How blade steel affects your buying

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Funny, CTS XHP is still interesting but I have not tried any. In light of Magnacut though priorities shift. The XHP for me would be Spyderco's Chaparral in Birds Eye Maple, but the Native LW in Magnacut pulls my budget away. Really a first world problem.
 
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A lot of it for me not only comes down to the steel, but the maker's heat treat.
I love INFI/SR101/SR77 with Busse's heat treat, and I'm a big fan of CPK's 3v/4v/AEBL/D2 with Nathan's heat treat.
Winkler is magic with 80CrV2 and Shiro does amazing things with M390.

I'll often get a lower end sample of a makers blades to see what the do with the heat treat down near the bottom of their line. If they've got a kick-ass heat treat in their value products, typically their high end stuff will blow you away!

Everybody makes mistakes and occasionally a badly HT'd batch goes out, but reputable makers will make it right for you.
 
Yesterday I got from a store Opinel #04 and Opinel #05. My heart went strongly enough to #04 to immediately sharpen it when I returned home and carry it for the rest of the day, most of the time in my hand instead in my pocket (pretty tight when closed, so I felt safe). Carbon, of course, and I decided to read again carefully difference between 12C27 Sandvik modified and XC90. I do not have any stainless Opinels, so I can't compare from personal experience. Guess what - comparisons are all over the place, and that is really confusing. Also, I still can not find information what kind if steel my Buck 319 (made before 1986 because of the shape of the pinch), 440A or 440C? Looks like very different steels are hard to distinguish apart from visual signs such as rusting. Seemingly Vactorinox folks are smart to not give information of their steel and heat treatment to eliminate numeric comparisons.
 
vinprom said:
Also, I still can not find information what kind if steel my Buck 319 (made before 1986 because of the shape of the pinch), 440A or 440C?
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ask this question in buck forum and maintenance for getting knowledgeable eyes on it.
vinprom said:
Looks like very different steels are hard to distinguish apart from visual signs such as rusting.
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well that and cutting and sharpening characteristics, plus various testing reports, plus reputable brands specifications for hardness /heat treat (cough cough) and steel type.
vinprom said:
Seemingly Vactorinox folks are smart to not give information of their steel and heat treatment to eliminate numeric comparisons.
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I know their "stainless steel" has been called out, here is one thread that reports:
"X55CrMo14 aka 1.4110 stainless. It's similar to 12C27M."
 
Thanks scottc3 scottc3 for the detailed reply. Actually the posting to which you have replied is the real answer to the question of this thread, "How blade steel affect your buying", my previous posts were a little off topic. Unfortunately my poorly crafted and with many grammar mistakes posting actually pointed out to the frustration I've had reading about the Opinel's steels based on users' experience, and I can now add the same is with Mora. I ended up with buying only carbon Opinles and Moras. Seemingly to me the choice is easy because the divide is always carbon vs stainless because the knives I am buying have one option of each (Case sometimes throws additional stainless for some of their traditionals). My "mystery steel" Buck 319 is probably with 440A because it is easy to sharpen, and that is important to me much more important than knowing for sure from what kind of steel this knife is made. By the way, one of the greatest pocket knives I have has blade with 52-54 HRC.

The reason this thread is interesting for me, is because I am curious where my knives stand against others I don't have - Spyderco comes first in my mind, and how others view what is important for certain steels. I am minority here - toughness, look (patina), and easy sharpening are very important for me, and conversely the edge retention isn't.
 
I value ease of sharpening over edge retention, so I’ll choose Emerson’s 154CM over M390 or any other of the latest super steels. I’ve used an Emerson on duty for years and the steel is perfect for my applications. It’s tough, easy to sharpen, and holds up to abuse.

I’m also partial to S30V, specifically the BOS heat treated variety. I carried a first generation Strider SMF with BOS S30V and it performed amazingly well. Super easy to sharpen and tough enough to get beat on with no issues.

Really the highest I’ll go in the steel hierarchy is S45VN which is what my Sebenza 31 is in. I’ve only had it for a couple weeks so I can’t comment on its performance in my job yet.
 
I have an alphabet soup of all the various alloys in blades from many sources, but really everything after CPM-154 is fine with me. Generally I like higher hardness on folding knives and higher toughness on fixed blades, but most knives from reputable makers are fine.
 
I guess it has some effect but in the end if I like the knife, I will get it regardless of the steel. That is why I have folders in 30 different steels
 
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Like many I try and pick the correct knife/steel for the job but I would be lying if I didn’t admit I do like trying newer steels. I try and tell myself it’s for research but if truth be told I just want another knife. A pic for the thread:
 

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Picked up a couple of knives over the weekend, both made by Ruike. One is a Jager, 14C28N, a steel that I have some experience with, and a good choice for small fixie. G-10 scales, but I'm not really a fan of G-10. 4.3 inch blade, but I have plenty of fixed-blade knives in the 4-4.5-inch range. An ABS sheath system, interesting, and functional, if not the absolute best for concealment. And not very attractive black plastic, either, just black plastic. But, as a package, the whole thing just works. And, this one has been on my get-list for a couple of years. It was time

The other knife is the M105-TZ folder. Smoothly faceted titanium handles, just OK for grip. Pocket clip is too tight. Blade steel is N690. Never used this alloy before, but it's about the same as VG10, from my research. That one I know, it's better-than-average performance territory, for my uses. Again, more than it might seem at first glance, and nothing I consider a deal-breaker. EXCEPT that it was $130! I was ready to walk, but the vendor, who knows me as a customer, dug in one of his totes and pulled a demo out, excellent condition, for $100. But I didn't buy it for the steel. The overall package is rather aesthetically pleasing. And it's one of the sharpest knives out-of-the-box I've ever purchased.

Mostly, though, I got both of these to sample the consistency of Ruike's heat-treatment. I've been carrying one of their 14C28N folders nearly every day for three years. And I recommend them as quite good budget knives. Gonna work these two for awhile, make sure my recommendations aren't misplaced....

I DID buy a Buck 110, in Bos heat-treated 5160, but I also bought it to match my 5160 Buck 101. Only knives I've ever bought for the steel, just because I like 5160, and a Buck that will rust fairly easily is not something you see every day!
 
scottc3 said:
Funny, CTS XHP is still interesting but I have not tried any. In light of Magnacut though priorities shift. The XHP for me would be Spyderco's Chaparral in Birds Eye Maple, but the Native LW in Magnacut pulls my budget away. Really a first world problem.
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Cold Steel’s XHP back then is quite good. No complaints with my XHP folder.
 
justjed said:
Picked up a couple of knives over the weekend, both made by Ruike. One is a Jager, 14C28N, a steel that I have some experience with, and a good choice for small fixie. G-10 scales, but I'm not really a fan of G-10. 4.3 inch blade, but I have plenty of fixed-blade knives in the 4-4.5-inch range. An ABS sheath system, interesting, and functional, if not the absolute best for concealment. And not very attractive black plastic, either, just black plastic. But, as a package, the whole thing just works. And, this one has been on my get-list for a couple of years. It was time...
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I've had this knife for a few years now. I haven't put a ton of use on it but I've carried it in the woods a bunch and it has done everything I've asked of it. Overall, it's a great knife for the price. I've also really come to appreciate the rotatable clip that came with the sheath. I was skeptical at first but being able to change and lock in belt orientation with the push of a tab on this and a few related models has proven itself very handy.

Of course, the sheath is the least good thing about the Jager. This is true for lots of fixed blades though, and not just on the budget end. It has held up for the time I've had it but the plastic has worn at the spot where the tension can be adjusted. So I'm finally upgrading it to real Kydex. I'm having the holes spaced so I can continue using that rotatable belt clip. :)
 
I usually don't really care. I usually carry a slipjoint and prefer carbon steels on them for the patina that develops, but slipjoints in general have also made me appreciate soft basic stainless steels (including, get this, 440A!). A lot of beautiful knives just aren't available with what many folks would consider even decent steel. Until like 50 years ago basically nobody on earth had ever used a knife that many folks would even consider carrying.

Basically, caring too much about steel really limits your options. If you actually use some of these chalybēs non grata I think you usually find that you have to sharpen them once a week, or maybe even once a day. And by "sharpen" I mean literally 30-60 seconds on a ceramic. So yes, they do dull relatively quickly, but they also sharpen up very quickly and easily. For me personally, for ~80% of steels (completely made up number), it'll roughly be worth it if I really like the knife for whatever reason.

I carry a Case Peanut in their CV steel or a GEC #82 possum skinner in 1095 most days. Both are closer to 55 HRC than 60 HRC and have close to 0% carbide volume, but they're ground thin and slice better than 95% of knives. If I use it a lot on a particular day I spend the aforementioned 30-60 seconds on a ceramic and forget about it.

That being said I did just order a Spyderco Ladybug in K390 lol
 
Carboniferous said:
If you actually use some of these chalybēs non grata I think you usually find that you have to sharpen them once a week, or maybe even once a day.
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I will tentatively place Sandvik 12C27M there if compared with many of the newer wonders. Yesterday I briefly met a friend for a lunch in a nearby restaurant with the purpose to show him him how to maintain his Opinel 12 slim. I am currently on vacation in my native Bulgaria (for few more days unfortunately :)) , and there are no knife laws, but I still was a little uncomfortable to sharpen a nearly 5" blade in a full restaurant. Nobody indicated anything, including the server. My friend just wanted to have something very inexpensive. I told him earlier to get from the same store he got the knife a 4" Opinel stone, and to bring both. He is not a knife person, and he recently purchased the knife as a replacement of the same knife he has lost.

Anyway, we asked for a cup with tap water, and I have shown him how to hold the stone between two fingers, the way to slide the knife edge heading, to be careful the tip to not pass over the edge of the stone, to try to minimize the rocking, and to maintaining the angle both along the pass and between passes, and, stressed many times to always alternate and to apply as less pressure as possible to avoid burr creation at all cost. Otherwise there are other stones more proper for the task, and warned him about the high probability of dulling the knife if he is not familiar with stropping. Basically I told him to use the stone as sort of honing rod, and to avoid actual sharpening he is not experienced with. Earlier, I clarified that he is not expecting to use the knife often, and warned him to avoid cutting cardboard with it.
After he did about 15-12 alternate passes, he checked again his knife, and he was clearly impressed that the knife was obviously sharper, just like my prediction. Actually he cleared the micro burr from the factory, that is barely felt, I honestly told him that. The same knife he considered very sharp, became much sharper, and this guy was surprised. Then, for the few minutes he hold and looked happily at his knife, rotated it to see it from different angle, sliced it again with joy through the pieces of the old receipt we used to check the knife and through the restaurant's paper cloth tissue - I haven't seen this guy so exited for years! He has already liked his only knife, but now he is obviously attached.

If he had a knife with super steel, the story will be different - I would tentatively tell him, based on rumor said, to hone it on a ceramic rod, but better to get a Spiderco Sharpmaker ten times the price of the Opinel stone, and to learn by watching videos. I really doubt the restaurant story would ever happen
 
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