Handle Shaping

[colu41]

What grit belts are recommended for shaping the handle flush with the tang?

Also, I will be starting my first batch of knives soon, without bolsters of course. I'm not quite ready for those yet. Anyways, I was also wondering, to you guys (for knives without bolsters) do any finishing on the handles before you epoxy? Because the top end seems it would be hard to do without botching the blade. And what thickness handle is common? I had a few chunks of ashwood just a little over a 1/4" thick and they seem a little bulky when I threw them on a practice knife.
I can tell its going to take some practice with the handles and shaping them to not looking like a bulky block of wood.

 

[T.Saslow]

To do the initial contouring of the handle, I would use a fresh 80 grit belt or 120. Always use a fresh one of you can EASILY burn the wood or other material. When you contour it, keep the belt about a 1/16 of an inch away from the tang or so. The flat spot between the tang and the beginning of the contouring will be rounded over when you do final hand sanding. I NEVER use the grinder to do anything other than initial contouring. When you they to do finer work with it, there is a. Chance you will takeoff to much to soon. As for pure glue up sanding, if your plan on having any bevels on the handle leading to the ricasso, (I hope you understand what I mean) always...ALWAYS do that shaping and fine sanding before glue up. If you don't, you risk scratching up the ricasso when you DO go and shape it. Aha for handle thickness, 1/4" is right around perfect in my opinion. You just got to get the contouring right. My mentor thought me about ab"CC" grind which basically means either side of your handle looks like a c. That is what i find most comfortable. Hopes this makes sense! Experiment though, make your own contours and see how you lime them. Good luck, hope to see the knives on the forums!

Tanner

 

[colu41]

To do the initial contouring of the handle, I would use a fresh 80 grit belt or 120. Always use a fresh one of you can EASILY burn the wood or other material. When you contour it, keep the belt about a 1/16 of an inch away from the tang or so. The flat spot between the tang and the beginning of the contouring will be rounded over when you do final hand sanding. I NEVER use the grinder to do anything other than initial contouring. When you they to do finer work with it, there is a. Chance you will takeoff to much to soon. As for pure glue up sanding, if your plan on having any bevels on the handle leading to the ricasso, (I hope you understand what I mean) always...ALWAYS do that shaping and fine sanding before glue up. If you don't, you risk scratching up the ricasso when you DO go and shape it. Aha for handle thickness, 1/4" is right around perfect in my opinion. You just got to get the contouring right. My mentor thought me about ab"CC" grind which basically means either side of your handle looks like a c. That is what i find most comfortable. Hopes this makes sense! Experiment though, make your own contours and see how you lime them. Good luck, hope to see the knives on the forums!

Tanner

Hey thanks. That helps a lot. I see a lot of tutorials on youtube and it seems most people go right down to the tang on the grinder and I don't feel comfortable with that yet. My steel comes in this Saturday so I hope to finish a few blanks this weekend. Then I still have to find a local heat treater but, other than that, I'm ready to finish some knives!

 

[T.Saslow]

NICE! can't wait to see them! good luck with the handles too. what material are you planning on using? Woo, Micarta, G10?

 

[logem]

I grind the scales all the way to the tang after glue-up.

I'll remove the bulk of the scale with coarse grits like 60 - 80 grit and leave about a 1/16" from the edge of the handle tang. Then I grind all the way until I just touch (or am a "hair" away) from touching the tang with a 120 grit belt. I then finish the profile with progressively finer grits, often to 30 micron. This removes any scratches on the tang profile and makes the scales perfectly flush with the edge of the tang.

The key is using new sharp belts, especially in the finer grits, to avoid burning your handle material.

 

[Matt Rochester]

I do about the same as logem. I finish the top or ricasso end all the way. Then glue and screw/pin them on. I make sure it squirts out all the way around so nothing can get between the handle and tang. If you wait till the epoxy gets kind of gummy you can peel it off the ricasso and it comes off clean. I sand all the way to the tang with 60 or so then to 220 and up. I use the slack belt running perpendicular to the blade(if that makes sense) to get in the hard to reach spots. Use separate belts for wood and steel. Dive on in.

 

[colu41]

Thanks guys. Very good tips. And BackyardCrafter I have some semi exotic wood scales to start, and I'm also holding off until I get some blanks heat treated and ordering some more high grit belts and some Micarta from UsaKnife.

 

[T.Saslow]

I grind the scales all the way to the tang after glue-up.

I'll remove the bulk of the scale with coarse grits like 60 - 80 grit and leave about a 1/16" from the edge of the handle tang. Then I grind all the way until I just touch (or am a "hair" away) from touching the tang. I then finish the profile with progressively finer grits, often to 30 micron. This removes any scratches on the tang profile and makes the scales perfectly flush with the edge of the tang.

The key is using new sharp belts, especially in the finer grits, to avoid burning your handle material.

I agree with what you are saying from an experienced knife makers standpoint. However, from what Colu has been saying, i get the impression he is just staring out and for him to start out doing something as precise as this may be a little much. I wouldn't risk it. Once you feel comfortable with the grinder and your ability to get accurate lines with it, then i would try. Run some tests, see what you like.

Also, i love to hear that you are using exotic wood honestly, i like the composite materials but there is something about the exotic woods that is just....Beautiful. Don't be scared to use other materials though, you would just have to get a respirator and take a shower after sanding I especially like, Leopard wood, Dalbergia Spruciana (good luck findin' that one!), and Bloodwood. Leopard wood has some really nice patterns to it also. looks nice with brass bolsters and/or brass pins

 

[Fiddleback]

You have to dry fit and shape and sand to finish the fronts of the scales before attaching, just as you assumed.

Use new 36 grit belts to shape handles. Anything finer than that and they clog. Do all the rough shaping with the 36, then put on a 120 and lightly go over fine tuning the shape, and removing any 36 grit scratches from the tang. Then go to a scalloped edge 220 grit belt. CAREFUL not to wrap it over the ends or pause long enough for it to dig in. After that its ready to have the spines trued back up then go to hand sanding. At each grit, hit the pins so that they are level to the surface, and the deep scratches are removed at machine.

The key with handle shaping at the grinder is to use a light touch. I pull a stool over and sit with my face a foot from the wheel while doing this. Only the first few passes with the 36 grit on an 8 inch wheel use any force. Those passes are to create the hollows and estabolish the swell.

Lastly, for the first several hundred knives I used files for the majority of the work. You really have to have the shape in mind, and a procedure for getting there in order to shape them completely at the grinder. I used to make the two hollows and estabolish the swell, then move to files. I discovered this bit and that bit that were obvious waste, and started removing that at the grinder. Eventually it became easy to do it all at the grinder.

 

[T.Saslow]

yeah, but belts are expensive (at least the yare for me...) and thats why i do hand sanding. also, you could just use an 80 grit and a rubber block to clean out the belt. works like a charm and makes the belt last a lot longer.

 

[colu41]

I agree with what you are saying from an experienced knife makers standpoint. However, from what Colu has been saying, i get the impression he is just staring out and for him to start out doing something as precise as this may be a little much. I wouldn't risk it. Once you feel comfortable with the grinder and your ability to get accurate lines with it, then i would try. Run some tests, see what you like.

Also, i love to hear that you are using exotic wood honestly, i like the composite materials but there is something about the exotic woods that is just....Beautiful. Don't be scared to use other materials though, you would just have to get a respirator and take a shower after sanding I especially like, Leopard wood, Dalbergia Spruciana (good luck findin' that one!), and Bloodwood. Leopard wood has some really nice patterns to it also. looks nice with brass bolsters and/or brass pins

I have a set of leopard wood and bloodwood scales. They are amazing. And for $3 a set! Bell Forest is a great place. I also have, birds eye maple, zebrawood, and ebiara. I want to do some simple black handled knives too but, the only decent options I see is black micarta or extremely expensive african blackwood.

 

[colu41]

You have to dry fit and shape and sand to finish the fronts of the scales before attaching, just as you assumed.

Use new 36 grit belts to shape handles. Anything finer than that and they clog. Do all the rough shaping with the 36, then put on a 120 and lightly go over fine tuning the shape, and removing any 36 grit scratches from the tang. Then go to a scalloped edge 220 grit belt. CAREFUL not to wrap it over the ends or pause long enough for it to dig in. After that its ready to have the spines trued back up then go to hand sanding. At each grit, hit the pins so that they are level to the surface, and the deep scratches are removed at machine.

The key with handle shaping at the grinder is to use a light touch. I pull a stool over and sit with my face a foot from the wheel while doing this. Only the first few passes with the 36 grit on an 8 inch wheel use any force. Those passes are to create the hollows and estabolish the swell.

Lastly, for the first several hundred knives I used files for the majority of the work. You really have to have the shape in mind, and a procedure for getting there in order to shape them completely at the grinder. I used to make the two hollows and estabolish the swell, then move to files. I discovered this bit and that bit that were obvious waste, and started removing that at the grinder. Eventually it became easy to do it all at the grinder.

Thanks fiddleback. Awesome info. Tomorrow I will be getting in my CPM 154 and 1084 so I hope to make a few blanks. Still doing some handles on a few practice knives so I'm ready.