How many people hate Cold Steel?

"How many people hate Cold Steel?"

Oh, goody! Another contest! My guess is 1,000,006.



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AKTI Member # A000846
Stop when you get to bone.
 
HATE Cold Steel? No, but love/hate perhaps. One of the best knives I own is an old Outdoorsman tanto with the chisel back. The geometry is right, the grinds are about perfect and it cuts like mad. My kids won't get this one until after I'm gone. When I purchased an SRK with the early, steeper grind I found myself with a knife vastly inferior in cutting and chopping ability to the Outdoorsman. The grinds were so awful I sent it back to CS. They unceremoniously replaced it with a new one that had the higher grind on the blade, which allowed it to cut a little better. Even so, the grinds were still terribly uneven and the knife continued to be an unsatisfactory cutter. Yes, I could make it "shaving sharp" but it was too thick to penetrate well. To make it worse, the new sheath had a keeper strap so loose that it can be brushed aside allowing the knife to come out of the sheath. Now, the knife goes unused except to pry things apart in the garage and around the house.

Later on I purchased a liner lock folder (ultra lock?) that I was very fond of until the blade "popped" backward one day while whittling! I sent it in for warranty replacement and received back a redesigned version that had other problems of it's own and I promptly got rid of it. There was also a San Mai clip point folder I should have never parted with but regrettably did.

I own a couple of the original Twistmasters and find them to be excellent cutters, thin enough with a good working handle shape (folding puukkos). These are knives that get used.

My Voyager is ho hum but was acquired on a trade and is thought of as usefully expendable.

In my case, CS has had some shining moments but overall, the experience in dealing with them has been underwhelming. The correspondence by phone and mail that I've had with their company leaves me feeling as if the customer is somewhat disdained and is expected to swallow the propaganda gleefully and reply "Thank you sir, may I buy another?" A little tuning up of the customer service attitude would go a long, long way.

That having been said, I would like to applaud them as a catalyst in the industry. Lynn has taken risks, gone out on limbs and put it on the line. Balancing confidence and humility is a difficult thing.
 
For all of you people who are like "Poor Gerber, Cold Steel is such a bully", just shut up.

Gerber said that they made the best tactical folder available, and I can tell you that the Covert is, in my experince, a $110 POS. My friend, who was stupid enough to buy it after I repeatedly warned him, has had nothing but trouble with it. Mayber CS doesn't make the BEST knives, but I would take them over equivalent Gerbers any day.

For the "AUS-8 is not the best steel" crowd, okay. BUT, it is still a good steel, and when I can get a CS with AUS-8 rather than a nameless steel Buck or Schrade, you betcha I'll take the CS. And Spyderco still uses AUS-8, so it is obviously not crap.

For the people who decry Thompson's "Combative" approach when demonstrating uses of knives, I doubt that anyone thinks that the Sifu was designed as an apple peeler. You same people don't whine about HK selling Tactical USP 45 pistols, or Colt selling Combat Master pistols, so why is a knife different. People will use tham as they like. And how many sheeple will be exposed to CS adds? very few, and they would like be just as offended by a picture of the Fairbairn fighter.

Finally, look at the other add campaigns in use accross the country: Pepsi still says that it is better than Coke, Chevy says it is better than Ford, and Apple still says it is better than IBM.

We live in a capitalist society, and so long as CS still makes good knives at a non-obscene price, more power to them.
 
For What it's worth, I've known Lynn Thompson for almost twenty years. In my dealings with him, I have found him to be both honorable and fair. He also has a passion for knives and quality that helps drive the industry. What we don't want is a stagnant industry, IMO.

sal
 
Sal is always such a gentleman. Seriously. Composure is a good thing.

Over the top marketing doesn't appeal to me personally. That makes it tough for me to give Lynn a serious look, but I've done it anyway.

Maybe worse once I dig into it, naming a steel "Carbon V" to imply something proprietary or magic about a good quality carbon steel known to the rest of industry as 0170-6 a.k.a. 50100-B is just more over the top marketing hype of what is otherwise a good product, if you like carbon steels in the first place (big working knives is about it for my interest in carbon steels). They ought to be really bragging about how refined and consistent their heat treating process is, not hyping a "branded" steel. I just find that kinda lame below the surface. But hey, Lynn markets to someone other than me apparently.

A few of CS fixed blades have some merit... the Trailmaster Bowie is a good piece but is too heavy w/ 5/16" thickness to get the pry bar strength it has (even 1/4" is heavy), and the handle doesn't flare enough at the butt IMO for a good grasp while chopping.

The Master Hunter is a very nicely designed (thanks Loveless), very practical hunting knife. No BS here.

The SRK and Bush Ranger & Recon Scout have merit for what they are, simple working Bowies.

The bigger tanto's are ok for what they are, like the Master Tanto, Recon tanto, etc.

The Loveless copy "Big Bear" is ok for what it is, if you think AUS-8 meets your needs.

Tai Pan damascus dagger is nice, but $800 retail from a production company? No WAY, not with Bob Lum around!

Aside from the shovel and throwing stuff, spears, etc, offbeat stuff, so much of the rest of the product line is bettered by others, including Sal and BM etc.

For example, a carbon steel filet knife? Rust a problem maybe? Salt water fishing anyone?

Why no liner locks? I don't care for spine/rocker locks myself.

All serrated kitchen knives, ala Ginsu?

Scimitar folder? gimme a break.... triple action folder? Twist lock thingie? Yechh. Something for everyone I guess.


[This message has been edited by rdangerer (edited 07-30-2000).]
 
Have a Master Hunter in CV, Trailmaster in CV and a Tanto in San Mai steel. I like these knives, but like others I long for nicer handle material. I personally am not impressed with any of their folding knives and don't own any. The knives I have are great. I think they should produce a line of higher end/better looking folders.

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Knifeknut
 
For what it's worth. I like Cold Steel and Lynn has always been pretty cool with me. I've known Lynn since '84 when I met him at the SOF convention. I even filmed him teaching knife fighting for a film we made called "Knocking on Armageddon's door". I have most of his line and frequently loan the blades out to students for trips. The ones I have are durable, well thought out designs.

I left 9 of his little Bushmasters in the jungle with the Candoshi one year. I came back the next year and five were still working hard, two had been traded off (for wives I think) and two had broken and were serving as short kitchen knives. The Folks wanted more....Pretty good for a cheap knife that saw hard service every day for a year.

Carbon V rusts too easily but Lynn is upfront with his warnings.

Ron
 
I think Cold Steel makes some of the best fixed blades around. I own several of their fixed blades: Culloden, Kobun, Peacekeeper, etc. and they're all of good quality (best edge I've seen so far on fixed blades). But I dislike their folders because of the Zytel they use for the handles. Throw in some G-10 or Micarta, then I'll buy some.
 
A couple observations about the Voyager folders:

1. The new ones have metal, not plastic clips, and the new handle design is more oval and symmetrical. There are still some old models with plastic clips being sold, so ask first if this is important to you. I got my large clip point voyager in January before I heard about the design change. Mine has the plastic clip. I would have waited and gotten the new design if I had known. That said, the plastic clip has not been a problem. I even fell on it once when I twisted my ankle a few months ago. My knife was clipped to my waist band on my right hip. I fell heavily on that side, and I weigh 245 lbs., so I do mean heavily. I fell on asphalt and skidded a bit. The plastic clip was hardly damaged at all, just the raised Cold Steel logo got ground down a little. Another plus for the plastic clip, it doesn't scratch furniture or cars when you accidentally run into them with your hip.

2. Don't like the serrations? I don't like serrations on any of my knives. Buy the plain edge. Simple.

3. Zytel handles. I admit I thought the handle on mine felt cheap at first. Then I realised what I was reacting to was the light weight, which did make the knife feel a little blade heavy. Once I got used to it, it didn't bother me at all. The handle seems plenty strong, stout even.

YMMV, IMHO, etc., etc., ...
 
Thrawn, are you forgetting those threads we had about the PBC made by black cloud and the Uji made by Livesay? Those are nothing but weapons. The R-1 a weapon? sure is, but it is also a damn fine knock-off of the Randall 1, one of the best knives ever made, period. "tactical folders" is a really nice term used to describe a knife most of us would use for "self defense", in which we wold likely consider using the knife as....a weapon. I don't mean to be abrasive, but relax a little. In any circumstance carrying a Bowie is going to be looked at funny, even if you market it as a pruning knife. T hawks as weapons? What else would you use it for? Spears are weapons.

I have owned many cold steel knives thru-out the last ten or fifteen years. Lynn T, take him or leave him, is a fine designer who is attempting to get the right tool or weapon into your hands for a reasonable price. Sure the Ghurka Khukri costs a bunch, it is a finely made weapon, and is marketed as such, Gyi uses one to train and he even says that the big K has no place in the civilized world. Nothing is civilized about weapons, if we were a polite society in which we all lived by the rules, the concept of weapon would likely be unnecessary. We don't, they are.

Kraton is a real fine way to hang onto anything when your hands are wet and it requires little maintenance. So is Micarta. He uses Kraton b/c it works and is easily mass produced. I had great service every time CS did some warranty work for me and when they lost my TM I sent to have the dings removed from the edge, they sent me a new one. Carbon V does rust, but the Randall 14 I kept i the sheath got speckles as well, I now store in a pouch wih wd-40 on the blade. CS makes a fine mass produced product that is designed for abuse. if you manage to break it, what are you doing using a knife to hammer like that or pry or whatever? If you are asking for warranty service, chances are maybe you were not lost in the backwoods fighting ma nature for your life, but instead screwing around trying something you knew was idiotic.
Folders? The serrations suck in my opinion, but Lynn sells a lot of them, so I buy other folders. The voyagers did not fit my hand well, but damn if they were not everything I could ask for in terms of durability (I used mine to split wood for fun while drinking, another irresponsible knife behavior I guess)
I sold that one to a freind for $15 after wood incident, the lock was still rock solid.

The only knives I have ever damaged thru stupid use were PC and Benchmade, mainly because of the finer, more delicate nature of the beast. Either of these makes are great, just not enough backbone for me. AUS-8? I was doing thrust in, cut out drills with the baby voyager clip point, bent the tip about 80 degrees and then made it right with a pair of pliers. Worked great after that. I will take that kind o duarbility any day.

Lynn, i keep a recon tanto carbon 5 under the matress, just in case. I may replace it someday, but I have to tell you that gives me a secure feeling checking out what goes bump in the night. Thanks.
Parker

[This message has been edited by Parker (edited 08-09-2000).]
 
I havent had many CS folders....I wasnt into folders when I was buying then.
I defy anyone to find a more dangerous blade than the Tai Pan. Im also am a martial artist, and I can show you 99 ways to use the Tai Pan to filet about anything or anyone, but NO safe way to defend against it besides the use of gunpowder!
I have a trailmaster, 2 kukrhi's, a master tanto and a tanto X111 or whatever...the 12" tanto is called.
Before I 'discovered' the custom market...due largely to my finding these very forums, the finest knives I could find were the Cold Steel. I shopped hard and paid reasonable prices for all of them, have given a few as gifts, and kept the rest.
OK so Blah, Blah, Blah...to the point??
I would crap before Id use my Mike Sakmar
for ANYTHING! Id sooner be keel hauled before Id take a Broadwell into the field..but my Cold Steel stuff??
Id use it, and if need be abuse it, never bat an eye, and just keep putting an edge on them. That IMO is the finest compliment I could give ANY maker anywhere.
Thanks Lynn!

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To secure peace is to prepare for war
 
I don't use it for anything, but I love my CS Magnum Tanto IX--the only problem is that most people get a little panicky when they see it.

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"I'm out there Jerry, and I'm lovin' every minute of it!"--Kramer
 
Some who are nitwits seem to confuse CS the company with LCT's opinions. So what if they badmouth other companies?
 
most of the CS sheaths suck.
their "ginsu" serations suck.
there are better handle materials available now than Kraton.
and my (new) SRK wouldn't even poke thru the sidewall of a dead tire at the range when i was setting up targets, ended up using a Benchmade folder.

overall, decent working knives for the "average" user (whoever THAT is) but the prices are climbing and now even the "seconds" are not the deal they used to be. i'd reccomend BK&T for inexpensive heavy-duty stuff now and the plastic handled Benchmades for inexpensive folders instead of CS.

some of the CS products, like the shovel are briliant, some just leave me scratching my head wondering.
 
I like Cold Steel. True, Lynn is a little over the top; but, that is the same hype that originally go me interested in knives over 20 years ago. At that time Cold Steel had been the first production knife company to break the $100 price level.

They have certainly done better then their two closest rivals at the time Gerber and Al Mar. (I really miss Al Mar's stuff)

You can fault them for the hype, and for their failure to embrace the latest do-dah materials, but they have held true to their base and they are still producing many of their original knives to the same standard they had many years ago. That's more than Buck (420J), Gerber (no longer made), and Al Mar (down to six crappy folders in basic black) can say.
 
Actually, I dropped by the Gerber factory yestrday. They're south of Portland proper, just off of I5.
 
Whoops,

Sorry Johno I misspoke.

I meant that many of the original models offered by Gerber during the 1980s are no longer made (e.g. the Rolox - originaly Benchmark -, BMF, LMF, and several others).
 
I was wondering does CS ever exhibit on any Blade shows or any knife shows?? Just came back from Blade Show West, but no CS in sight, is it because they can't take the heat from others or what??
 
Cold Steel is a very impressive product. I own a few myself. Got on for the "father-inlaw for Christmas and mage it into the will!!! If you have the pesos, they have the knives.
smile.gif


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God Speed
 
My first CS was a minature Hai Hacho (no longer in production). I used this knife when ever I went rockclimbing and when I dropped it off a 100ft cliff and there was only a slight blemish on the back of the blade. I then knew this was a company that I would take to. So I bought a CS Master Tanto San Mai, and I absolutely love it.
I just wish they had more style and diversity in material for thier folding blades.
Now it's just a matter of which one to buy next. Too many choices, can't make up mind, please help. Neesd help, can't focus
 
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