Hiding

Who/what would you be hiding from?

For stealth practice in the woods, try Wild Turket hunting.

While turkey hunting on a friends property last spring I had one of the guys that farm his property drive right past me on a tractor (within 30 ft.) not knowing I was there. If he had been looking for me he'd have spotted me.

If someone is bent on finding you, they will. Dogs and Infrared will make short work of any atempt to hide in the woods, fields or farms.

I've found Tom Brown books and others at the local Borders in the Sports section. Try Amazon.com too.

Spend some time in the woods and you'll learn quite a bit.
 
when I was a kid I would fins a rain runoff ditch (naturally Made) and ly in it..........cover up with debree but so you can still see whats around you.
 
Rupestris said:
If someone is bent on finding you, they will. Dogs and Infrared will make short work of any atempt to hide in the woods, fields or farms.
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Do you have any stats or studies to support this statement or is it just an opinion? If it is just an opinion, how is it that Bin Laden and Eric Rudolph managed to evade mere detection (we don't even get to capture here) for so long? :thumbup:
 
on_the_edge said:
Do you have any stats or studies to support this statement or is it just an opinion? If it is just an opinion, how is it that Bin Laden and Eric Rudolph managed to evade mere detection (we don't even get to capture here) for so long? :thumbup:
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Because they aren't really hiding, and nobody is really looking. Ha Ha. But seriously. It's a big earth we live on, with over 6 billion people in spite of all of the advanced tech out there, i's still a needle in a haystack. And even with FLIR, you would still have to fly over that needle in order to see it. And even then, it would likely be the wrong needle.
 
ranger88 said:
Because they aren't really hiding, and nobody is really looking. Figure it out.
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That's funny...some of my co-workers were personally involved in looking for Rudolph. I guess maybe that was all a long dream I had. My bad!
 
There are ways to hide from FLIR's. We used to do it all the time when I was OPFOR at Ft. Polk;) Vigilance and common sense go farther than technology sometimes.

my .02

Bob Mills
 
Back earlier last century, my hunting buddy and I would go together bowhunting on out 4,000 acre lease. Usually we were the only ones there. We would set a game plan with routes and times, with an agreed upon rendevous spot and time. It got to be a game to be the first one there and hide from the other. Quite often the "hunted" first arrival would evade the hunter for thirty minutes before the tipoff. Burrowing into leaves, climbing a tree, or simply using good camo and stealth. More than once the hunted was found by literally being stepped on. These were the same techniques I was taught earlier by Sarge for a more deadly game, and they work on man or beast.

The tip of studying hunting techniques is a good one. Generally the idea is to blend into your surroundings, move slowly, stick to shadows, don't "skyline" yourself, leave as little sign of your passage as possible, keep noise to a bare minimum. Beasties watch for movement. Peeps expect to see a whole human form, or telltale reflections, out of place colors. IR is easily defeated if you know how. So are pups.

Codger
 
I'll leave avoiding FLIR and bloodhounds to the spec-ops commandos...

For avoiding people you have a great advantage as most of them are not that good.

Color - must blend in to natural surroundings.

Shape - must confuse the human form.

Shine - nothing to attract attention.

Smell - no perfumes, lotions, or smoke.

NOISE - you must be silent. Ears see farther than eyes in the forest.

MOTION - Movement will attract the human eye like little else. A properly camoflaged person will remain part of the background pattern until he moves.

Never hide in a place that looks like a good place to search for hidden people.

Going unnoticed is one skill set, evasion is another. It is easy to go unnoticed as long as you have good discipline. Escaping from active searchers requires a whole lot more energy and most people who get caught are caught because the effort wears them down and they start to slip up or give up. Mac
 
on_the_edge said:
Do you have any stats or studies to support this statement or is it just an opinion? If it is just an opinion, how is it that Bin Laden and Eric Rudolph managed to evade mere detection (we don't even get to capture here) for so long? :thumbup:
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Sorry for any confusion. Its just my opinion.

The original poster gives no hint as to what he is hiding from. Since the S hasn't HTF I assume that only reasons one would want to learn to hide is because someone is looking for them, or they feel it would be a good skill to brush up on.

If its a matter of learning a new skill then my statement is pointless and can be overlooked.

If there is a point where our country or an area of it finds itself in complete chaos and one must take to the woods then detection will be a lot less of an issue. There probably will not be a concerted effort to find any one individual at that point.

As for Bin Laden, I never said how long it would take to be found :D They're still looking for Hoffa aren't they?:p


cs
 
on_the_edge said:
That's funny...some of my co-workers were personally involved in looking for Rudolph. I guess maybe that was all a long dream I had. My bad!
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My comment was ment to address Bin Laden for the most part. I should have phrased it differently. Sorry about that. I did edit that post last night. Make sure you read the rest of what I posted.
 
If one where hiding from someone or something, would'nt it be better to hide in plain sight? The woods may be okay in a movie, but if you really want to drop out of sight, go to the city. They can't track you on concrete. In the woods a hidden person is like a needle in a hay stack, in the city a person is a needle in a needle factory. Plus there is alot more shelter, food resourses, scavanging oportunities in the city. When they found Eric Rudolph he was'nt up in the hills like some romantic fugitive mountain man figure, he was scavinging in a dumpster in town. He's probly been in town most of the time, laughing at all the manpower being wasted looking where he was'nt.

As for Bin Laden, he's most likely in some small village or town. A needle in a needle factory.
 
ranger88 said:
My comment was ment to address Bin Laden for the most part. I should have phrased it differently. Sorry about that. I did edit that post last night. Make sure you read the rest of what I posted.
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Appreciate the heads up and am way ahead of you here. Thanks!:thumbup:
 
Okay, Flatlander and others, I'll bite: how DO you hide from FLIR? (I have no particular reason to think I'll ever have to do this--but I've always been kind of interested in learning such things, and it's the rare outdoor/survival/military skill that doesn't end up having some kind of unforeseen practical application at some time.) I am not soliciting classified info, but if there are some public-domain tricks of the trade, I'm curious.
 
Return of the J.D. said:
Okay, Flatlander and others, I'll bite: how DO you hide from FLIR? (I have no particular reason to think I'll ever have to do this--but I've always been kind of interested in learning such things, and it's the rare outdoor/survival/military skill that doesn't end up having some kind of unforeseen practical application at some time.) I am not soliciting classified info, but if there are some public-domain tricks of the trade, I'm curious.
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Well, there's a huge variety of outdoor intrusion detection systems, many of which are so expensive you don't have consider yourself important to be detected by them! And your question is in no way suspect--it's great to know how the technology works.

FLIR is not what I would use. The way to hide from any purely infrared system is to dig in and cover yourself with any type of thermal covering. However, if someone is really looking for you, you'll show up as a black (non-warm) mass on a slightly busy background. Study that black mass long enough and see if it moves every few minutes....

Instead, I'd recommend a dual technology system. These aren't forward looking, so they're totally passive and limited by power. The more power, the greater the range.

Basically, if you're sitting still, you'll build up enough of a passive infrared signature to show up as your radiated heat begins to warm the area around you. This can be prevented by moving quickly--but there's where the "dual technology" piece can help--that other technology is ultrasound. As you move, you create a large signature that also shows up.

So why don't the military and police use these inexpensive systems? Because they don't cover a big enough area to helicopter mount for law enforcement ground searches, and don't cover a far enough distance to protect from long weapon ranges.

Also, dual technology systems prefer to be mounted, not mobile. So you'd need to face them from the perimeter inward and trap the invidual in that zone. That takes patience.

For water, hydroacoustic systems are available to the public that out-perform what the military had for harbor protection even 15 years ago.

Even so, the best detection system for someone hiding in woody areas is still the good old dog.
 
Watchful said:
Even so, the best detection system for someone hiding in woody areas is still the good old dog.
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I've heard that if you leave a bunch of ground hot peppers(or other similar powder) in your trail, the dog will sniff it and be unable to smell anything for a while. It sounds like it may work, do any of you guys know for sure?
 
I haven't heard this, but it sounds like the "quickly walk through water" myth.

The dog's nose is good enough to simply pick up your scent from further away. I would venture a dog can smell your scent *on* the peppers just as easily.

I think we've got a few dog trackers here who can really tell us.
 
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