Grinding and the hours in a day

GDOK

GDOK

Joined
Feb 4, 2011
Messages
115
Hi all,

I'm new to the knifemaking biz. I've spent the last year or so getting the experience I need to cut with end mills.

Now I need to cut with grit. Because of that, I've wondered, is there any grinding service out there? I've heard I can hire a CNC grinding company to do it but with a huge part minimum and a few limbs on the invoice.
I'm looking for 10-50 blades to start.

If not, what do I need in a grinder? The standard seems to be 2x72 using blaze belts or similar ceramic, but how about horsepower? I *can* pay for the best, but that leaves me with enough money in my pocket to buy a classy going-out-of-business sign.

So would the $750, 1/2hp Kalamazoo do it, or should I aim more toward a Bader or Burr King?

Thanks for reading! Looking forward to any replies
 
I'd be very surprised if you could pay for someone else to do it and still make a living yourself after they have made theirs.

If you stay in business for a while then the cost of the grinder gets spread over all the knives.

I have 1.5hp on my 2x42, I wouldn't go lower. Buy a 2 or 3hp 3 phase motor and variable frequency drive speed control, as it will save you time in the long run.

If you have time and a milling machine and skills you could make a really nice GIB grinder http://www.polarbearforge.com/grinder_kit.html.

If you have more money than time, or can make more money making knives using it in the build time, (ie opportunity cost calc) buy a tw90, kmg or similar. If I had the money it would be the tw90 due to the flexibility it offers.
 
hahaha "I need to grind the heck out of a batch of blades, will 1/2" horse power do that" NO. do you understand the mechanics of how a basic machine like a grinder works? production setting 3 to 5 horse or more. Speed control or multiple machines one slower for finer grit one as fast as you can get it for hogging. After working in a production atmosphere on 3x136 belt 5 horse motor machines, you need to be able to rip steel away and at the same time make a precise grind.
 
imho, get a 4x36 belt sander. start with a inexpensive one from sears. wonderful for small blades. is also the standard for the lapidary(rocks and jewels) folks. you can find belts from 24grit to 1000grit. have yet to find a wet/dry 800 grit silicon carbide belt in 2x72 size, half a dozen sources in 4x36. finish sand a blade with 800 grit wet and you are ready to polish. you can get a functional unit for <$150, get used to what it can do, then buy a upgrade. for rough shaping and profiling, a metal bandsaw and bench grinder works a whole lot faster than a 2x72 grinder with a 36grit belt and you are not eating belts.
if you must have a 2x72(so you can be like the other big kids) look at wilmont grinders, hand made in the usa. definitely get variable speed, high speed is great when doing rough work with a coarse belt, but you need to slow down when using finer grit(>100) or all you will be doing is eating belts.
again, IMHO.
 
This thread truly highlights the misguided mindset of many in the knife business and some prime examples of the misguided advice you get here at Bladeforums. I'm not saying there isn't good advice at BF. I learned to make here, but you have to have a filter, and prospective to filter the posts.

Get the going out of business sign. Its a good investment for a knifemaker that isn't going to learn how to use a grinder.
 
To make knives efficiently, you need a high quality grinder (TW90, KMG, etc) and a lot of skill and patience.

Most grinders start at around $2,000, and go up from there. A grinder from Lowes isn't going to work for heavy production.

You might be able to find a few guys to grind blades for you, but it would be very expensive.
 
I honestly had no idea there are bladesmithing courses so close by. Very tempting. I know I won't be going there next, but I doubt I'll be able to stay away
 
Yeah, definitely. The TW90 is definitely #1 on my list but there's no way I can afford it quite yet. Maybe in a few months, but as you can imagine, no grinder, no sales, no TW90. All in time though. What's the benefit of 3-phase? I know in mills reduces some vibration and offers automatic spindle reversal, but for grinders?
 
scott.livesey said:
imho, get a 4x36 belt sander. start with a inexpensive one from sears. wonderful for small blades. is also the standard for the lapidary(rocks and jewels) folks. you can find belts from 24grit to 1000grit. have yet to find a wet/dry 800 grit silicon carbide belt in 2x72 size, half a dozen sources in 4x36. finish sand a blade with 800 grit wet and you are ready to polish. you can get a functional unit for <$150, get used to what it can do, then buy a upgrade. for rough shaping and profiling, a metal bandsaw and bench grinder works a whole lot faster than a 2x72 grinder with a 36grit belt and you are not eating belts.
if you must have a 2x72(so you can be like the other big kids) look at wilmont grinders, hand made in the usa. definitely get variable speed, high speed is great when doing rough work with a coarse belt, but you need to slow down when using finer grit(>100) or all you will be doing is eating belts.
again, IMHO.
Click to expand...

I've used a 4x36 in the past but sold it. Just not the right size for grinding IMO
 
With a 3 phase motor you can set it up with a variable frequency drive to control speed.
 
A good grinder is like a good woman....... No matter how hard you lean into it, it will still be there for you to lean a little more.

A 4X36 with a large enough platen is great for flattening handle materials, but not worth much past that.

A quality 2X72 with all the bells and whistles will take a knife maker to the next level, regardless of where your skills are.

WORD............... Robert
 
phephq said:
Yeah, definitely. The TW90 is definitely #1 on my list but there's no way I can afford it quite yet. Maybe in a few months, but as you can imagine, no grinder, no sales, no TW90. All in time though. What's the benefit of 3-phase? I know in mills reduces some vibration and offers automatic spindle reversal, but for grinders?
Click to expand...

Variable speed and

reversible on a disc grinder
 
What 1234 said........................

2x72 variable speed for a multitude of reasons you already know. The Kalamazoo is very workmanlike. I bought one to use in a surface grinder conversion to belts. It will do the job for you but not like a 1.5 - 2 hp Bader, KMG, TW90, GIB, No Weld and so many other 2Xs. Save yourself pain and money. You might get lucky on Craigslist btw. I got my Kalamazoo on there for $200.

Reversible 9" discs are spectacular too.

Good luck.................. be patient

Syn
 
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