How about a Sub Machine gun? Or other selective fire pieces.

B

Bill Marsh

Joined
Mar 26, 2002
Messages
1,861
Well we have battle rifles and sniper rifles, how about SMG? I know we "civies" can't own selective fire weapons, except in certain states (like Georgia) and we got to buy an individual Federal Tax Stamp ($200 per gun) AND the weapons have to be pre-1985 (I think), but that does not stop us from looking and drooling, does it???

While researching rifles I came across this little puppy. Weird looking, but a neat design. Never seen or heard of one before.

http://world.guns.ru/smg/smg70-e.htm

Don't you just love the antenna? ;)

Designed by Stoner (hmm, have wondered about the name) hmmm :D :rolleyes: :D :o
 
Parker Hale PDW. these are the best images i could dig up, they're pretty much all you can find. 400rpm in burst fire, pretty much no muzzle climb. much respect for the old greasegun and i like the look of the ump.

79056.jpg


phidw.jpg


idw0rz.jpg
 
I'd probably get a Thompson or a Mac.

I think a lot of States allow a registered auto. Even Ca used to, but God knows what's going on there now.

Anyone ever see the program where Dillon and his friends are shooting down model airplanes with various full auto arms?

ps- that PH looks amazingly like a power stapler...
munk
 
Vector Arms Uzi is one of the best values around in this field, though prices were drastically inflated after 1986.

Otherwise, you'd be able to buy a full-auto BAR for less than $1000 plus $200 tax. :( ...AKs for $600 plus tax... Uzis for $400 plus tax. You get the point.

Most full-auto weapons are of limited utility, anyway...I'm just pissed that the "best behaved" category of firearms (licensed FA weapons) isn't much more available.

John
 
Bill Marsh said:
Well we have battle rifles and sniper rifles, how about SMG? I know we "civies" can't own selective fire weapons, except in certain states (like Georgia) and we got to buy an individual Federal Tax Stamp ($200 per gun) AND the weapons have to be pre-1985 (I think), but that does not stop us from looking and drooling, does it???

While researching rifles I came across this little puppy. Weird looking, but a neat design. Never seen or heard of one before.

http://world.guns.ru/smg/smg70-e.htm

Don't you just love the antenna? ;)

Designed by Stoner (hmm, have wondered about the name) hmmm :D :rolleyes: :D :o
Click to expand...
If you want to see this gun in action (albeit "hollywood" action) rent Robocop II (or maybe III?). Anyway its the Robocop movie where they have a little kid villain as a side kick to the main villain. The kid whips one of these out superfast unfolds it and starts shooting!
It is a very intersting design.

My fav SMG would be the Thompson with the finned barrel, cutts compensator, bolt handle on the top of the receiver and the front pistol grip. Using one of those dinner plate sized 100 round drums (yes besides the 50 rounder they did make 100 round drum also). Classic tommy gun from the old gangster flicks!

I've never fired the Thompson i just described but i did get a chance to fire a WWII era M1 Thompson. Unfortunately for legal purposes it was permanently converted to semi. But still a neat gun. Very heavy around 10 pounds unloaded! But with no recoil, it was like firing a bb gun! We shot at ten yards and it shot exactly where it was pointed.

If i was a U.S citizen and living the U.S i would be really tempted to go through all the legal hassle just to own one.But then i just love all those WWII era guns.
If i ever vacation down south i am definitely going to one of those shops i've read about where they rent smgs/mgs and let you try them out at their onsite range. Very cool! :D
 
munk said:
.

Anyone ever see the program where Dillon and his friends are shooting down model airplanes with various full auto arms?

ps- that PH looks amazingly like a power stapler...
munk
Click to expand...

They used to take me up in their helicopter for photoshoots of the World Jet Ski championships in Lake Havasu, AZ. and we'd talk about shooting the model planes down and all the little mods they made to them to make it more interesting.

They bought the helicopter to scout the area and make sure no one was around.

Yes, it does look like a power stapler...:D
 
I'd take an Erma MP40, if you were handing them out.

But the prices for FA are insane. Luckily, a range-goer let me shoot his Uzi once- man, that was just crazy fun. I got hits with it at 25, to my surprise. FA probably is overrated- you always want (a lot) what you can't have. Rent one and you get it out of your system.


Mike
 
the fn p90 looks kinda kool, wonder how it works in reality: the cartridge feed path must be interesting: Linky to video

i shot an early ingram (alabama prison surplus pre=ww2, looks a bit like a rounded thompson) in .45, the ammo cost that day was staggering. i used up my govt. issued ration of .45acp rounds in a few secs....and also have fired the m16 at sharpshooter level (got medal) but hitting a 55 gal. water barrel at 10 meters was next to impossible, maybe 2-3 hits out of a 20 rd. mag., on full auto.
 
I've worked Byron's FA Uzi a few times.

Eh.

It's okay for what it is. In practical terms, he uses a AR15 carbine for home defense.
 
I once helped shoot down a model airplane while firing an M249.

It was part of my last field exercise while on active duty.

Firing full auto at an airplane was pretty cool!

I loved the M249 compared to the M60.

Are we Americans just genetically incapable of producing a good, reliable, belt feed automatic weapon?

I always had the A1 while in the Army, or the NG after. I could control the number of rounds in the burst relatively easily. Also with the M60 too. Just a matter of training and practice, as well as rythym ! being a drummer helped maybe. I always thought in a close ambush, the 3 round burst limiter might hurt. Glad I never had to find out.

Tom
 
That little fold up Stoner is now manufactured in the former Soviet Union and carried by Soviet security personel. I forget where I read it, probably Wikipedia.
As far as SMG's go, I think they are kinda a weapon of desperation. The low pressure, high rate of fire of the pistol cartridges just itches for a conscript army. SMG's can be stamped out and put on the field in no time. No training to grunts, keep them close to the enemy in the streets and hose them down with 7.62x25mm at around 900 rounds per minute. See "PPSH" when you go out to Wikipedia.

That would be my choice, except with better magazines. The hot stuff in 7.62x25 will defeat most body armor, and that is why the Soviets are taking another close look at it.
Peh-peh-sha! Ho!
 
Offhand, the only civilian use for a sub machinegun I can think of would be a bank job.

With home defense, there are better weapons. A Korean Grocier in the LA riots would be better armed with an AR than a subgun.





munk
 
munk said:
Offhand, the only civilian use for a sub machinegun I can think of would be a bank job.

With home defense, there are better weapons. A Korean Grocier in the LA riots would be better armed with an AR than a subgun.





munk
Click to expand...

Well said. I'm surprised, though, how little attention is paid to pump-action rifles. They're more reliable than most sem-autos, almost as fast, more controllable. Cut down the barrel & stock, it'll be a real handy home-defender.
 
qubehead said:
Well said. I'm surprised, though, how little attention is paid to pump-action rifles. They're more reliable than most sem-autos, almost as fast, more controllable. Cut down the barrel & stock, it'll be a real handy home-defender.
Click to expand...

and very illegal if you cut it down to much.
 
There was a little 357 pump offerred 15 years ago by a foreign concern that never quite made it. A pump in a robust handgun calibre, like the Ruger 480, would be devastating, and a pump rifle does have some advantages, like the fact your arm is already on the forearm and pulling backwards after the shot, which keeps the sights closer to target than with a bolt and maybe even a semi auto.



munk
 
munk said:
There was a little 357 pump offerred 15 years ago by a foreign concern that never quite made it. A pump in a robust handgun calibre, like the Ruger 480, would be devastating, and a pump rifle does have some advantages, like the fact your arm is already on the forearm and pulling backwards after the shot, which keeps the sights closer to target than with a bolt and maybe even a semi auto.



munk
Click to expand...
That would be the IMI(Israeli Military Industries) Timberwolf yes? Pump action stainless steel .357 with a takedown function. I remember reading articles about it but have never seen one up close.

Taurus now makes a pump based on the Colt Lightning (i think). Its in .357 and .45 LC and geared towards the cowboy action shooters. The barrels are 24inches but they were supposed to make a carbine version too. I have however read about some quality control/reliability issues, but maybe they've worked that out by now.
 
Just for sh*ts & giggles, I did a search on "Gatling Guns" and found a couple of sites which offer kits and fully finished and functional models for sale. Anyone ever shoot one of these?

Eric
 
My most recent rifle is a Remington 7600 in .35 Whelen.

I bought another stock and forearm, so I could have the stock cut down to my LOP (12.5")*. I bought a peep sight as well, and a few kinds of aftermarket magazines to test.

...when I get back from the wars, of course. Unfortunately, I am afraid the one we're in will make Vietnam look like a happy memory eventually. :(

*If I wanted, I could install a sliding or folding stock, but I don't want this arm to look "tacticool".

John
 
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