high carbon steel and reproducing

J

jousley

Joined
Aug 19, 2012
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hey forum. this is my first post.... so hi, and I joined because of so many articles that are in my interest. I have a simple question that I was thinking about on my way home today from the gun show here in costa mesa, ca. I am about to build my first forge, I have the parts, but just need a little time. and am about to forge, hammer and eventually create my first knife. It won't be show quality and will take some time to learn the basics, but I was thinking about when I do make that first knife that I am really proud of... I was thinking, what if I wanted to reproduce that knife and give it to my buddies. Immediately it made sense to think of creating a cast and pouring molten steel into it to create replicas, etc etc. Then I started thinking of all the "home made" knifes at the show I just came from, and none of them were exactly the same. so I though that maybe replicating steel knives is not really possible. but then I thought about all the commercial companies that were at the show that were selling numerous exact copies of their high carbon steel knives at elevated prices... but were exact replicas.
So I did some online research today and when googling metal casting, it was all about brass and iron, low melting metals. But when I focused on steel casting, all that I saw were commercial plants creating casts, due to the complexity of the chemistry of high carbon steel, and basically am under the impression that "if you make an awesome high carbon knife, you cannot recreate it with a cast in your home workshop." Well, you could but only with metals that are too soft to really be useable. And that if you want high carbon steel replicas, you have to leave it to the professionals (big companies)
I just wanted to pass this by everyone to make sure that I am understanding this correctly. Is this correct? and did I draw the right conclusion from my "googling"?

thanks for your input, I am reviewing the faq's now and will continue to learn and contribute to this forum as I progess.
J.
 
It seems to me that you are very unfamiliar with knife making by individuals or companys. The parts are punched, sawed or ground out, lazer cut and water jet cut but not cast, unless they are decorative parts. Even makers produce knives that look the same but they are done as above. Read the "stickies" they will help you to understand. Just extending a little information. Frank.
 
You're basically correct, you don't reproduce knives by casting.
However, you can make multiple copies of the same model. They won't be perfectly the same but they will be close. The way you do that is make templates and practice practice practice.
The more knives you make the easier it is to do it the same way every time and you'll eventually be able to produce them with little variation.

I make knives through stock removal. I buy bars of steel, trace my templates multiple times on the bar, cut the blanks out, grind them all the same way, and so on.
 
Once your design is worked out, make a template to use as a pattern
for outlining, drilling etc.

Casting isn't practical for what you want to do.
 
Welcome. As medicivans stated, filling out all the info in your profile will help us greatly in giving you advice.

After you have made a few dozen knives, this question will answer itself. The above explanations are basically the ways of reproducing a knife pattern. The thousands of Buck knives made are done that way, just as the many of the hunters/fillet/kitchen knives made by some of the makers here who sell a certain style of knife repeatedly. They are all seemingly identical, but if closely compared side by side minute differences can be found. This also allows for customization without changing the basic style ( different handle material, etc.).

Most of us who make a style over and over make a metal/plastic template to mark the steel with, or have the blanks water-jet/laser cut out of sheets of steel in bulk.
For one to five copies , the template is the simplest solution. In bulk, having them water-jet or laser cut is the best method.

The stickies at the top of this forum are filled with info on making knives, building forges, suppliers, and working steel. A good read through over a couple of days will make your learning curve smoother.

Welcome, again.
 
Somebody did make a cast steel blade of high carbon alloy .Somebody must remember the name .Obviously not a big selling item !!
 
Condor K&T makes a cast knife (420 HC) using vacuum casting. the OP might be able to make bronze copies of his knife. Not as funtional but state of the art 4000 years ago.
 
Also, understand that a casting isn't a finished product.
It needs to be larger and thicker than the original. After casting, the surfaces need to be ground or lapped, sanded smooth, polished, sharpened.....just like a knife made from a blank.
Add to that porosity, pits, dendritic structures, and granular texture due to very large grain structure...it isn't practical to cast a knife blade.
 
David Boye started out casting 440 stainless the as-cast dendritic structure with chunky chromium carbides made his blades great for sawing rope (and I would guess good for little else as dendritic structure fractures easily and has little strength) then he went to a cobalt based composition similar to stellite.

-Page
 
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