How large were British slipjoints during WW1?

[TheJon]

I ran across this image of a list of British soldiers equipments and personal item weights. On the left hand side you can see that it lists a clasp knife....at 7 1/2 ounces!
I wasn't able to find the source of the e image, but I just can't possibly believe the average soldier would have had a knife that heavy. That's approximately the weight of a Buck 110. Either it's an error or I'm missing something. Buuuuut maybe I'm wrong and they just carried larger knives then? I'd have to go weigh some of my camp knives but I doubt any of them weigh that much. Maybe 5 ounce at most, if I was to guess.

 

[Johnnythefox]

That is a very interesting list,those issued jack knives where big and hefty.

Built to last and they did.

I have a nice collection of later ones.


A housewife is a sewing kit,things have gotten ridiculous here now.
Its been decided that that is a sexist name and must just be called a sewing kit.

The rifle they carried is lighter than the SLR we had which was 9.56 lbs

we where still wearing puttees in the 80s when every other army just had high leg boots.

 

[euroken]

I saw a spec on these clasps knives somewhere and it said they were close to 5 inches folded...I can imagine 7 1/2 oz if they were so sized with 4 or 5 tools in them...

 

[Johnnythefox]

I just weighed my largest from WW2 for you, its just a tad under 200 grams,so I expect WW1 would be heavier.

200 Grams =
7.0547924 Ounces

 

[Jack Black]

Interesting list, the knives from that period were both large and heavy (I take a size 11 or 12 glove)

 

[rhino]

If they had the big marlin spike, it could easily account for some unexpected additional weight.

 

[TheJon]

I saw a spec on these clasps knives somewhere and it said they were close to 5 inches folded...I can imagine 7 1/2 oz if they were so sized with 4 or 5 tools in them...

Wow I didn't realize they were that large.

I just weighed my largest from WW2 for you, its just a tad under 200 grams,so I expect WW1 would be heavier.

200 Grams =
7.0547924 Ounces

Thanks! That's interesting.

Interesting list, the knives from that period were both large and heavy (I take a size 11 or 12 glove)

They are larger than I expected for sure.

 

[Jack Black]

I saw a spec on these clasps knives somewhere and it said they were close to 5 inches folded...I can imagine 7 1/2 oz if they were so sized with 4 or 5 tools in them...

Several patterns were issued during WW1, but the most common clasp knives issued to British and Commonwealth troops are 5" closed, plus the shackle. They have a Spear-point blade, can-opener, and marlin spike, but they are all stout tools, with solid iron bolsters, and liners, and thick buffalo horn or stag covers

 

[Johnnythefox]

Wow I didn't realize they were that large.

Thanks! That's interesting.

They are larger than I expected for sure.

Have you seen the size of the bayonet?

 

[euroken]

Several patterns were issued during WW1, but the most common clasp knives issued to British and Commonwealth troops are 5" closed, plus the shackle. They have a Spear-point blade, can-opener, and marlin spike, but they are all stout tools, with solid iron bolsters, and liners, and thick buffalo horn or stag covers

5" closed AND shackle!! Knives made for real men lol! That thing will look like a sword in my small hands!!!

 

[Jack Black]

5" closed AND shackle!! Knives made for real men lol! That thing will look like a sword in my small hands!!!

Apparently you could stop a tank with one!

 

[TheJon]

Have you seen the size of the bayonet?

I thought that was the bayonet!

 

[meako]

we were still wearing puttees in the 80s when every other army just had high leg boots.
I joined the NSWFB in 85 ..we were still wearing a woollen firefighting tunic based on a battle jacket designed in the CRIMEAN war!!...very dashing but kind of out of date.

 

[screened porch]

I still wear puttees.

 

[Johnnythefox]

I still wear puttees.

You win.

 

[Johnnythefox]

we were still wearing puttees in the 80s when every other army just had high leg boots.
I joined the NSWFB in 85 ..we were still wearing a woollen firefighting tunic based on a battle jacket designed in the CRIMEAN war!!...very dashing but kind of out of date.

At least it kept you warm

 

[Will Power]

A knife weighing around 7 oz./approx 200 + g is indeed a heavyweight. However, we need to bear in mind certain contextual matters: all 'stuff' was much heavier then, no titanium..plus the idea that armies marched long distances with kit- even though such burdens were lethal or ludicrous in the context of actual rapid attack across hideous boggy terrain facing a deeply entrenched enemy with massed firepower. But it went on and on in all armies for 51 months on the Western Front. Additionally, not only was heavier is more solid thus better...but those firms across the world who got the hugely lucrative military procurement contracts for equipment were none too bothered about practicalities.

You can see interesting photographs of life in dug-outs on the various frontlines and armies - true they were censored and sanitized- if people back home really understood the conditions they would not have tolerated the pitiful wastage of life in this repletion of horror day in day out. But you can for instance see troops, largely officers, enjoying a brief respite, a snack, drinks etc and you can see ordinary pocket-knives laying about not the behemoth hulks of general issue Clasp Knives which at 7 oz. needed to be hung from a belt or pack.

Talking of big, all armies in The Great War revered it to a greater or lesser extent here British troops have got hold of a German anti-tank rifle c.1917, no pocket-rocket this.....

 

[TheJon]

A knife weighing around 7 oz./approx 200 + g is indeed a heavyweight. However, we need to bear in mind certain contextual matters: all 'stuff' was much heavier then, no titanium..plus the idea that armies marched long distances with kit- even though such burdens were lethal or ludicrous in the context of actual rapid attack across hideous boggy terrain facing a deeply entrenched enemy with massed firepower. But it went on and on in all armies for 51 months on the Western Front. Additionally, not only was heavier is more solid thus better...but those firms across the world who got the hugely lucrative military procurement contracts for equipment were none too bothered about practicalities.

You can see interesting photographs of life in dug-outs on the various frontlines and armies - true they were censored and sanitized- if people back home really understood the conditions they would not have tolerated the pitiful wastage of life in this repletion of horror day in day out. But you can for instance see troops, largely officers, enjoying a brief respite, a snack, drinks etc and you can see ordinary pocket-knives laying about not the behemoth hulks of general issue Clasp Knives which at 7 oz. needed to be hung from a belt or pack.

I suppose that is more of my question. I've read a fair number of memoirs and books about ww1 and I can't think of any of them commenting on the knives. I know it's a small things, but going from a normal 3 1/2 inch knife to a 5+ inch knife is a big jump! I wonder why they decided to issue such large knives.

 

[Jack Black]

I suppose that is more of my question. I've read a fair number of memoirs and books about ww1 and I can't think of any of them commenting on the knives. I know it's a small things, but going from a normal 3 1/2 inch knife to a 5+ inch knife is a big jump! I wonder why they decided to issue such large knives.

The previous British military issue knives were also large, but then why would you issue a soldier/sailor with a Peanut?!

 

[Will Power]

TheJon I think you'll find there is/was a big gulf between what soldiers were issued with and what they liked to carry or use. The pocket-knife was almost universal amongst people then, more or less everybody had one about them and the knives would've been very varied, but like phones today they were so ubiquitous that people likely paid little attention to them, this is why you won't find accounts about them.

The general issue knives were 'traditionally' big and heavy and may have had various implements but they can't really be regarded as convenient pocket carry. But then, a lot of other equipment was large and sometimes inconveniently so. Standard rifles , Lebel, Lee-Enfield, Mauser, Moisin-Nagent et al. were all long, heavy and cumbersome trench weapons, many troops liked to get hold of Carbine versions, pump Shotguns and with officers, their own small arms for close encounter fighting. The general issue knife would've been used a lot for opening tins/cans but then, bayonets were also deployed for that.

As can be seen in the picture of the French poilu resting, he's slicing a loaf with some manner of knife with a long blade and it's probably personal rather than army issue, but who knows ?

Thanks, Will