How to train bird dogs.

Jake has a quick eye. He is always looking for movement. And scent. He spends his days on a trolly in the yard, so he sees them often. But he has studied them. When he is off the trolly, he is on a lunge line, a 25' "leash" and I take him to the oak trees and say "squirrel". He scents the ground to where a squirrel recently climbed and mounts the tree looking up. If he sees no movement after a minute or so, he changes his mount to another side and so forth. It is that circling that brings the squirrel around to my side of the tree. Mostly it is instinct, not training. He has seen them on the ground and seen them in the trees. And I have used the word "Squirrel" repeatedly with him when I have shown him one in the yard from the door or on the lead. In the same way, he will cue to "bird". Just patience and repetition so he associates the word with a thing or an action. In the same way I taught him "pee, hot, drink, eat, in, out, up, down, fish, treat, toy, no, good, down, sit, and on and on. He WANTS to learn.
 
Nothing more to ad for training, some very good advice given already, but do be sure to educate yourself on vaccines. Sometimes thoughtlessly vaccinating a dog for everything annually might not be the best option and I have seen it cause issues.

Learn and understand the latent potency of each vaccine, my dogs are not on a strict annual schedule, but I know what each manufacturer guarantees effectiveness for each shot. Some parvo shots can be up to 3 years.

Good luck!


-Xander
 
All great recomendations so far! Training dogs is very rewarding.

Mostly I've had Retrievers. Labrador and Golden's.

Currently, I have a Golden. Beautiful hunting dogs that happen make excellent family pets. That may seem like an oxymoron, but some dogs do it well. The reason for my preference toward retrievers is due to the type of hunting I do. Generally, dove, duck, and deer with the occasional squirrel or cottontail.

Now that I've said that.... I'll get to something that you guys may find interesting, as I have not read this anywhere (although I'm sure I didn't invent it)... but it is a method of training I've found very sucessful.

As a pup all retrievers love 'toys' or something to carry in their mouth. It is their nature. I soak all of my pups toys in deer blood, since that is where we generally need their help. Finding deer in thick brush is very difficult even with a good blood trail since a deer with no heart left can run 50-75 yards. Blood=Fun for the dog. My dogs have recovered countless deer that would have certainly become coyote, hog, or buzzard fodder otherwise.

What I have read is for dove, quail and duck. I save one or two of each and freeze them whole. We play 'retrieve' or 'fetch' with these 'toys' until the feathers are completly gone and they got pretty gross to handle, even after refreezing them after use. As an added advantage this teaches a 'soft mouth' because the dogs don't like to bite into the frozen bird. But to this day the dog recognizes these scents and retrieves on command. Freezing and tossing a deer isn't feasible. :D

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As this would also be a family dog I don't think the kids would be to pleased with bloody toys. But it doesn't sound like a bad idea. Idk if it could cause disease though. And I have a gam eplan set. As soon as I get her when she is 6 weeks I start obedience and after a few weeks we will take her to the field where we hunt to get her used to the field.. We will have an older trained dog to kind of show her the ropes. We plan on doing this quite often even during the offseason using purchased birds. I'm hoping she catches on rather quickly. I would like her to be ready by next dove season but I won't rush her
 
Consider also getting the dried wings I mentioned. I think I paid about five dollars for a four-pack at Gander Mountain. And I don't actually let him have the wing, so they last quite a while. I can make him hold while I twitch the wing on the ground on a line and crappie pole. Then command him to flush it. Some locals here do release pen raised quail and pheasant for "hunts" and training. I can't see that they would behave like wild birds but I really don't know.
 
DDA2011 said:
Codger I must say jake is a beautiful dog and he sounds like a great companion!
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Thanks. I do tend to brag on him, sometimes too much. He is a very high energy dog and requires a lot of exercise and a lot of my time and attention. He is average intellegence for the breed, but IMHO, more intellegent than many breeds. Or more accurately I keep coming back to that word, "biddable". It was one of the traits that the developer of the breed dedicated his life to perfecting. And while it is so desirable in so many ways, it also presents it's own drawbacks. Ask any teacher which student presents them with the most challenge, the slow, not-so bright ones or the bright, energetic ones. I have to keep him occupied and challenged.

We are currently converting verbal commands to hand signals (cross training for both). I don't know what will be next. He shows no signs of reaching his full capacity of learning. Be prepared for the energy factor with your new pup though. And the complications of too many "leaders of the pack". She will become trained to beg food from the table or "shop" for food in the trash. Those are behaviors I despise. And it is simple enough to train them not to do that. No people food. None. And especially not when you or others are eating.

"AACKK!" is my pack leader warning growl and I use it as a very strong "no". A "line in the sand" as it were. Punishments vary but are seldom physical. He has to respect me, not fear me. He has to be willing to come to me knowing I am displeased. A physically punished dog usually will not.

Dayum. You set me off again! :p
 
Again, with all dogs, rule #1: train everyone in the house first. Rule #2: Consistancy, consistancy, consistancy. Tone, words, timing, who the "leader" is, and all rules are to be followed no matter what. Rule #3: love that animal like a child!

Enjoy!


-Xander
 
Codger......reading your posts on this thread is like listening to my dearly departed Grandpa, he "retired" at 47 and only helped on the farm during harvest and planting.
Other than that he was a fulltime hunting guide on our land for Waterfowl and fished/hunted every week. He ALWAYS had time for me and taught me about hunting dogs.

Had to put down my old boy Spot last night(14 yrs 8months).......it was time before he was debilitated. He had a good walk and swim before
RIP buddy, I'll be throwing your kong off the dock soon enough.

He was constantly learning up until about 13yrs old, at least 20 command words, trained on whistle and arm movements in the field and knew 25 to 30 separate toy names and would bring whichever one asked for.
He was a handful like your boy Codger, so smart and got bored easily.

When I wanted a break or to entertain him I had a list of the toy names and would spread them all over the house and yard while he sat(no peeking!!)
 
Sounds like a wonderful companion Brad and I am sorry for your loss. That is never an easy point to reach with an old dog. Not much easier than with a friend or relative, having to let them go knowing that prolonging would be worse for them and for you. But... don't put off filling that space in your heart and family any longer than need be. I regret waiting so long to get another setter myself. Oh, we've always had a dog, but they were just "dawgs" that were companions for my growing children or being trained for SAR only without much socializing other than basic obedience.
 
Brad, sorry you had to let that buddy go. Those are hard times but part of the deal taking care of a good dog. I keep some kind of hound nearby as I enjoy them for their spirit and block headed good nature. Years ago it was a pint sized dachshund with plenty of field sense and we had many good days working field edges for pheasants, bunnies and a chipmunk now and then. Now I keep a bluetick as a bigger hound for my boys to enjoy and to hunt with when we can. I have an appreciation for a hounds ability to work out away and circle back to check in. While you can't exactly train coonhounds to do bird dog work they will work birds if you encourage them to pay attention to birds in the day and let them get their legs warmed up before you get serious working them in tall grass and cattails. Anyhow, you are looking for bird dogs so find you a bird dog breed and the strain bred to hunt the style you enjoy whether it is bobwhites or pheasants. If they are bred for it a good hunting dog will teach you more about hunting than you can teach it. My neighbor is a Brittany spaniel guy and watching what he does with them and how eager to keep him happy with upland birds and waterfowl I would consider them if I was looking for a dual purpose bird dog.
 
Codger mentioned a wing tied to the end of a fishing line. This is a real good drill to do with the young bird dog. The pup will naturally try to grab the wing. Pull the wing away from the pup just before the pup can grab it. keep flipping the wing around using the fishing pole and wing. Whatever you do, do not let the pup catch the wing. The pup will eventually get tired of chasing the wing (bird to him) and will stop shy of the wing (point). When pup stops, stop moving the wing. Training this way teaches the pup it is not possible to catch the wing (bird). When the pup stops say "whoa" then praise pup. You can also use live birds to train the pup. I used to use pigeons because they were cheap. Tie a piece of wood to the pigeons foot so it dangles, using string. The wood should be light/heavy enough so the bird can fly only about 10-20 feet. Place the bird in some brush and lead your pup to the bird. Have your pup on a long lead (about 20 ft), so you can stop her if she tries to bust the bird. When she gets close to the bird say whoa, and stop her by tugging on the lead. Make her stay still (this is where training with the wing pays off) while you approach the bird and flush it. When the bird flushes shoot a round off in the air (I use a starters pistol). The bird will fly the short distance, thanks to the stick. Tell the pup to "fetch" and let the pup run and fetch the bird. Do not let the pup fetch the bird until you say so. Keep your training sessions short, and try to always stay positive. You and pup will have a blast and in the end will have a well behaved gun dog.
 
I took my chocolate lab to the range with me when she just had her last parvo shot. She got used to gunshots easily without being afraid of them. Eventually, once she hunted a day or two, a shotgun blast equated to something for her to fetch. This is a beautiful instinct in a gun dog. I was quite paranoid about parvo, and did not let either of my dogs out of the house without their last parvo shot delivered. I shot a pigeon with a pellet gun and trained Gracie with it, for fetch and mouth feel prior to her first hunt. She instinctively learned to look up for a "hit" bird once a gun shot blast happened. She kept the faith, LOL, since my percentage is not great. She always found my birds. She is not a disciplined show perfect hunting dog, but a great companion in the field. Shame on me for not fully developing her, but she is turnkey in my book for dove and duck, and I forgive her for not retrieving everything. One year, she got overheated from the desert, and I stopped so she did not get sick. Duck hunting, I tethered her into the blind to get her calmed down, and then after the first duck landed in the water, she knew what she was supposed to do. She would stay put once she had her first bird retrieved. Man, I love that dog!

I have not trained Misty yet, and she will do a dove hunt next year. I am planning on a duck hunt with Gracie in 2 weeks or so, but I can only handle one dog, Misty will have to stay behind this time.
 
Cj, waiting until all shots are done is not paranoid, its smart. Parvovirus can live on concrete for up to a year. I manage an independant feed/pet store, I can't tell you how many people are surprised when their puppy gets sick because they either didn't get shots started right away or just took the dog everywhere before shots were finished, then want to get the parvo shot after the dog is sick. That's a good way to kill a dog.


-Xander
 
fast14riot said:
Cj, waiting until all shots are done is not paranoid, its smart. Parvovirus can live on concrete for up to a year. I manage an independant feed/pet store, I can't tell you how many people are surprised when their puppy gets sick because they either didn't get shots started right away or just took the dog everywhere before shots were finished, then want to get the parvo shot after the dog is sick. That's a good way to kill a dog.


-Xander
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If you have never seen parvo sweep through a kennel, count yourself lucky. A friend bought a brace of black and tans, beautiful pups, and asked to kennel them on my property. Most of his beagles started showing signs in a few days, the coon hounds were all dead in a few more days and the beagles barely survived. My bloodhounds were a hundred yards away, innoculated but not current. I didn't lose one but it took a lot of time, money and effort to save them. Jake has no kennelmates here, but he does go everywhere with me. And many people in the neighborhood don't keep their dogs up so they wander thru. All the more reason to trust my vet with a strict schedule of innoculations.
 
Codger, you situation makes perfect sense, keeping a strict regime of vaccinations. But I do encourage people to research the vaccines as well. My own big dog I on a two year schedule for parvo, 3 for rabies, and no bordatella (kennel cough).

Again, this is my own decision and based on my own research for a non hunting dog. He is 10 now and perfectly healthy and happy as can be. If the vet switches brand of vaccine I ask and then research how long they (the maker) guarantee it for, among other things, and decide from there.


-Xander
 
Ya'll fellers heard of the new rattlesnake innoculation? Just came out about a year ago. It's an initial shot, with a booster in 3 months, then a followup every 6, but life saving none the less. I'll be starting both my GSP's about February. My vet doesn't administer 'em, but they referred me to another local vet that only handles gundogs.
 
Like anything the more time you put into the dog the happier you will be in the end.

WHOA!!! is a solid command for any pointer. Properly introduced it should stop them on a dime into the sit position awaiting further instruction. It helps greatly with getting over the prey drive in the German breads when it doesn't you'll need pliers for porcupine quills or a locating beacon when they bolt after fur.

Don't be afraid of training collars we have decades of great books on electronic training. The Dobbs family have a great one they did with Tri Tronics that I found very useful.

Congrats and good luck with the new pup.
 
Good news guys I get my pup mid march and I am beyond excited. She is from a recommended breeder and the mother and father produce some pretty handsome pups. Both the mom and dad are avid hunters as well as show dogs. I already have everything I should need. I've spent a lot of time reading and rereading the recommended books and I have scheduled hunting trips with a professionally trained dog to get her acclimated.. My only thing now is do I want a roan ticked or a liver ticked. (She's not due for another week!)
 
Congratulations! Post some pics and updates, sounds like you got a beautiful thing in the making!
Solid advice here, my dad breeds and trains English Setters but not the dog I ended up with, or even a hunting dog. Happy for you man, enjoy the ride and keep at it!
 
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