Help With Laminated Blades

G L Drew

Knifemaker / Craftsman / Service Provider
Joined
Feb 3, 2005
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A new forge that offers more even heat and higher temps now lets me do some forge welding. I was able to successfully weld up a blade with a 1095 core under outer layers of 1075. I ground it out and am very happy with the weld but the contrast between there steels in all but non existent even after an acid etch. Can anyone suggest a good mix of steels to get a striking contrast between the core and outer layers?
 
From Fogg's site.

Bright lines:

L-6 a high nickel content carbon steel. It is common used in sawmill bandsaw blades, but not always. It can be purchased in round stock. It combines well with carbon steel for a highly reflective, high contrast billet. L-6 is known as a tough steel and adding it to the billet will only enhance the performance.

15N20 the Swedish version of L-6. It can be bought in thin stock from Jeff Carlisle and is an excellent steel with constant quality.

O-1 is a common tool steel that has enough chrome to make a bright line when welded with low carbon or high carbon steels. It is sensitive to heat and will crumble if overheated, but by the same token can be welded cleanly at lower temperatures.

ASTM 203E is a nickel bearing low carbon steel. It is common used in making up fittings, but can be used as the low carbon element in Damascus blades. Nice contrast and high reflectivity. You can by this in sheet from American Alloy Steel Houston, TX 1-800-231-3502.

Nickel for the brightest contrast pure nickel is often used. I do not recommend it for blade steel. Nickel is a carbon blocker and in the finished billet the soft nickel layers will end up on the edge and affect performance. It is best used in fittings for really high contrast.


Dark Lines:

The dark lines in the Damascus come for the low alloy carbon steels. You can get colors from light gray to dark black by varying the carbon content, the lightest being regular hot rolled low carbon. Adding low carbon to the billet will lower the overall carbon content of the finished piece of steel and you need to take it into account as you construct your billet. I like to have at least .60 to .80 points carbon in my billets and this can be figured by taking the percent carbon in each piece of the original billet and then averaging to find the projected carbon content in the finished billet. This seems like higher math to me tonight, but I am sure you can figure it out if you give it some thought. This will only represent a guesstimate since you are going to lose some carbon in the process of welding the billet. I have gone almost exclusively to high carbon billets and am happy with the performance I get, but it is entirely up to the individual maker and what effect he his looking to achieve.

Howard Clark ran a series of experiments to find out what was giving the variation in shades of gray from one carbon steel over another. His results showed that the manganese content contributed to the darkness of the line. You might contact Howard for more information on this if you are interested. If you have made any Damascus you also have found out that the heat treatment will greatly affect the etch and coloration of the finished steel too. The Japanese hamon is a great example of the wide variation possible through heat treatment. When you differentially harden a homogenous piece of steel you get marked difference in colors from the hardened portion and the unhardened. Most makers curse their etchant first, but if you think about what is going on with the steels the problem often lies in the heat treatment.

Some of my favorite carbon steels to use in Damascus are:

1095 It is a good knife steel and has a slightly higher beginning carbon content and contrast nicely with 15N20 or L-6

1084 Slightly lower carbon content and more forgiving in the heat treat. Makes a good blade steel, easy welding.

5160 A lot of makers really like this steel. It is an oil hardening steel and has been called fool proof steel because it is very forgiving with the forging and hardening. I don't use it much but not a bad choice.

52100 This is an alloyed steel and once you learn how to heat treat and forge it, it has exceptional qualities. Howard says that when they first made it they had to extend the grain size charts to accommodate it's very fine grain. It is not for the novice and you really need good controls for proper heat treating, but worth the effort in terms of performance.

W-2 This is the bladesmiths steel of choice because of it forges nicely and heat treats so well. It has added vanadium and is a fine grain steel. The only problem is they don't make it any more or at least I can't find it so it isn't readily available.

There many other steels that are possible combinations for making Damascus including some stainless and powdered metals. I do not have any experience with them so I won't mention them. A quick glance at a steel book and you will envision the possibilities. One consideration when you are combining different steels is their forgeability. If one steel moves easily under the hammer and another doesn't, they will shear their weld when you come to draw them out. A lot of the stainless steels have this problem and you need to take it into account.
 
I really like using wrought iron over 1095 or 1084. Some examples below.

-Mike

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This last one has a layer of 15n20 between the wrought and the 1084.
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Thank you guys! This has given me a lot of information to digest and experiment with. (Knife makers are the most generous people to share this type of information. Gotta love this forum.)

Mr. Griffin; your knives are outstanding. I will have to play with that combination myself. There will be no wagon wheel safe in the county again :)
 
As Stacy says 1084 and 15N20. Weld very well, good contrast, and easy to heat treat. They make a very good knife. Both are available from the NJ Steel Baron, Aldo. And Burton, Aldo also has a good supply of W-2, real high quality steel.
Brion
 
Thanks Brion I actually have some of Aldo's W2 as well as Don Hanson's. I have yet to forge any of Aldo's yet though. I just lifted this from Don Fogg's site and didn't edit his info. I am not sure when he compiled this info so it might have not been as readily available as it seems to be now.

By the way the Quillion dagger you have on your home page is outstanding!
 
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