Gerrymandered

Sorry, forum just erased my post and I'm not going back.

1, Please apply for a lobbying fee from Montana State Democratic party
2. I did not tell you who to vote for in your own state, despite Byrd's sending great big fat pork round barrels home. This thread was about Gerrymandering, not munk corruption, of which I'm reminded there is much.
3. Taking votes out of context are called 'campaign ads'. See note number one for action.
4. If I have to vote for crook A, against crook B, I will vote Republican. Why?

Because the democrats are going to let the Federal tax breaks expire by 2010 if they have a majority. It really doesn't matter then, if Tester is the third cousin to a man who once saw a picture of Jesus; I won't do it. The Democrats have no Terror War plan, other than objecting to the Republicans. They want to either pull out of Iraq now, or give the terrorists a nice timetable.

Forget it. Not to mention they oppose most reasonable abortion restraints, like parental notification, and who could forget their resistance to partial birth abortion??!!

The Big business thing is a red herring. Both parties support 'big business' and if we'd wanted to have trade sancitons against China by now, We'd have done so- Congress was controlled by the Dems for 40 years. Or is it only now, when they have no chance of passing these measures, they can afford to promote them to the public eye??!!

Not to mention gun rights, or the lack thereof under the Dems.

Nope. Not on my watch. It was probable to be a 1960's Democrat, or an 70's; but those who still are are not my....common view.


Oh, AND ONE MORE; the last 'democrat' to go against the party line, Joe Lieberman, had to run as an independent. His party would not support him. What chance does Tester have???? You really think Tester's objection to high taxes will matter??!!
munk
 
hollowdweller said:
I'm just saying I'd rather vote for somebody with a good stance on guns who stands up for the American worker than somebody who can be bought.
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You know of a politician who can't be bought? Why the hell did that person become a politician? I just don't believe that concept HD. There are NO politicians that aren't bought and sold that I've ever heard of. :yawn:
 
munk said:
Sorry, forum just erased my post and I'm not going back.

1, Please apply for a lobbying fee from Montana State Democratic party
2. I did not tell you who to vote for in your own state, despite Byrd's sending great big fat pork round barrels home. This thread was about Gerrymandering, not munk corruption, of which I'm reminded there is much.
3. Taking votes out of context are called 'campaign ads'. See note number one for action.
4. If I have to vote for crook A, against crook B, I will vote Republican. Why?

Because the democrats are going to let the Federal tax breaks expire by 2010 if they have a majority. It really doesn't matter then, if Tester is the third cousin to a man who once saw a picture of Jesus; I won't do it. The Democrats have no Terror War plan, other than objecting to the Republicans. They want to either pull out of Iraq now, or give the terrorists a nice timetable.

Forget it. Not to mention they oppose most reasonable abortion restraints, like parental notification, and who could forget their resistance to partial birth abortion??!!

The Big business thing is a red herring. Both parties support 'big business' and if we'd wanted to have trade sancitons against China by now, We'd have done so- Congress was controlled by the Dems for 40 years. Or is it only now, when they have no chance of passing these measures, they can afford to promote them to the public eye??!!

Not to mention gun rights, or the lack thereof under the Dems.

Nope. Not on my watch. It was probable to be a 1960's Democrat, or an 70's; but those who still are are not my....common view.


Oh, AND ONE MORE; the last 'democrat' to go against the party line, Joe Lieberman, had to run as an independent. His party would not support him. What chance does Tester have???? You really think Tester's objection to high taxes will matter??!!
munk
Click to expand...

Thank you Munk. I am so happy to read this post. You know I agree with every letter. Sometimes when I think I can spit an elegant rant all I have to do is read your stuff, and know I am a neophite. Thanks again. That one is a slam dunk.:thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:
 
Corruption?
I don't think it would be productive to get into that. For instance, I like John McCain, but he was in the scandal Keating 7. Does that mean he is corrupt?
Not neccesarily. I'd rather not go there. I think Bush's stance on the war on Terror is principled despite justifyable criticism; does that make him corrupt? (and no, I would not vote for McCain, unless he were running against Hillary)


munk'
 
Yeah, lol; that's me, Andy, the 'elegant rant'!!

it's good to have fun. It's near election and lets keep it happy.


munk
 
I heard John Kerry told a really funny joke yesterday..... Its probably not worth repeating. John Kerry isn't funny.
 
munk said:
Sorry, forum just erased my post and I'm not going back.

This thread was about Gerrymandering, not munk corruption, of which I'm reminded there is much.
munk
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Munk,

Definition of Gerrymandering:

Definition:

try to get extra votes unfairly: to manipulate an electoral area, usually by altering its boundaries, in order to gain an unfair political advantage in an election
Click to expand...

I think I debunked your assertion that Montana was being gerrymandered by the democratic party in my first or second post in this thread.

If Montana has a commission that determines districts that has an equal number of members appointed by each party, and none of the wild shaped varying population districts we tend to associate with gerrymandering are allowed under that law, then how can you say your district was gerrymandered?

So far I have stated facts as to how the state of Montana voters have passed laws to limit gerrymandering. You on the other hand have said there is a difference between the law and how it is applied but provided no examples, no facts other than that you don't like the outcome.

Also you said:

I did not tell you who to vote for in your own state, despite Byrd's sending great big fat pork round barrels home.
Click to expand...

I'm not telling you who to vote for just discussing the issues. Besides if you don't really have a problem with Burns getting 5000 bucks from out of COUNTRY donors, surely you can indulge me, a fellow citizen and allow me to discuss politics in your state.

I'd be super glad to discuss Byrd with you, or any other WV politician and give you specific examples of bills or legislation:thumbup:
 
aproy1101 said:
You know of a politician who can't be bought? Why the hell did that person become a politician? I just don't believe that concept HD. There are NO politicians that aren't bought and sold that I've ever heard of. :yawn:
Click to expand...

So you don't think that the ethics of a congressman is a relevant campaign issue?
 
Hollow, A republican lost his district- it no longer exists. The boundaries were redrawn, and a whole lot of conservative voters are now attached to solid Democratic blocks where they can change nothing, while several urban areas are not more readily open to democratic party efforts. You did not 'debunk' anything. You looked at our committee system. A committee is a group of people subject to the same pressures as the rest of us.

munk
 
hollowdweller said:
So you don't think that the ethics of a congressman is a relevant campaign issue?
Click to expand...

I think that the ethics of a congressman is a function of a campagne of coverups by his side and smears from the opposition. The congressman himself, by his nature, after you boil off all the sludge and lay bare the true form is bad. All of them since Davey Crocket marched off to die in the Alamo. I vote for politicians who seem to have interests to guide the country in such a way that I think is beneficial to America, and to my family.
 
Ah hem; except I was talking about Montana, and my life, with my friends here in the forum.

Hollow, I counted the heads by hand in the 100 seat state house, and there are 60 democrats. I presume the remainder are mostly Repub but there may be a 'Constitution Party' rep in there, or other. This was of 2005 and does not include anyone dying, moving to Reno, or being assassinated byt he CIA to keep the Twin Tower conspiracy locked.

But this is going the wrong way.
I've made some inquirees and will actually keep you appraised on what I'm learning. It is all new to me.
To understand North Eastern Montana, you need to know that counties basically run south - north. Long and box shaped. Prior districts here went pretty much by county shape. The new 'district' I'm in, is longetudinal? Across 200 miles and 3 or 4 counties. It was done to include Fort Belknap in the district already established over a hundred miles to the West of me, where Rocky Boy Reservation is.

There is nothing wrong with the two reservations having their own district!!!! They probably need it. This allows Fort Belknap to vote with Rocky Boy, the prior district.
But the same move peeled away the large conservative band of rancher farmer folks north of of the Mo river to US Route 2. We are talking a huge swath of land.
This left the County seats along Route 2 more vulnerable to democratic party inroads.

About the commission; it is 2 dems and 2 repubs and a mod. But something fishy happened last time. I'm still finding out. The County Clerk's office is calling me back sometime past two. It was challenged to the Montana Supreme court and lost. Now, if you believe that somehow makes something 'right' then....we arent on the same page.

I really wish they'd drawn a dotted line between the two reservations and left me where I was in Phillips county.

munk
 
Lads,

All I mean is that here and elsewhere, people I like and respect are increasingly taking the occasional whack at each other. I understand why - I'm a political animal too, and trade whacks with the best of them, when an election comes up in my turf.

Gerrymandering happens. So does greed, corruption, backstabbing, mudslinging, and pork-barreling. If someone could translate the number of the beast into a single word, it would probably be something like "politics."

Having lived and worked close to various politicians, I can confidently say that many actually want to serve the public, but the primary reason for parties to exist is to gain and exercize power. With notable exceptions, governance happens as a by-product.

I don't think there's a better option than representative democracy, but we must keep in mind that our political institutions etc. are intended to express the views and wishes of the community ... and the community both pre-exists and out-ranks politics.

t. (gently stepping down off soapbox)
 
Hollow's my friend.

I don't know what else to say, except that if he were in my house now, we'd probably be both sweating over this computer screen trying to dig up more on reapportionment.

Now, HERE IS A REAL GRIPE; I'm on my FOURTH computer in 12 years. This one was never intended to be the prime box, but the kid's learning tool. It stepped up to that role when Big Box died. Do you know how long it takes to download a screen with this box? I can eat lunch between requests.

munk
 
munk said:
Ah hem; except I was talking about Montana, and my life, with my friends here in the forum.

Hollow, I counted the heads by hand in the 100 seat state house, and there are 60 democrats. I presume the remainder are mostly Repub but there may be a 'Constitution Party' rep in there, or other. This was of 2005 and does not include anyone dying, moving to Reno, or being assassinated byt he CIA to keep the Twin Tower conspiracy locked.

But this is going the wrong way.
I've made some inquirees and will actually keep you appraised on what I'm learning. It is all new to me.
To understand North Eastern Montana, you need to know that counties basically run south - north. Long and box shaped. Prior districts here went pretty much by county shape. The new 'district' I'm in, is longetudinal? Across 200 miles and 3 or 4 counties. It was done to include Fort Belknap in the district already established over a hundred miles to the West of me, where Rocky Boy Reservation is.

There is nothing wrong with the two reservations having their own district!!!! They probably need it. This allows Fort Belknap to vote with Rocky Boy, the prior district.
But the same move peeled away the large conservative band of rancher farmer folks north of of the Mo river to US Route 2. We are talking a huge swath of land.
This left the County seats along Route 2 more vulnerable to democratic party inroads.

About the commission; it is 2 dems and 2 repubs and a mod. But something fishy happened last time. I'm still finding out. The County Clerk's office is calling me back sometime past two. It was challenged to the Montana Supreme court and lost. Now, if you believe that somehow makes something 'right' then....we arent on the same page.

I really wish they'd drawn a dotted line between the two reservations and left me where I was in Phillips county.

munk
Click to expand...

Munk,

The two dems and two republicans have to pick the 5th member right?

I'll be interested to find out what your research yeilds.

Since it's public information I assume you could somehow access the redistricting commissions report and see what their rationale was for doing it.

Here in WV we have in 2006 21 Democrats and 13 Republicans in the Senate, and 68 Dems to 32 Reps in the House.

Both Senators, and all but 1 congressperson is a democrat. We are losing population so I think we lost a rep here a few years ago.

Our redistricting is more subject to gerrymandering than yours:
http://www.wvsos.com/elections/offices/districts.htm

But Dems enjoy such an advantage in registered voters there is not really that much of an incentive to manipulate districts.
 
munk said:
Hollow's my friend.

munk
Click to expand...

Yeah nobody think we are in some sort of angry argument. We just enjoy going back and forth :thumbup: We're kind of like the two lawyers that argue against each other in court and then leave the courtroom and go chop trees down;)

But I DID actually send $25 to the Tester campaign:thumbup:
 
No worries then. I'm a bit jumpy, from watching the usual low-level games of political tag on another forum I frequent erupt into something quite different. I dunno if it's going to be the same place after, but here's hoping.

Computers? Wish they built them as well as Yangdu's khuks. I'd buy a Chiruwa AK analogue in a heartbeat, and relax. But like most consumer products, computers are intended to break down, so you'll keep buying more.

t.
 
Well, just because there was a stink about the 'commision' doesn't mean it stank to high heaven. Only dead skunks do that, right?

In Blaine county, my former home, there was a write-in candidate for sheriff. Much like me misspelling, 'sherriff', people who did not capitalize his name had their ballots thrown out. On and on- Florida, eat your heart out. Anyway, despite getting an overwhelming popular victory, the candidate lost- In the Montana Supreme Court.

munk
 
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