G10 vs Carbon Fiber strength- Is there a definitive answer?

I used to fabricate both carbon fiber and G10 replacement scales for Sebenzas years before CRK offered their c/f scales. All things being equal, it seemed to me that c/f might have been a tad bit stiffer than G10. But not by much. Spec'd out at .150 thick, both are adequate to use on a frame lock. Another case in point, is that Strider frame locks used both c/f and G10 without the the use of a steel liner. Micarta, now that's a different animal. Might be good on a fixed blade, or with a steel liner, but it will not function alone on a folder.
For the average user, both c/f and G10 will offer years of dependable service.
 
K.O.D. said:
However, you never see linerless G10 handles, like you do with CF. That should be a hint to the strength alone.
Click to expand...
Actually you do. I saw someone already pointed out an example, didn’t read it all, but I can give you a good example…
The ZT 0452, comes standard in CF/Ti, and sprints in both Ti/Ti and G10 (liner-less) and Ti.
The full Ti feels the most sturdy, by far, but I think the G10 is a great balance between the strong Titanium and the light, flat, and kind of grippy (not to mention beautiful) Carbon Fiber. I heard the G10 was difficult to manufacture for that knife, (at least in 2017 when it was released) since it’s such a big piece, and this was when ZT was the king of F&F in a production knife….
I also have a 0450G10 sprint, with a nice slab of G10. It’s not contoured like the 0452g10, but it makes for a good work knife (I used one for about 5 months, and gave it to a friend, since I had another NIB.)
Enough rambling, but I like those knives, my 0909 is a beast in G10 also!
B6AD8245-8851-405B-8233-847633A71563.jpeg
 
Last edited:
sgt1372 said:
OP: Why do you need to know and why does it matter? Are you batoning your knife handles? 🤔
Click to expand...
^ this. I’ve never heard of either breaking (not talking about those gas station knives w/fake material). So I think it comes down to preference. G10 is usually more grippy, CF usually looks better (IMO), and is a smidge lighter.
 
Tonight I'll take a hammer to my Cheburkov Strizh and see how many hits it takes to break. 🤣
 
Is there a definitive answer other than it's probably better than wood ?

NO !

Sources, sellers, and suppliers ain't talking either.

You might get a hint if you find yourself batoning or maybe not?

I love the stuff however for the life of me I can't vouch for the quality or tell you what grade it may be. I am not even familiar with the grading standards other than I do know there is a grading and type identification system for these materials you can find it if you really look but it still won't tell what type of stuff you may or may not have or even where it came from.

It seems mums the word as far marketing that information to the masses.
 
Last edited:
Barry H said:
Micarta, now that's a different animal. Might be good on a fixed blade, or with a steel liner, but it will not function alone on a folder.
Click to expand...
Says who? Both are linen micarta. The only steel in these are whatever is used for the lock...

eGlKlKS.jpg
eReY3jj.jpg
HGCepnw.jpg

 
It depends. It's like a SAK... drop a 74mm, all good, 91, might have crack.

I have never considered this, honestly... I remember how many did not buy the Crucarta PM2 because of that little nub of linerless micarta. Have any of the nubs broken? If you told me I needed to do a lot of hard cutting with a PM2, I would not hesitate to grab the Crucarta.

To me, a knife that is ergonomic is ergonomic. Scale change/texture can affect this, but USUALLY will not make/break the ergos, I have the smooth G10 Cruwear Yo2 and the rougher, normal G10 20CV Yo2. Yes, in practice, the normal G10 wins out, as the smooth has slipped one time versus zero times, but they make not a ton of difference, as the knife is the knife.

@Arathol Wonderful knives. I would not hesitate to use linerless micarta on an EDC. It is "relatively" strong stuff. I also use linerless FRN, GFN, Ti and Alum.
 
JohnnyGalt said:
I've seen car chassis, airplane wings, mountain bike frames, etc. made out of CF. I've never seen a similarly stressed component made from G10.

Based on that I'd conclude CF is stronger and more versatile.
Click to expand...
Carbon fiber is an umbrella term for many different type composite with carbon base. While G10 is a more specific group of glass composite.

Glass fibers have been used in the exact application that you named for a long time because they have other properties. glass composite has low thermal and electric conductivity, considered to be insulation. Meanwhile, carbon fiber is good at it.
 
sgt1372 said:
OP: Why do you need to know and why does it matter? Are you batoning your knife handles? 🤔
Click to expand...
Why does anyone need to know the differences between S30V, s35VN, and s45VN steels? Why discuss at all, if they are all good enough? Curiosity, as @DocJD pointed out.

Still not seeing much in the way of definitive answers, maybe it has never been tested with published results. Like the other threads I found on this topic, many replies are that both are simply good enough. Again, I'm wondering which is stronger and tougher (not lighter nor prettier), the strongest/toughest G10 or the strongest/toughest CF.

Has anyone had CF chip or splinter after dropping it? G10 will dent if given enough pressure, not sure how CF behaves. @marrenmiller, thanks for pointing out that CF is stronger along the fiber directions. Any idea if the CF matrix would come apart or deform if enough pressure is applied in other directions?

Edit: from looking around online, I found that R/C helicopter and airplane enthusiasts debate this as well. Most conclude that CF is lighter and stiffer, but will break before bending, whereas G10 is 40% heavier and will flex and dent before breaking. Still finding nothing conclusive about which is ultimately stronger/tougher in regards to my original 2 questions, which were:

1. Suppose you have 2 slabs of equal size, G10 and CF. If equal pressure were applied to the middle of each, which would break (not just bend) first?
2. If both slabs were dropped from the same height (say, 20 feet) onto concrete, which would suffer the most damage?
 
Last edited:
I like both products equally. The G10 I've used is definitely harder than any CF I've used, also heavier. It takes a little more work to sand it. That doesn't make it tougher, but would probably hold up better to scratches, gouging, or dents from being droped. As far as strength goes, I don't know. All i know is if you have a good product in either choice, you can't snap a 1/4"x1/4"x3" piece with bare hands....they're both plenty tough. Wieght and cost are the biggest differences.....looks is a matter of opinion. Both can be equally beautiful.

There's not a definitive answer unless your comparing two exact products to each other....but generally speaking between g10 and cf probably not.
 
kreole said:
Unfortunately you can't just say to compare a slab of g10 and a slab of cf because they aren't standardized or constant in manufacture. I'm not sure why you would call the average because the range of both are so large.

For example, weave cf is certainly different in strength than shred cf.

For another, Spyderco puts more layers of glass weave in the Military 's g10 than standard g10 has to bump up the strength and rigidity to counteract the size and lack of liners.
Click to expand...
Well, I did specify weave CF in my original post. In case there IS such a wide variety that they can't be compared based on average compositions, I've added this to the question: Which is stronger and tougher, the strongest/toughest G10, or the strongest/toughest carbon fiber? Surely they can be compared.
 
jux t said:
Still finding nothing conclusive about which is ultimately stronger/tougher in regards to my original 2 questions, which were:

1. Suppose you have 2 slabs of equal size, G10 and CF. If equal pressure were applied to the middle of each, which would break (not just bend) first?
2. If both slabs were dropped from the same height (say, 20 feet) onto concrete, which would suffer the most damage?
Click to expand...
I already did answer your first question. Can I assume you are referring to a three point bend test? Put simply, strength is the ability to withstand a load without deforming or breaking. A typical carbon fiber weave composite with a similar volume fraction of fibers and similar matrix material is going to be notably stronger than glass fiber weave composite. It'll also be a fair amount stiffer, meaning it will deflect less for a given load. There will be differences in properties between different fiber types for each material, but I've never heard of carbon fibers that are less strong or stiff than glass fibers.

As for the second question, neither material will do well in this scenario. Assuming the pieces land in a manner that loads the fibers compressively in the plane of the material, and the fiber volume and matrix are similar, I'd assume the CF will take slightly less damage. It is also less dense, so the loads applied from falling onto a hard surface will be a bit less :)
 
Last edited:
marrenmiller said:
I already did answer your first question. Can I assume you are referring to a three point bend test? Put simply, strength is the ability to withstand a load without deforming or breaking. A typical carbon fiber weave composite with a similar volume fraction of fibers and similar matrix material is going to be notably stronger than glass fiber weave composite. It'll also be a fair amount stiffer, meaning it will deflect less for a given load. There will be differences in properties between different fiber types for each material, but I've never heard of carbon fibers that are less strong or stiff than glass fibers.

As for the second question, neither material will do well in this scenario. Assuming the pieces land in a manner that loads the fibers compressively in the plane of the material, and the fiber volume and matrix are similar, I'd assume the CF will take slightly less damage. It is also less dense, so the loads applied will be a bit less :)
Click to expand...
Thanks for the insight, and yes I'm talking about a 3 point bend test. In that type of test, just to be clear, you would expect G10 to break (not just bend) before CF?
 
Last edited:
I'm reading various sources that say CF knife handles can chip and crack if dropped, while G10 will not. Anyone experience cracking, chipping, or splitting with CF?
 
jux t said:
I'm reading various sources that say CF knife handles can chip and crack if dropped, while G10 will not. Anyone experience cracking, chipping, or splitting with CF?
Click to expand...
I used to have a piece of an Indy car body in carbon fiber that flew off after a crash. Where it broke along the edges it did split and splinter. It doesn't break in a clean line, it will have splinters like wood that are pretty small and sharp, one could easily end up in your finger. I've never seen a piece of broken g-10 to compare what the breaks that do happen actually look like. This would of probably been about the strongest of carbon fiber, along with airplane wings and such. Doesn't really say anything about your original question, yet it did tell me how carbon fiber breaks when it does. Many types of carbon fiber are made strictly to look nice, like a nice piece of marbled carbon fiber, and are going to be less tough than a tight weave, but you already know that.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top