass. A lined fretless fingerboard will allow you to "cheat" a bit by eyesight, but you will be depending on your ears much more.
 
Thanks for the responses.

I guess I didn't mention it, but right now I've got a fretted 4 string bass I bought over the summer. Ever since I started playing guitar the concept of frets didn't appeal to me. I've always liked the sound of fretless, so after a while I started looking into them.

The one I'm looking at just has the dots for 3, 5, 7, 9, 12 etc frets on the side, no guide lines where frets would be. Those would help a lot. I've been going to a music store after work and playing it, seeing how well I adapt to it. It seems like it will be difficult, but I've got a lot of motivation to go for it. I really like the sound they offer, they feel so good to play and the price seems very fair to me for what you get (375$).

GCG, the good intonation aspect is sure to give me lots of trouble. Think it'd be good to look around for fretless bass lessons? I was thinking about trying to do that. I've never taken lessons but I could use some extra help if I do get this beast.
 
I would go with a 4 string as well. I play mainly on a stand-up bass and that is by default fretless but I have several other fretted instruments as well.

The neck on a 6 string is so big if you are not sure about where to put your fingers you will get out of tune with a quickness. Which really begs the question do you have any training or is your skill self-taught? Not that one is better than the other but by knowing the fingerings and understanding how they work together really helps when dealing with a fretless instrument.

I personally love the sound and fluidity of a fretless instrument there is nothing that can compare to it and you get so much more flexibility in the sounds that can be created.


Whatever you do good luck and keep on playing.

billyp
 
I had a fretless P-Bass for years, that thing was a blast to play.

Putting flatwound strings on a fretless bass makes absolutely no sense. Roundwound strings are already smooth up and down the neck, because there are no frets. If it's an issue with your fingers hurting, then you need to be playing more to develop callouses on your fingertips. The sound flatwound strings produce is never gonna be as good as roundwounds, and you're never gonna get that nice growling sound a fretless bass makes with flatwound strings.
 
I own a fretless jazz bass, been playing it for 3 years. In fact, its the only bass I've ever owned.

1. There is a lot of variety in flat-wound strings. Most people use flatwounds over roundwounds because they believe roundwounds dig into the fingerboard too much and shorten its life. That said, I know people that use roundwounds with no problem on a fretless. Anyways, I've used nothing but flatwounds on mine. I tried a couple brands but settled on La Bella nylon tape-wound strings. They are roundwound internally but covered with a thick heavy black nylon tape. The tape is so hard and smooth you would think it was steel if you weren't looking at it. They have a brighter sound than pure flatwounds, and are very easy on the fingers and the fretboard. And in addition to that, they look pretty cool.

2. I started with fretless bass, but I had 5 years of guitar experience at that point so it was no big deal. Moving to fretless without a lot of experience can be difficult, but it will make you a better bassist for sure. Personally I find 6-string more intimidating than fretless. 6-strings are too big for me and I have no problems with 4-strings.

3. Is the fretboard lined or unlined? Lined fretboards usually have the dots in the normal position. Unlined fretboards usually have the side dots where the fret lines would be. Developing proper intonation takes experience. You have to have a good ear and listen to yourself in order to learn to play in tune.

Also, make sure the bass is setup correctly or it will feel impossible to play. I put some time into mine adjusting the bridge height and truss rod to get the action as low as possible with minimal buzzing. I feel I can get the action lower on a fretless than on a fretted. With this setup, I can play my fretless bass faster than a fretted. I like to call frets "speedbumps".
 
I'm completely self-taught at this point. I was considering getting some lessons from someone when (if) I purchased this bass. I have played 6 strings before and feel comfortable with the neck size, so that isn't an issue with me. My friend has one I use whenever I hang out with him and I've played this fretless for about two hours now to make sure it was comfortable before I purchased it.

BillyP, I'm not entirely sure what you're referring to with the fingerings and positions. I figured with the Fretless I'd have to learn to compensate finger position for the lack of frets, then just practice a lot to get consistent with my intonation.

Speed, the reason I wanted to go with flats is because they're much smoother on slides and I figured they'd be easier on the fretboard of the fretless. My 4 string has rounds and they play fine for me. My fingers have the callouses built up so they don't bother my fingers like when I first started playing.

The fretless is unlined, with dots on the side of the fretboard. I think this is going to be my biggest issue with playing the fretless bass, is learning exact finger position and then getting to an extremely consistent level with it.

I've been reading about fretless and one of the things I came across was what you just mentioned, adjusting the strings so they sit real close to the fretboard. Anything else like this I should know that I might not find on websites?

I feel like frets limit what you can do with a guitar and make it more cumbersome to play in general. I won't be surprised if I develop my speed on the fretless better than on my 4 string.
 
Not to disuade you, but speed is just a matter of practice on any guitar. I'm assuming you're talking about speed of playing rather than speed of progress. I should know, I've been wanting to shred for years but I just haven't practiced like I should. So I'm stuck with playing like I did 10 years ago.

I also kind of fell into the trap when I started playing that some new piece of equipment will make better, faster, whatever.

I hate to post another youtube link, but here is what speed on a 4 string fretted bass sounds like after years of practice:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=veLGBk1mE5U&mode=related&search=

Not super melodic, but the point of it was the speed you are able to develop on that type of guitar.
 
DC, what I meant by my speed comment was that I simply find it easier to fret notes on a fretless, so my fretting hand will probably find it easier to play fast, do quick successive hammer ons / pull-offs and the like.

I agree with what you're implying, that equipment does not make the musician. Jaco played a beat up, self-modded bass most the time if I remember correctly. I started out playing my friends bass, then after getting interested enough in it looked for a guitar I knew we had in our house. Found my mom's old Alvarez acoustic from the 70's (The strings were that old too, horrible sound as you can imagine) and would practice all my basslines on that. Eventually bought myself my Ibanez 4 string for 180$ and barrowed my friends broken amp. Been using that setup since about a week ago when I traded my friend a safe for his old bass amp. The amp sounds much nicer, but it hasn't made me any better or helped me to further any specific techniques. You're correct in that it's all in the practice. Buying the fretless won't make me Sheehan, heck it'll probably slow my progress down until I get used to it...but I think in the end it'll suit me much better than fretted. I'm content playing either though.
 
You have to be on the fret lines to get the right note, on a fretted bass the dot is there because that is where the optimum point is to bend the string over the fret without buzzing (too far from the fret) or muting (too close to the fret)...However on a fretless it's gotta be right on the line.

I recommend ernie ball for any type of string or GHS boomers maybe, super simple strings not extremely expensive and middle lasting ability.

Good to see we've got other bass players on here ( I rock myself a 1994 Musicman 4 string sterling in sparkle white, go ahead be jealous!)
 
A note about fretting on a fretless....you want your finger to be just on the other side of the fret line, not right on top of it. The edge of your finger should be on the line, so the vibrating part of the string starts where the line is. The exact position varies a bit up and down the neck, hence a good ear is necesary. This also is tough if the intonation of the bass is off. This can be easily fixed and is important to set if you are buying a bass.

A good place for learning about bass is TalkBass.com forums. Basically bladeforums of the bass. A lot of very knowledgeable and talented people there, they've helped me a lot in the past.

A good page I've found on setting up a bass (with attention to fretless) is http://www.garywillis.com/pages/bass/bassmanual/setupmanual.html . Truss rod adjustments aren't that scary and are really necessary if you want your bass to play well. Guitar shops charge a few bucks for this but its worth it to learn to do it yourself.
 
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