How do you pick your steel?

R

RobN

Joined
May 15, 2015
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So far, after using a variety of mystery steels, I've been using 1084 and have some 5160 I haven't done anything with. In part, I haven't used that 5160 because the 1084 seems to work fine and I'm not sure why I'd use a different steel other than to say I'd done it, so...

How do you pick your steel? Other than the obvious choice of carbon or stainless, what makes you decide you want to make a particular knife from, say O1, and not any of the other possible choices?

I'm thinking each maker probably has his own answer to this, so I'm looking for a variety of perspectives.
 
I started with 5160, and use it as my primary steel. I'm no expert on the matter, but from what I know each maker will have there own opinion on this topic. I have ventured off and tried 1084, and am currently in the middle of experimenting with some cpm 154. The main factor I see in steel selection is what is the knife going to be used for? What is the final appearance you have for the design? Do want a hamon? Do you want hi corrosion resistance? These in my opinion are some of many questions that will define what kind of steel to use. I primarily use 5160 cause most knifes I make a hard use knives. I started playing around with 1084 to get a good understanding of how it works and heat treats. Then started in trying my hand at damascus. I'm sure some one with a better explanation in come along soon. But for now hopefully this just broke the ice on the topic.
 
I started with W2 because I wanted to make some knives and try a hamon (or two). I ended up switching to AEB-L as I wanted to use stainless and will be trying some S35VN soon. I got away from carbon steel because I know some of my potential customers will not take care of them properly and I don't need the headache of dealing with them after the fact.
 
There are a few basic knife steels that have certain attributes. Lets start a list that can be a sort of guide. Other folks may have a few suggestions and atributes. I'll add them and put it in the stickies.

Steel Selection Guide
Carbon Steels:
1084 - Easiest to HT and alloyed very simply to make knifemaking fun. It is the eutectic in steels, and makes excellent knives.
1095 - Similar to 1084 in type, but having more carbon, thus making a longer wearing edge. Harder to HT.
5160 - Basic spring steel that makes a good tough knife. 9260 is a very similar alloy, and works the same. Hard to mess up. Good forging steel. Excellent for low-tech "back yard HT"
W-2 - Similar to 1095, but often having a little more carbon, and a much "cleaner" alloying. It is popular for attaining a hamon. Trickier to get the HT spot on.
52100 - Similar to W-2, but having chromium added. It is tough, hard, and wears well. HT can be very tricky, and requires a good HT oven to get it right.
CPM-3V - Tough as all get-out, and really, really, hard. Takes a bit of skill to get the most out of it, but the results are great. Good rough use steel.
O-1 - Low allow steel that could be called 1095 with some chromium added. Good knife steel.
D-2 - Tough and strong. Harder to work with, but makes an excellent rough use knife. Requires a HT oven to harden.
15N20 - A basic 1075/1080 type steel with 2% nickel added.

Stainless Steels
440-C - The old tried and true blade steel. Nothing wrong with it at all.
CPM-154/ATS-34/154-CM - Good general use stainless steels for knives. All are pretty much the same composition.
CPM-S35VN - A high alloy modified stainless steel with added ingredients to make a fine grain edge. Great for slicer knives and kitchen cutlery.
CPM-S30V, S90V, S120V, etc. - Similar to CPM-154 but with higher alloying. The higher the number, the more alloys added. These require careful HT to get the most from them.
AEB-L - A very simple stainless steel that will sharpen to a very fine edge. It is hypo-eutectoid, so no carbides are formed. The 13% chromium prevents corrosion nicely. Makes great kitchen slicers.
ELMAX - A proprietary steel that is tough, corrosion resistant, and gets really hard.



Here is a great chart from Alpha Knife Supply to compare steels. Click the steel, and you get a comparison chart with specs, HT info, and more.http://www.alphaknifesupply.com/zdata-bladesteel.htm
 
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Stacy, what do you think about putting the standard heat treat below each steel type? I know that there are variations on how people do their ht, but there are some standards that beginners could follow.

Sometimes ht for knives is slightly different than the manufacturers suggested ht.
 
The link given gives the HT for most all knife steels. The programs Alpha gives are pretty good basic HT info. For those who want to see how everybody does their HT, do a search.
https://cse.google.com/cse/home?cx=011197018607028182644:qfobr3dlcra

Just type in "1804 heat treat", or "D-2 HT", etc., and you will get dozens of threads filled with info.
 
I call Aldo and tell him to spin in a circle with his arm out and then I yell STOP!! Whatever he's pointing at I use. I do the same thing with choosing how to heat treat the surprise steel. Imagine a dart board with a bunch of T-T-T diagrams. I close my eyes, smack my thumb with a hammer, then toss a dart. Sometimes it works out, sometimes it doesn't. Exciting, huh?

Actually, I wanted to standardize my steel. One carbon, one stainless. I picked 52100 for my carbon, this is great for kitchen knives and outdoor knives. On the stainless side, I actually broke my rule and stock two types; CPM20CV and AEB-L. Both are great steels. One is super stain resistant and highly abrasion resistant, the other is very fine grained and less abrasion resistant. 20CV is a whole heck of lot more expensive than AEB-L too.
 
There are so many great alloys available today, that it can be a little overwhelming. Probably the most important consideration is, what are your HT capabilities? A great design made of top-quality steel that's heat-treated poorly, is pretty much a waste of time and money.

If you're working with a very simple backyard set-up, stick with simple steels. 1080/1084/5160 etc are well-liked partly because you can get very close to their full potential without a lot of expensive HT gear. That doesn't mean they're "inferior" steels; they can be made into excellent knives, with fine grain, high toughness and good edge retention. :)

If you're going to invest in a good kiln, cryo set-up and so forth, or send your blades to a pro shop like Peters for HT, you can choose any steel you like.

I've been trying to keep things simple in my shop lately, selecting one "carbon" steel, one "tool" steel, and one or two stainless steels. That way I can serve pretty much any client or market. Right now I'm focusing on 52100 for carbon stuff, CPM-3V as my tool steel, and AEB-L and S35VN for stainless.

If I could only use one alloy for every kind of knife from parers to big choppers, and still had access to Peters HT, my choice would be CPM-3V at 60Rc. If I had to rely solely on my own low-tech backyard HT, it would be 1075/1080/1084/15N20.
 
James, that's a great idea. I thought about buying some 3V on my next order. Looks like our lists are similar!
 
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