HORIZONTAL VS VERTICAL blown gas forge?

Sam Salvati

Sam Salvati

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Aug 6, 2007
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Who uses a horizontal blown gas forge? Have you used both vertical and horizontal and which did you prefer? Is there any benefits over using a horizontal or a vertical? Thinking of building one, and am thinking which, never used either so I am trying to weight the benefits and cons of each design. Going to be using castable refractory(if that makes a difference).
 
I have used both horizontal and vertical blown propane forges. The horizontal ones are better for being able to fit larger objects into, and longer objects. The vertical ones seemed to be better for welding billets because the flame enters at the bottom and is more indirect, and the distance up to the metal allows more oxygen to burn off, and there was less fire scale on the metal.

If you're doing welding a vertical one is also good because you can build it with a removeable top and bottom so that you can easily replace the floor when it gets covered in flux. The question is, what do you intend to do with the forge? That should determine what type you build.

Propane forges need to be built around an application, because they're not as versitle as coal forges, you have a fixed firebox and it never changes.
 
I've used both and am building another vertical. From what I've read and seen if you place your doors closer to the top on a vertical you get a better atmosphere for forging and with the burner at the bottom you get a more even heat. Most of the horizontal forges I've used tend to have hot spots even with placing the burner on tangents.

You can heat a longer piece of steel using the same size forge body with a horizontal but that's not really a factor for me. With a vertical if you make the top removable you can replace the bottoms easier if you use it to weld.
 
I like the horizontal design so far due to the fact you can get larger longer blade shapes with more varying cross sections in them. I will be forging long blades in the forge, using it for heat treating, and occasional welding too.
 
Even forging long blades is there a need to heat up more than a few inches of the blade at a time? ;)

You can't go wrong with either design, I just prefer the vertical over the horizontal forge. I tend to get less scale and a more even heat in my vertical and it's easier to repair the lining.
 
I like my horizontal but want to finish my vertical. One advantage to the horizontal is the use of tongs. With the vertical a handle needs to be welded on everything.
The correct answer is you need both styles.
 
Will Leavitt said:
Even forging long blades is there a need to heat up more than a few inches of the blade at a time? ;)

You can't go wrong with either design, I just prefer the vertical over the horizontal forge. I tend to get less scale and a more even heat in my vertical and it's easier to repair the lining.
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Oh no I know Will, I was just stating I would be forging long blades in it, not that the horizontal/vertical would be better for that. I would think though that for an operation like heat treating though the need to heat long blades is a must. Just to make coubly sure, by long blades I mean swords.

Bruce Bump said:
I like my horizontal but want to finish my vertical. One advantage to the horizontal is the use of tongs. With the vertical a handle needs to be welded on everything.
The correct answer is you need both styles.
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Bruce why do you need to weld a handle, how come you cannot use tongs for a vertical forge?
 
Here is a question for you forge guys. Because of the way the flame comes into a blown vertical forge and the fact that heat rises, do you actually need a bottom plate?
 
jdm61 said:
Here is a question for you forge guys. Because of the way the flame comes into a blown vertical forge and the fact that heat rises, do you actually need a bottom plate?
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I would say yes, there is pressure going on in the forge no matter how small, and the flames would tend to follow the path of least resisitance choosing to go out the bottom rather than the small open windows at the top.
 
Both! I built a 24" deep B/G vertical forge last year. I use it for heat treating exclusively. Its a controlled atmosphere forge with argon gas injection.

I have almost finished building a 24" long horizontal forge. It's replacing a Whisper Low Boy that does not have enough room to do cans. Nice forges, just too small for my purposes.

The horizontal forge feels more natural when you move hot stuff in and out.
I like to see what is going on with the steel when I am forging. That is easier with a horizontal forge; for me anyhow.

Let us know, Fred
 
Sam a handle is needed so the piece of steel doesen't fall into the forge, tongs won't work because they will heat up too much. I have a firebrick that I set my blades on with my vertical forge and its only 10" tall on the inside so its not as much of a problem with my forge.

-Dan
 
Dan Seaver said:
Sam a handle is needed so the piece of steel doesen't fall into the forge, tongs won't work because they will heat up too much. I have a firebrick that I set my blades on with my vertical forge and its only 10" tall on the inside so its not as much of a problem with my forge.

-Dan
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I use locking tongs (just a piece of wire I tighten up on the handles) to hold my blades and a little hinged "v" thingy as a work support. I have a muffin fan that blows across the door. I haven't noticed my tongs heating up any more than the horizontal :confused: I only use tongs when drawing out my tang or doing some other handle work, otherwise I use the barstock for a handle.
 
Fred.Rowe said:
Both! I built a 24" deep B/G vertical forge last year. I use it for heat treating exclusively. Its a controlled atmosphere forge with argon gas injection.

I have almost finished building a 24" long horizontal forge. It's replacing a Whisper Low Boy that does not have enough room to do cans. Nice forges, just too small for my purposes.

The horizontal forge feels more natural when you move hot stuff in and out.
I like to see what is going on with the steel when I am forging. That is easier with a horizontal forge; for me anyhow.

Let us know, Fred
Click to expand...


Fred, would you elaborate on the argon injection in your forge? It sounds like a good alternative to salt pots (I'm terrified of fires and things like exploding salts.) How close to finished are you able to get your blades before heat treat?
 
I will not be using the forge as a heat treating oven, i'll be drawing the blade back and forth through the chamber, so I think that a horizontal forge would be better suited. I REALLY want to avoid making 2 forges, so I think because I would be doing more forging and heat treating in the forge rather than welding, the horizontal would be my best bet.
 
Perhaps I worded that wrong Will. Tongs will work but not as well as a handle for welding small billets in a taller forge that does not have a platform. If the billet/knife is long enough then the tongs will remain relatively cool.
 
I've had both and I prefer the vertical, I make several mosaic and damascus billets plus forge plain steel blades and the vertical works great for what I do, No hot spots, just a nice even eat the entire length of my inside chamber. I took an 18" pipe and had it squished a little egg shape with a tractor bucket, this gave me a finished inside of 14" after appling 2" of kaowool. You do need a handle welded on, but I weld a handle on everything no matter if I'm using a vertical or horizontial.

Have fun,

Bill
 
Will Leavitt said:
Fred, would you elaborate on the argon injection in your forge? It sounds like a good alternative to salt pots (I'm terrified of fires and things like exploding salts.) How close to finished are you able to get your blades before heat treat?
Click to expand...
The working area in my vertical forge is a 4x20inch section of 5/16 stainless. Its sealed on the bottom with an insulated hinged lid on the top. The forge is built around this. Argon injection is through a fitting in the lid.
The temperature control is very stable, around 3 or 4 degrees inside the working area. It will hold at 600 for coloring or run in the 2300 range if needed.
As far as how close to finish my blades are before heat treat;
Smaller blades I like to grind hard. Bigger blades, with longer profiles, I quench with enough thickness to withstand the shock. I hate warpage:o:grumpy:
I was going to build a salt pot when I built this. I felt a little nervous about inviting another hazard into the shop. There are too many there already.:eek:
This set up is probable not as efficient as a salt pot because of the thermal mass of the salt.
Normally I would have pictures to add; but my web site is down:grumpy:.

Fred
 
Fred, when you get a chance I'd love to see pictures of your forge and how it's fitted up for argon injection.
 
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