Help Me Understand the Aftermarket

To sum up the secondary market I can only say a couple of things:

First and foremost is it exists because of you and I. We fuel the fire for better or worse.

Second does serve a purpose. You cannot get any non current models anywhere else. Period. Which is the other 999 models ever offered.

Last but not least is the hunt. You can either enjoy the hunt or lament about the price. I prefer to enjoy. It's only money! If using and collecting $200.00 to $2000.00 dollar knives is your hobby for any length of time the secondary market is probably your old friend already. The market is what it is and on any given day the knives are going to bring what they bring.
 
I can understand the frustration but it is just the nature of the beast .I am not sure why someone would buy something for a price and keep it in mint condition and then 7 years later sell it for the price they paid minus shipping ,is that what you would expect? Silver goes up and down Gold goes up sometimes fast and sometimes slow ,I don`t think I am the only one that thinks that Busse knives are like Gold that you can get a buzz on and cut open a car with !! Compared to Busse combat other good quality knives just don`t match up ,just try and see if you can buy a kabar USMC combat knife ( a fine knife ) chop up a cinder block and throw it into a car hood and then see if you could to sell what is left for near what you paid, on the Busse side you could just strip the coating sharpen it and sell it for $30 less than you paid and have the guy who buys it will thank you more than twice.

I feel like I need to add something .
Some of the guys around here will give awesome deals and do it over and over again. There are some great prices on the exchange right now !!Get them before the prices go up!!
 
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There are some good replies here about the 2ndary market, it's purpose/use/pricing and the sales practices of some of the folks who both are and aren't still present in the "community".

My $.02:

I'm inclined to put the price discrepancy in hideously simple terms: Every knife model that comes from Busse Combat (and family) is, by definition, a limited run. Yes, the Satin Jack has been released 3 times (that I can recall), but all 3 iterations are significantly different...Satin Jack, Satin Jack Tac, Boss Jack (sorry I have no pics, just my original Satin Jack).

If you combine "limited run" with proprietary steel, and/or the proprietary heat treat (SR 101, S-7) on these knives, you have a product that holds it's value like nothing I've seen. Mind you this is for the production pieces. Wanna talk about the Custom Shop products or "special runs"?

Yeah, the aftermarket is expensive and it seems a bit odd that a used knife can fetch it's original sale price.

Quite a few folks have no idea who I am (I don't post much any more), but I've been around Busse Combat and it's products as a custom sheath maker since the late 90's. I've been privileged to work on some truly amazing hand-made and high end production knives in the intervening years from a wide variety of makers, and I've found that the Busse product is worth every penny if you do your due diligence before getting your wallet out. These knives are made to be used and used hard. Never seen one that was used up.....
 
Havoc550, if you want to buy some new rare model Busse knives, keep them mint for ten years and sell them back to me at what you paid, please send me email

PS I'm also looking to buy a new 1971 Hemi Cuda at the ornigal MSRP if you have one =)
 
I don't think I've ever seen forums members overcharging for INFIkin, its more of a community here IMO. If it's been out of production a while, then it's understandable that a seller may ask a higher price; that's just the nature of the beast. The only place I've frequently seen people charging higher than retail for a currently offered model is ebay, and I've made a habit of informing sellers when they make this mistake:D And as far as prices fluxuating at different times of the year, Nov, Dec, and Jan are usually the best times for blade bargains, due to people recouping their losses from holiday overspending lol.
 
While I was blasting away on Battlefield 3, I was wondering where this thread was headed. BTW, the latest and greatest plasma TV's can still get burn-in. I've had the BF3 hud stuck in the bottom right corner of my screen for the past 3 days. The TV was broke in correctly, and the screen gets wiped for 2 hours after each gaming session. ARRRGGHHHHHH!!! That's a discussion for another time.

However, I have a better understanding now of whats taking place. I blame it on my own ignorance of the Busse line and hypocrisy as I have been paying wayyyyyy too much for classic SOGs in the last few months. I know, Busse > SOG, but there were some models I wanted since I was a kid and now they are mine.

Regardless, none of this positive information helps out my bank account. I did get a TM-DSF user a few days ago that will actually get used, but I doubt that is the last of the users I will buy. I have this problem with using brand new knives, its a sickness or something, but I will overcome it.

Seriously though, thanks for all the info. It looks like at least one new guy learned about the custom shop in this thread, so that's a good thing. All the Busse staff has been great, I have been dealing with Garth and Lexi in particular. I can't wait to see what these Busse's do in the wild!! I have an Alaska trip coming up, so that would be the perfect place.
 
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You are probably aware of this already, but it's worth repeating. One of the reasons Busse knives do hold their value...even the users, is that the fantastic Bussse warranty stays with the knife for the life of the knife from owner to owner to owner...to owner, etc.! As if the knife itself will ever need it as tough as a Busse is, it is great to never have to worry about it.

Getting users is cool, and absolutely nothing wrong with that...but there is something about being the first... I "christened" a new B10 today, in fact...and it was sweet! :cool::thumbup:

BTW, 'gratz on the DSF. Great knife!
 
Havoc550 said:
While I was blasting away on Battlefield 3, I was wondering where this thread was headed. BTW, the latest and greatest plasma TV's can still get burn-in. I've had the BF3 hud stuck in the bottom right corner of my screen for the past 3 days. The TV was broken in correctly, and the screen gets wiped for 2 hours after each gaming session. ARRRGGHHHHHH!!! That's a discussion for another time.

However, I have a better understanding now of whats taking place. I blame it on my own ignorance of the Busse line and hypocrisy as I have been paying wayyyyyy too much for classic SOGs in the last few months. I know, Busse > SOG, but there were some models I wanted since I was a kid and now they are mine.

Regardless, none of this positive information helps out my bank account. I did get a TM-DSF user a few days ago that will actually get used, but I doubt that is the last of the users I will buy. I have this problem with using brand new knives, its a sickness or something, but I will overcome it.

Seriously though, thanks for all the info. It looks like at least one new guy learned about the custom shop in this thread, so that's a good thing. All the Busse staff has been great, I have been dealing with Garth and Lexi in particular. I can't wait to see what these Busse's do in the wild!! I have an Alaska trip coming up, so that would be the perfect place.
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Hey Havoc550, when ya coming up??? Where are going???
 
Jaxx: Good point about the warranty, I didn't think to factor that in. I need to break in some of these badboys, I know, I KNOW!! But not the Halloween Gladius!!

RussMo: My brother and I have been up there 3 times in the last 18 months. I love that place, I have really been considering selling everything I can't easily bring up and leaving Texas for good. Nothing wrong with Texas, I love this state, but I have been here all of my 34 years and hate the heat. There is something special about having a snowball fight in 6 degree weather in shorts and a t-shirt.

So far, two of my trips were during early October, the other in February. I stayed at the Hotel Alyeska on the October trips and made the rounds from Anchorage down to Seward. I mostly just take in the scenery and hike. I love Crow Pass!! I wanted to try it in the winter, but that wasn't possible. Our next trip may be in late February, early March. We will most likely stay at Alyeska again, but ski this time. I haven't skied since I was 18, so its going to be hilarious.

And BTW, I consider anyone living in Alaska to be one of the luckiest people in the word. That place is so amazing, period.
 
My advice is to go to Garth before buying anywhere else. The wait times are greatly exagerated.I have never waited a year for a knife directly from the shop, including models that have been"discontinued' for several. Three months is about average. It will save you 1/3 to 1/2 the price. The exchange should be your last resort.
 
Hmmm. I'm not an expert, but I'll throw my $.02 in. As some have already chimed in...Bussekin are great knives with a great warranty. That counts for a lot. I put a premium on lifetime warranties. On things were a lifetime warranty only extends to the original owner, there is no way I'll pay close to full price or more on the secondary market. Others are less critical on that point.

Secondly, is the nature of Busse--limited availability. If you could buy a Fatty SFNO or saber ground HHFSH any ol' time, most folks wouldn't be able to the get mark-ups they charge. So if you 'gotta have it,' pay the man and don't whine. Nobody says you have too. I do understand your point on knives currently being offered from one of the companies tho...in those cases with mark-ups, I think its just catering to those that don't like to wait. And sometimes people want something that has a little pre-lovin' so they won't be afraid to use it that first time (make it a safe queen).

Thirdly, multi-hundred dollar knives are luxury items. This isn't a discounted household staple item such as untensils that you can by at any retailer. I suspect the VAST majority of knife owners have never even heard of Busse, let alone would pay for one. There's probably a cajillion more $45 Buck 119 Specials out in the woods and fields than there ever will be Busses for that reason. Bottom line: People who can drop hundreds of dollars on knives WILL pay hundreds of dollars on knives, especially if they suffer from some form of blade addition and/or impatience. Is this a form of exploitation? What do you think? This has seems to have tapered off a bit with the economy tho.

Fourth: Standard SOP, particularly with Busse: Mark it up. It's accepted as common practice. IIRC its not uncommon to see something to the effect of 'AT COST' as a big selling banner. Often times people jump on those deals...ie to pay the same as what they could have purchased directly from Busse, cuz this IS often times, a good deal.

I'm sure there's more to be said, but its an interesting marketing model. Busse isn't the only one to control to some degree the market with throttling the supply (look at diamonds)...also taking into account of course, that Busse is a small company, they have a finite production capacity as well...and good knives take time to make. Those of us old enough to remember when the Miata first came out--huge markups. I seem to remember seeing a Dodge Viper marked up like 50% when they first came out (and if you didn't like it, you could leave).

Busse probably isn't the worst example either: Look at Hinderer...people are in some cases are all but paying a kidney for one.

There's probably more insightful analysis to be had, but those are my basic observations/opinions.

BOSS
 
Another thing to consider is user review's which, no one can do until the knife arrives. Some may pass on a current offering and later read a review and decide, dang........... I wish I would have got one when they were available as that is what I was looking for in a knife. Now they go to the exchange and depending on how many were actually ordered, they have to try and compete with another, who also decided dang........................... I wish I would have got in on that. The most recent good example would be the CABS and even though it was offered for a long time, I see more and more folk's wanting one since it get's great review's as a skinner and bushcrafter however, there are not that many coming up for sale. I have one and do not want to part with it however, if I did decided too, it would be at a price to ease my mind about selling it and even then, I know I would regret doing so no matter what it brought in profit. I can only see selling it to get something I desire much more like a Battle Mistress. I have also bought a couple discontinued knives that I had the chance to order but did not, when they were offered from Busse/kin and was..... MY BAD! It took a lot of searching and patience to get them and I cheerfully paid more once I decided, I must have them. I sold them for a small profit, and do not feel bad in the least, for if the knives I purchased end up being not what I need, that small profit will quickly erode once I try and re-buy them again as that model is gaining popularity from user review's. I suspect, if the Basic 4, as another example, ends up doing great in the user review's, you will see a run on them from the people that decided to pass on them for whatever reason. You can expect to pay more since it is a limited run, or wait for a undetermined amount of time for something released that is similar.I would like to have a FBM or a NMFBM. I do not expect to find one for the 2008 price and will gladly pay whatever, when I can afford to have one. For now, it is out of reach. I was not a member here in 2008 so, it's nobody's fault. It is.... what it is...........................
 
oldrich said:
This has became philosophical. I like it! :thumbup:
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...not too much to add, but as an European Busse fanatic, I've bought some, sold some of Boss's blades.
I'm just in a process of selling one of my MUK's(stil hurts, but the other will stay long with me...), and it priced higher than another MUK a few rows up...why? Because I had to pay a the shipping costs when I've bought it, and I pay the shipping if I sell it...(and the gauaranteed shipping from my place is twice as much than from the US. It's stupid, but that's how it is.
It comes, that I loose a few $, but still around the price what I've paid. That's why I highlighted in the sale-thread, "in Europe"...because under European conditions, it's still cheap.
So there are a difference between "flippers" and some other maniacs, who just cannot afford to keep every blade, when the "itch" comes for a new one...:foot:
peace
 
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