Gross motor skills versus targeted strikes

[KaliGman]

Do you think your training has a big part in your ability to overcome combat stress?

Yes it does. Training helps a lot. That is why the SWAT and military communities say "Train hard, fight easy." Years of martial arts and law enforcement training have helped me considerably in regard to being able to function in real life situations.

I will say, though, that real life is different than training. I have found that, in a lot of ways, you do actually "fight as you train." When things are for real, though, it is a different feeling than even the most stressful training environment. Once someone has gone through the real stuff a couple of times, they often will "settle down" and be able to function much better in real life situations. The best people I have ever worked or trained with have had lots of training and real world experience. I see a lot of people who are instructing who lack one or the other of these criteria. You can work on the street or in the military for years, have survived, and have very crappy technique and a false sense of superiority and security. You can also have very nice, clean, classical technique that you have practiced for years in a martial arts academy that may not work on the street and have a false sense of security and superiority. I think the best instructors in combative arts are those who have significant training and have experience using their arts in real life, as these are the people who can best prepare their students for what they have to face. This is not to say that you can't be a good instructor without fighting for your life at one time or another. I'm just saying that having some guy try to smack me upside the head with a 2x4 did wonders for my "blunt impact weapon" training regimen.

 

[Pahtoocara]

I will say, though, that real life is different than training. I have found that, in a lot of ways, you do actually "fight as you train." When things are for real, though, it is a different feeling than even the most stressful training environment. Once someone has gone through the real stuff a couple of times, they often will "settle down" and be able to function much better in real life situations.

Interesting that you make this distinction. There is definitely a difference.

I've always noticed, breathing helps alot. If you are "going towards the gunfire" sort-of-speak or even literally, breathe...breathe...breathe... it helps the nerves and your fighting efficiency.

 

[shangchi108]

I was taught that it's all about technique. Technique, technique, technique. (I study Wing Chun, by the way.) If you focus on perfecting technique, then learn to adjust technique to whatever random things you may encounter, you will eventually accumulate experience and (hopefully) successes in applying your system of fighting to real-world situations. But that only comes with experience and training as realistically as possible.

As far as gross motor skills vs. finesse, I'm not sure I understand the controversy. You need to learn to crawl before you can walk; you need to learn to walk before you can fly. If someone finds that some system using gross motor skills serves them well in whatever situations they find themselves (or put themselves) then more power to them. If someone wants to attain a higher level of skill and is interested in being able to defeat high-level fighters (instead of just the usual unskilled barroom brawlers that you meet in (of all places) barrooms) then more power to them, too.

What's the controversy? Does someone think there's another way?

 

[Derek24]

Hmm, my wing chun instructor thought the opposite. It's 90 percent mental and 10 percent technique. Not saying we didn't focus on technique, we did, but his thinking was that in the street, no matter what style or technique you know, it's the mental/will that will get you out of a sticky situation - technique is the supplement. I guess he thought along the lines of Don Pentecost and from his own experiences on the street.

 

[Pahtoocara]

Derek24 your idea might have more in common with shangchi108's idea than you think. Your training should address both mental and physical aspects at the same time.

The only think I might disagree with shangchi about can be summed up in this quote. It's from Tony Blauer in his interview reference "Stress Inoculation" in the October 08 issue of Black Belt magazine. This guy knows what he is talking about.

What many trainers and students don't realize is that there's a huge difference between basic performance anxiety--or fear--that's generated when they're training and physiologically induced fear when they're really fighting. People often talk about fear and heart rate and complex motor skills, not realizing that there's a huge difference between complex-motor-skill deterioration created by anaerobic stress and what can happen to skills created by a fear spoke. The problem is, you can't replicate a fear spike in training, so you need to have a classroom-type session on fear and self-coaching.

Note he says, "anaerobic stress" and not aerobic stress. Anaerobic can be summed up like this: your bodies ability to produce power in the absence of oxygen. This is EXTREMELY important during real fighting. Some "martial arts" workouts might not address this properly. It's not just about knowledge of techniques or skill level in the MAs, it's very much about anaerobic conditioning.

 

[stabman]

What's the controversy? Does someone think there's another way?

Not really a controversy, more of a matter of focus.
Should you start one before the other? Should you start them at the same time? What should you do in a training program with a limited time-frame?
If the arts are a lifetime thing for you, and if it's mostly for self-improvement, it probably doesn't matter too much, as eventually you'll get there.

 

[Derek24]

I think I will still stand by sheer will and determination, Pahtoocara. The ultimate question will be, "do you want to live or do you want to die." Adrenalin dump or not, your mental/mind can take over and you'll bite, spit, rip, whatever, to get out of that sticky situation. Fear will set in, no doubt, but I think we have to learn to get mad and determined to stay alive as well.

Granted, anaerobic conditioning is important, really important, but not the sole factor. My sheer will and determination will pick my ass up off the ground and give me the power to get the hell outta dodge...especially if we're dealing with knives.

 

[Pahtoocara]

Granted, anaerobic conditioning is important, really important, but not the sole factor. My sheer will and determination will pick my ass up off the ground and give me the power to get the hell outta dodge...especially if we're dealing with knives.

I definitely think there is something to be said about sheer will power. Some call it heart, guts, balls or whatever... but your ability to keep on going in spite of the circumstances. I think we agree more than we disagree actually.

I think having good conditioning helps you keep a clear mind giving the ability to act swiftly and surely. With proper mental conditioning, it helps you to harness fear and utilize the adrenalin dump. It also helps you to deal with the aftermath of the adrenal process, especially if you are exposed to numerous critical incidents.

 

[Derek24]

Yes, I can see your point about having good conditioning to help you keep a clear mind, giving the ability to act swiftly and surely. I use to see that a lot watching tennis matches between Jimmy Connor and John McEnroe (the good ole days of tennis).

I think their mental conditioning helped them through a long winded point many sets into the match - especially when all their reserves were tapped out. Similar concept without the adrenalin dump, unless there's a story of a player pissing his shorts in the middle of a point somewhere in the annals of tennis history, lol.