heat treating 1095?

N

nc527

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Mar 22, 2009
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Im a newb knife maker, and am going to be making a couple knives out of 1095. How should I ht and temper with minimal tools such as a charcoal forge, moter oil for quenching, and a oven for tempering. What exactly should i do.
 
If your dead set on it, here's a really shadetree, backyard, hillbilly, surefire, method...grab some table salt, and put a line of it on your knife shaped steel mid blade up... next slowly heat till the salt begins to melt like snow. The salt happens to melt at the same temp that 1095 needs to be quenched at!) Ditch the motor oil for a gallon of mineral oil/canola oil/ATF any of these is better than motor oil. however by the time you pay for these, you can add 15-20 dollars and buy a gallon of proper fast quench oil from McMaster-Carr. DO THIS! your quench medium is THEE MOST IMPORTANT ITEM in knife making other than the steel itself!) When the salt starts melting fast...quench. have your oven preheating to 400º - 450ºF Clean and wash off the quench oil and with soap and water. And start tempering for 2 hours 2 times letting it cool to ambiant air temp between cycles. The blade will come out around 58 - 60 HRC.

Jason
 
Thank you Jason!

I’ve got 4 KSO’s sitting here in 1095 waiting for a heat treat. Nice KISS solution to my problem. For the curious the melting temp of table salt is alleged by the interweb to be 801’C or ~1474’F right at the soak temp Kevin recommends for hardning 1095. Somebody aught to add this to the Hypereutectoid Steel Sticky.

I’ll second Erin’s comment by saying order some 1084FG from Aldo the roll date is set and it should ship/arrive late August. ~$26 per 5lb bar .25”x1.5”x 48” delivered. Makes it cheaper than the 1095 I got from Jantz.
Ray
 
I was just told by a Respected Chemist on these forums (Fitzo) that only PURE sodium chloride (NACl) melts at that temp. here I'll qoute him...
The melting point of 1475F is for very pure sodium chloride. Any time a compound has impurities present, the melting point is lowered.
Usually, common table salt isn't pure sodium chloride, but is often iodized and/or has other constituents added to make it flow properly in a shaker.
Any adulterants like these will lower the melting point. Just how much is difficult to predict offhand.
Thus, if one wants to use salt melting temperature as an accurate indicator, one needs chemically pure sodium chloride to get the best accuracy.
Click to expand...
sotake that for what it's worth and double check the temp with a multimeter...

Jason
 
wouldnt canning salt be more pure, B/C it doesnt have iodine or anything. also do you mean put a line of salt along the entire knife, or just a pile in the midle of the blade.
 
I usually put a "coke line" (for lack of a better analogy) right down the middle lengthwise. about 1/8 - 3/16" thick and bring it up to temp slowly.

Jason
 
NC527
I was thinking Kosher ,flake size might be an issue, or another non iodized salt, canning salt might have anti-clumping agents in it. The Kosher salt I just checked has an anti-clumping agent I’ll check the grocery store maybe a cheaper brand doesn’t or ground down water softener salt?
 
Jason, will a charcoal grill type fire bring it up to this salt melting temp?
And do you just set the blade on the charcoal, or elevate it off of them, like on the grill.....how many beers does this process usually take?
 
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A charcoal grill is designed to get meat to 500-600F. A charcoal forge is designed to get metal to 2000-2400F. As you can see, they are not the same.
Google Brake Drum Forge, for some ideas on building one on the cheap.
http://www.anvilfire.com/index.php?...m&titleName=anvilfire.com Blacksmithing FAQs
The charcoal is not the briquettes that you do hamburgers over, either. Forging coal is easier to get ,and cheaper, than real wood lump charcoal.

Look into building a propane forge if you really are serious. They can be built for less than $100.

Stacy
 
I have used Kingsford charcoal briquettes and a hair dryer with a paper towel tube wrapped in tinfoil to make a impromptu, makeshift, MacGyver forge. and have achieved around 16-1700ºF with it. I just arranged the briquettes to get maximum coverage. Then laid the blade on top of the briquettes, swtiched on the hair dryer and heated... I dont drink but I'd guesstimate it took me about 2 mountain dew cans worth of time...(approx 10-15-20 minutes)

Brake Drum Forges Work Great By The Way! Stacey is right, The right tool is a must.
but when that isnt an option, one must improvise adapt and overcome

Jason
 
thats kinda my setup, I have a pit in the ground That i dug, its like a dakota fire hole, with another smaller hole, wich I insert a link of pipe into the big hole, from the smaller hole. Then I put the airhose in the pipe. just google dakota fire hole to see what my setup is, except for their version, it has a big hole between the two holes, mine doesnt. Would vegtable oil work for quenching?
 
JasonSCarter said:
Ditch the motor oil for a gallon of mineral oil/canola oil/ATF any of these is better than motor oil. however by the time you pay for these, you can add 15-20 dollars and buy a gallon of proper fast quench oil from McMaster-Carr. DO THIS! your quench medium is THEE MOST IMPORTANT ITEM in knife making other than the steel itself!)
Jason
Click to expand...

See above previously qouted tirade/rant about quenchants...

Jason
 
nc527, I'd suggest ordering a gallon of 11-second quench oil from McMaster-Carr, price wise it's hard to beat, and they ship mighty fast! However, if you absolutely want to heat-treat right now, then I'd say go to Wal-mart, or Checker auto, and get a gallon of the cheapest ATF you can find. One of ATF's primary jobs is to remove heat from the tranny, so it's going to be closer to ideal than most other household oils. But you are much better off using proper quenching oil! It really defeats the purpose of putting all that time into shaping and grinding your knives, just to heat-treat it with an unknown result. For example, if you use ATF, Canola, or Motor oil, and your knife won't hold an edge (or even sharpen), what are you going to change? Did you get the knife below proper temp,or too hot, or was the oil too fast or not fast enough? By buying the proper quenching oil, you cut the number of variables in half right away! It's well worth the investment (in both time and money), and in the long run the only thing it hurts is your patience:D
 
Jason, bad word choice I ment to say Walter answered the question. You wouldn't be interested in some BBQ or cleaning your shop in return for heat-treating some 1095 would you?
 
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