Gerber made in the US?

[Hiro-kun]

That's a fair question. My answer is yes, absolutely it's a valid comparison. Because yes, there are a lot of custom fixed-blade knives made from S35VN or better with beautiful custom sheaths available for even the $500 "sale" price. By the way, for a fixed blade S35VN is very good if you want stainless, but not necessarily best depending on the application. There are plenty of knives that have the same qualities that are in stock and available at knife stores right now. However, for that price and type of knife I don't think delivery time is important at all. Knowing I'm paying big $$ for a knife that will potentially last a lifetime, I have no problem with waiting for it to arrive if I have to. A $500+ knife (custom or not) is not an impulse buy for me.

Thanks for your well-thought response.

What about ensuring continued support? You implied that the price of these knives should mean they should last a lifetime. Most custom makers are individuals with limited lifespans. Busse is an obvious exception, being an corporation, but it is much smaller and worth much less than Gerber, which is owned and backed by Fiskars, an even larger company. Gerber also has been around for nearly 70 years. Large, long-lived, diversified corporations have a very good record of continued existence. The smaller the company, the greater chance it will fold. This means that Gerber is far more likely to be around long enough to service any warranty claims than any individual maker or small company. Is this fact worth consideration? Frank Centofante is a custom maker who died not too long ago. Who do owners of his knives turn to for problems?

 

[Hiro-kun]

Hiro, I think the 9 points you make are valid. Particularly point #1. I think the fact that it was posted in this thread is indicative of the opinion many knife nuts have of Gerber which is exactly the challenge I'm saying Gerber is faced with, but you're rebuttal is valid nonetheless.

9 points...hmmm...now I'm curious...do you work for Gerber?

No, I do not work for Gerber. I doubt Gerber employs many people in Ontario. I am not even a particularly big fan of the brand in general; only checking up on their new stuff from time to time because I judge products on their merits, not on where they come from. I have a strong dislike of opinions based on irrational reasons and I think Gerber gets treated unfairly here because of those poorly-formed opinions. It's way too easy for people here to jump on the Gerber-hate bandwagon because we're essentially knife-hipsters and enjoy looking down on popular stuff (does anyone here carry a $1,000 custom and a dollar store knife just to be "ironic"). When they do things that pretty much every other American company does to boost profits, they get shit on. Even when they do something that knife enthusiasts find favourable, they get shit on anyway, like this thread when someone posted the recall.

Also, implying that someone supports or is against something because of an alleged financial incentive to discredit their arguments is a fallacy and doesn't address the actual arguments. It's just so you know so that you don't treat it as a valid debate tactic.

 

[TheGearGuy]

I agree that Gerber has the ability to stand behind their products and I expect that is one advantage they can bring to the table with them. For me it is not one of the factors I consider in this case simply because I sharpen all of my own knives and a fixed blade is not going to have parts break like a folder. If we're talking folding knives, I would have a different view on warranty availability. Specifically regarding the higher quality folders I see Gerber coming out with, this is indeed important. For a high-end fixed blade though, I have never sent one to a manufacturer and although you never know what life will bring, I presently don't imagine I ever will.

Since you mention Frank Centofante I feel compelled to say to anyone reading this, Frank made some great knives and was a great influence on the knife world in general. RIP Frank!

 

[TheGearGuy]

No, I do not work for Gerber. Also, implying that someone supports or is against something because of an alleged financial incentive to discredit their arguments is a fallacy and doesn't address the actual arguments.

You seem offended by my question. I'm sorry. I wasn't trying to imply you were arguing for Gerber only due to financial incentive. Actually, my question stems from the fact that you came up with such a good argument on behalf of Gerber with an awful lot of facts and that is unusual. Especially around here . It seems like you might have had a first-hand knowledge of the company in some way....that's all.

I appreciate what you're saying. I too buy knives based on the merit of the knife and not necessarily the company that made it. The reluctance you may sense from me to buy into Gerber's new products despite my hope that they improve is like this...if a car company like Suzuki were to introduce a luxury car that I thought was great looking and awesome on paper, I would wait a year to see that the kinks were worked out based on the products I've experienced from them in the past. Gerber IMO has had a history of making low quality knives I do not care for. Now that they are starting to make something I'm wiling to look at I am going to proceed with caution based on experience until I know the quality is actually very good.

You seem to be very analytical as I am. If you buy one of these new Gerbers, I'd sure like to know what you think after you use it a bit. In fact, if you get one and tell me it's good I'll buy one on your word and try it for myself. :thumbup:

 

[Hiro-kun]

You seem offended by my question. I'm sorry. I wasn't trying to imply you were arguing for Gerber only due to financial incentive. Actually, my question stems from the fact that you came up with such a good argument on behalf of Gerber with an awful lot of facts and that is unusual. Especially around here . It seems like you might have had a first-hand knowledge of the company in some way....that's all.

I appreciate what you're saying. I too buy knives based on the merit of the knife and not necessarily the company that made it. The reluctance you may sense from me to buy into Gerber's new products despite my hope that they improve is like this...if a cat company like Suzuki were to introduce a luxury cat that I thought was great looking and awesome on paper, I would wait a year to see that the kinks were worked out based on the products I've experienced from them in the past. Gerber IMO has had a history of making low quality knives I do not care for. Now that they are starting to make something I'm wiling to look at I am going to proceed with caution based on experience until I know the quality is actually very good.

You seem to be very analytical as I am. If you buy one of these new Gerbers, I'd sure like to know what you think after you use it a bit. In fact, if you get one and tell me it's good I'll buy one on your word and try it for myself. :thumbup:

No need to apologize; I'm not offended by your question. See my addition to my last post. Allegations of financial interest are very attractive arguments to use in debates, so even otherwise rational people can be lured by them. I can see from your posts that you are a fairly rational person and do not necessarily mean any malice towards me. My arguments are purely based on some assumptions and facts about businesses and consumer behaviour and my own reasoning. I'd love to be proved wrong on any of these points because it would help me learn flaws in my own knowledge or reasoning skills.

As for the knives themselves, I haven't really given much consideration to the new folders, because I don't really like serrations, lockbacks, or Americanized tantos and each of these folders have some combination of these. The Ghostrike is the most interesting to me, mostly because of its very flat profile in the sheath, which means I can carry it very discreetly as an EDC without having a folder taking up pocket room. I don't have it yet because I'm waiting for a good deal, I haven't seen the knife on sale anywhere yet, it's availability in Canada is rather low for a Gerber, and I'm a patient person.

 

[Hiro-kun]

Here's the corresponding Canadian recall for the Cohort. Note that it names the Chinese manufacturer of the knife: Yangjiang Andeli Kitchen Knives Enterprises Co., Ltd.

Information about which companies in China manufacture for Western brands isn't always easy to come by, so this name might be a good one to file away for future reference.

 

[jonnyt16]

Man I really like the newest version of their Air Ranger. I think they are just calling it the Air Ranger Black. Very nice knife. Classic Bill Harsey design. Does anyone know if this one is made in the US or not?

 

[Hiro-kun]

Man I really like the newest version of their Air Ranger. I think they are just calling it the Air Ranger Black. Very nice knife. Classic Bill Harsey design. Does anyone know if this one is made in the US or not?

The answer appears to be "no". In their most recent catalogue, knives made in the USA are marked with the US flag. The Air Ranger G-10 does not have a flag. Incidentally, the previous aluminum Air Ranger (in the same catalogue) is not made in the US either. It is made in Taiwan, or at least was at one point in history.

 

[jonnyt16]

The answer appears to be "no". In their most recent catalogue, knives made in the USA are marked with the US flag. The Air Ranger G-10 does not have a flag. Incidentally, the previous aluminum Air Ranger (in the same catalogue) is not made in the US either. It is made in Taiwan, or at least was at one point in history.

Yeah, after a little research I found that this new version is made in China with 7Cr17MoV steel. Too bad.

 

[Macchina]

Here's the CPSC record on this recall.

To put this recall into perspective:

1. The Cohort is not a US-made Gerber. Bringing up this recall in a discussion about US Gerbers is hardly relevant except as an attempt to induce a "horns effect" on other's opinions of Gerber.
2. The recall was done on the basis of six reports of lacerations, out of a total of 150,000 knives manufactured.
3. Recalls are decided on users' self-reporting, so it's certainly possible the users were being idiots.
4. The wide availability of this knife means that a lot of people have this knife, probably far more so than most models favoured here in BladeForums.
5. The Cohort isn't a knife marketed to knife enthusiasts. It's marketed to people who need a knife and don't have particularly strong opinions about brands.
6. A large number of owners who don't expect much from a knife except that it doesn't hurt them means more reports of defects are likely to be made.
7. The Spyderco Tenacious caused a laceration to a well-known YouTube reviewer due to loose retention. No one brings this up whenever Spyderco is discussed.
8. Knife enthusiasts generally have strong opinions about brands. This means when a failure or accident occurs, they may give the benefit of the doubt to brands they like by blaming their own clumsiness and not report them. Nutnfancy did not appear to report the problem directly to Spyderco.
9. This means less popular knives would naturally have fewer reports and thus fewer recalls.

Wait a second... You brought up a failure of a Spyderco Tenacious in a thread about Gerber's???

 

[Hiro-kun]

Wait a second... You brought up a failure of a Spyderco Tenacious in a thread about Gerber's???

It's an example about how unfairly Gerber is treated by some people here. This thread is about US-made Gerbers which are actually well-designed and well-made products for their intended purposes. Another poster drops a link to a recall of a Chinese-made Gerber, without commentary, to cast a negative light on all of Gerber's products, despite the fact that Gerber's US-made products are seldom, if ever, recalled. No one ever does this kind of thing with such apparent eagerness in discussions of brands that a lot of people here like, even though there are publicized failures of these brands.

So, sorry, but you did not manage to catch me in a contradiction. For the record, I own and EDC the Tenacious' smaller version, the Persistence, and bought it even after learning about Nutnfancy's accident. I understand product failures are generally not the norm, but some people think that failures of specific Gerber products can be generalized as an indication of the quality of their other products.