How tough are Spyderco's fixed blades?

[philwar]

Nutnfancy tested it, found it overpriced.

The Spyderco Temperance 2 is a capable blade. It is an upgraded successor to the similar and discontinued plastic-handled Temperance 1. Wearing a perfectly ground 4 7/8" VG10 full flat ground blade, it will cut, slice, chop, and split well (with moderation). This blade comes razor sharp as well and should exhibit the effective Spyderco heat treatment and adequate edge holding, rust resistance, and fine edge capability of VG10. The grind lines are wonderfully precise and the overall the fit and finish is superb. The drop point leaf blade features excellent belly for slicing and a sharp tip for the thrust and detail work. It also angles forward from the handle for more comfortable cutting. The hilt is skeletonized underneath the Micarta scales which contributes to the excellent 7.0 ounce blade weight (9.6 with sheath). Just don't expect the Temperance 2 to be a heavy duty hacker however; there's just not enough weight forward in the blade. The brown canvas Micarta handle is comfortable in hand, has a radiused lanyard hole, and thankfully has no sharp shoulders around its circumfrence. It offers good control of this well balanced blade in concert with a small run of jimping topside and the bottom finger indentation. While handsome, note that the Micarta can be slick in dry conditions but traction improves when it gets wet. Make sure that's not salt water that gets on those handles however because you can't remove them...they're pinned. I find the jimping lacks sharpness in this specimen (a rarity for a Sypderco blade) and as such the thumb doesn't lock on it with authority. The "Boltaron" sheath seems identical to Kydex to me and is excellent: lightweight, waterproof, drains well, and it's tough. I would prefer a Tec-Lok® belt attachment to the included G-clip which is a more cost-effective clip for Spyderco. Perhaps trying to position the blade in the customer's mind as an upscale and special blade, the pricing is high on the Temperance 2. For around $200 you do indeed get a good looking, sharp, FULL FLAT GROUND well-designed blade that will be limited in availability. But if you are looking a utility camp knife, then this is probably too much to spend and other mid-sized factory stainless blade options are available that might offer similar utility in role. All are more affordable. These could include the Cold Steel SRK ($65), Roach Belly ($24), Finn Wolf ($12), Long Hunter ($20, great food prep and camp knife), Fallkniven Forest Knife ($125), Fallkniven A1 (great wood splitter, tough, $154 for satin), Benchmade Nimravus ($100), Gerber Profile ($18), Gerber Big Rock ($25), SOG Team Leader ($150), SOG Seal Pup Elite ($62), or even the Spyderco Aqua Salt ($65). Prices vary and other high utility, high value options also exist. But the Temperance 2 remains a high quality, well-executed blade. Only a Spyderco is a Spyderco and some will find their money well-spent on this beautiful blade. /////////////////// Nutnfancy Likability Scale: 7 of 10 (cost considered)

I don't think it would be better in any way than a Scrap Yard 5 LE, for the same money.

 

[Josh K]

Nutnfancy tested it, found it overpriced.



I don't think it would be better in any way than a Scrap Yard 5 LE, for the same money.

Nutnfancy also thinks that any folder over 4 oz is carrying a brick.

 

[NoFair]

More recent Hossom knives are cheaper than RAT equivalents - my last Forager cost $115 versus my last RC-6 at $126.

To me, the issue is ease of maintenance. The Hossom recurve blade and convex grind takes more work...

It is a matter of habit. If you are used to sharpening a convex blade it is very fast work. The recurve makes wide strops less useful though.

With the current prices on the Hossoms they are a steal IMHO. Got a Forester and a Dayhiker for about $200 total

All the Hossoms are probably tougher than needed.

Sverre

 

[JD Spydo]

I am really interested to hear exactly what you base this opinion on. Have you - or anyone else for that matter - used the knives you mention in a range of chores and compared?
You say you've spent 'a couple of days looking over many of the production fixed blades.' What does that mean?

I own Busse's, and other knives wellknown or even renowned for their toughness and general usability. I also own a Dayhiker, and a Rock Salt is on its way. I have great confidence in Spyderco fixed blades. So you understand I am really curious about the experiences that have led you to your conclusions.


Really? Not in any way? I wouldn't know, I haven't compared. Have you? Please share your experience.

Those are fair questions you pose. And yes I agree a guy should back up what he says. No problem. I'll be the first to admit that I have not used one of the new Temperance 2 models. However I have a pair of the Temperance 1 models that I've used the hell out of and they don't stack up at all compared to the construction of the new Spyderco TEmperance 2. The Temp 1 doesn't even have a full tang but it still will take unbelievable abuse as I have put both of mine through. With the new one having a full tang and much improved handle I can't in any way stack up my older model to this new Temperance.

As far as Fallkniven goes. I have a very good friend who has 2 of their great blades. One is comparable in size to the Temp model and the other one is the big Bowie I've wanted for a long time and it's called the THOR model. His Fallkniven blades are superb but I don't see anything about them that overtakes any of the Spyderco's I'm talking about. I like Spyderco's handles much better and the heat treatment of their blades has always impressed me for a production knife.

I've owned many different production fixed blades in my days by many different great knife companies and I truly stand on my opinion that the Temperance 2 truly raises the bar for production fixed blade knives. I've never owned a Busse but I"ve seen many of them and I have friends who do own them. And I will say that I am impressed with that INFI blade steel of theirs. Their knives are built like a fortress, no argument there. But I don't find their blade designs ideal for what I use a fixed blade for. I'm sure I'll own one someday but for now I'll take Spyderco.

As I said I have a great deal of respect for Fallkniven too. If Spyderco would ever make a Bowie as big and well designed as the Thor I would be buying it instead. Ten years ago I was a big Benchmade fan and I still like their blades a lot and I have a few of them and there are a couple of them I still carry from time to time. Their heat treatment of ATS-34 was really good IMO. But I truly think Spyderco's heat treatments and their steel selections for certain folders is far superior overall. That's one reason I became a Spyderco fan. I don't know if that answers your question but at least it let's you know that my assessment of Spyderco's fixed blades are not baseless. I do base my preference mainly on the great luck I've had using Spyderco blades ( fixed & folder) By the way I've at one time have owned every Spyderco fixed blade made except the Hossom models, the Rock Salt and the Bushcraft. But I'll be checking them out too when my employment situation improves.

 

[TIZWIN]

While the Temperance is certainly adequate for most mundane chores, its purpose is self-defense. IIRC, it was designed by Mr. Glesser to serve as defense against mountain lion if one were caught without a firearm. The leaf-shaped blade provides a wicked wound channel, and the handle facilitates several different grips.

In the unlikely and unfortunate event of ambush by cougar, a Temperance will certainly be better than praying. If carried on the waist tip-up, forward of the hips, the knife can be grabbed by either hand. As an advocate of RGEI, also known presently as pikal, I'd carry the Temperance in its sheath, as above, with the edge oriented towards the fly of my pants. The strong hand can then deploy the knife in RGEI, or the weak hand can deploy it FGEU.

I find it a perfect SD fixed blade, but I confess I've yet to test it under duress, and I hope I never do!

 

[philwar]

@JD Spydo:

The only reason I ask is, you were explicitly comparing the Temperance to other knives, saying the Spyderco is better in your opinion.
Leaving aside the fact that you didn't mention the class of knife, which I will take for granted (the Temperance simply cannot be compared to bigger heavier knives), that still leaves the question of factual and practical comparisons.
Now don't get me wrong, I'd love to own it and I think the Temperance is a beautiful blade. But for woodcraft it would be inferior to (for example) the SY S5LE which I own, simply because the Temperance is more fragile,thinner, lighter. Its tip is downright translucent.
For lighter chores, and certainly for SD, I'd prefer the Spyderco.
My point: It's just too simple to make that knife the champ of its weight- or size class without a lot more evidence, evidence that simply is not there.

 

[JD Spydo]

To Blade-Brothers Tizmin & Philwar

Tizwin I think you are 100% accurate about what Mr. Glesser originally designed the Temperance for. I distinctly remember hearing that about 3 years ago. However even though it may have been primarily designed for self defense I'm here to tell you that knife is great for many other cutting chores. One of the meanest chores I've done with my pair of Temperance 1 models was 2 years ago when I field dressed a really big snapping turtle ( 30 lbs +). And let me tell you that cutting job would dull a lot of good fixed blades if not cause damage to some. And I couldn't have done it completely without using both the SE & PE Temperance 1 blades to help me with some of the most difficult aspects of that job. Also field dressing deer is not a light cutting chore by any means. AGain my two Temperance 1 models do a great job on deer. The serrated TEmp even ripped through the rib cage with virtually no effort. I'm here to tell you that every job I've had thrown at me in the past 3 to 4 years that I've used the two Temperance models I've yet to have a job be too tough for those two Temp 1 models.

Philwar I'm sure you're a really stand up guy who likes quality blades as much as I do. I have no doubt that you've probably encountered some blades that might be better than the Temperance model and even the newest one for that matter. But I am a bit confused as to why you say the blade is thin on the Temperance model. I just miked the spine on my PE TEmp 1 and half way down it is .155 on an inch thick. That's not a flimsy blade by my standards. And I've been told that the new one has a significantly thicker spine yet. I know that the Busse blades are known for a very thick spine but this Temp 1 is hardly a daisy flake by anyone's standards. It also mikes out at .067 only a 1/4 of a inch from the tip. Not the thickest blade on the market but far from the thinest and VG-10 blade steel is very hard and tough. My two Temp models from what I've gathered on the factory box were made in 2004. Maybe the later ones were thinner? But the blades on my PE & SE Temp 1 models are very hefty from what I can tell. And I've never broke a tip or chipped either knife. And if that snapping turtle I field dressed isn't going to damage it then I doubt if any routine cutting chore will either. That's why I like the blade so much and can't wait to get Temp 2.

 

[wongKI]

Any INFI blade automatically goes to top of the stack for me

If not, then it's the second-smallest Hossom.

Thanks everyone!

 

[brj]

i cannot say i have performed exhaustive testing on my TempII, but it worked perfect for me on my backpacking trips, for any of my normal chores (food prep, wood carving, etc)
great edge retention, no chipping and the edge can be easily restored even in camping conditions (I have used a pocket Fallkniven fine stone)

I especially enjoy the anatomic curvatures of the handle, which BTW I've never found to be slick, regardless of usage contidions, as per nutnfancy' review

 

[philwar]

I am a bit confused as to why you say the blade is thin on the Temperance model.

It's 4mm I think? That's fair for a 5" blade, especially if defense was its prior design consideration, in fact, some would say a fighting knife might well have been thinnner. Personally I like stout blades. But it's not 4mm to the end, it tapers out, quite strongly, and because of this the tip is thin. I didn't say (or didn't mean to say) the whole blade is thin, it certainly is not.
But for general camping chores that may involve light prying and chopping, the tip is fragile compared to a similar sized RAT or Scrap Yard.
That's all I was saying.

 

[JD Spydo]

It's 4mm I think? That's fair for a 5" blade, especially if defense was its prior design consideration, in fact, some would say a fighting knife might well have been thinnner. Personally I like stout blades. But it's not 4mm to the end, it tapers out, quite strongly, and because of this the tip is thin. I didn't say (or didn't mean to say) the whole blade is thin, it certainly is not.
But for general camping chores that may involve light prying and chopping, the tip is fragile compared to a similar sized RAT or Scrap Yard.
That's all I was saying.

Well Philwar when it comes to prying or chopping I'll admit that I personally would never use any of the Temperance models for anything but cutting chores. I would say that your Busse blades or one of Fallkniven's bowies would be the ones that I would trust doing chores like prying and chopping. I have a Cold Steel Gurkha Kukri that I take on all of my outdoor ventures that I would use for any prying or chopping or I would take one of my other machetes for that purpose. If you are factoring in using a blade in that manner I'll be the first to admit I would never use the Temp ( 1 or 2) for that type of chore unless it was a life or death survival type of situation.

I'm from the old school in the sense that I try to use fixed blades and folders for what they are mainly intended for. Probably the Fallkniven Thor would be my ultimate choice for the jobs you've mentioned.

 

[GrinderMcgee]

The Temp II has real smooth looks. Love how Spyderco does the drop point pattern. Anyone who own the Hossum Dayhiker and/or Temp care to comment on how dextrous these blades are. It seems the Temp II might be better for whittling, slicing, utility.

 

[AF]

The Temp 2 is really a custom quality knife. Pick one up and you'll see. It's a ferocious cutter. I don't really consider it a camp knife because I like my camp knives to be more heavy duty. The Temp 2 is no chopper.
I buy most of the Spyderco fixed blades. I don't like the looks of the Hossoms so I passed on those.
The Perrin Street Beat is another beauty, great for EDC.
If you want a big, tough fixed blade I'd recommend a Fallkniven or Becker.

 

[philwar]

Anyone who own the Hossum Dayhiker and/or Temp care to comment on how dextrous these blades are. It seems the Temp II might be better for whittling, slicing, utility.

I received my Dayhiker about 3 weeks ago, one of those I was away but the other two I've used it almost daily. The handle is actually large for me, I have rather small hands, but it's comfortable nevertheless.
I spent 2 whole days cutting packages open, hard tough plastic wrapping that will cut the arteries in your wrist with no problems, really nasty stuff.
Doing that work with the Dayhiker is a joy, and it's a lot better at it than the boxcutter my colleague used, sturdier, safer.
The only problem was the questions the sheeple kept putting to me about that 'Rambo knife.' (This is a 4.5" blade or so... )
Knife still feels as sharp as the day it arrived. Quite astonishing really.

I can't comment on the Temperance. It looks simply stunning. Never had a VG-10 blade...

 

[philwar]

I'm from the old school in the sense that I try to use fixed blades and folders for what they are mainly intended for.

I don't know if that's old school... It's just common sense! But I like a knife that is overbuilt, even if that means it will be slightly less nimble or precise. I've never found it to be a problem, and the feeling that it won't ever break is worth a lot to me.

 

[JD Spydo]

I don't know if that's old school... It's just common sense! But I like a knife that is overbuilt, even if that means it will be slightly less nimble or precise. I've never found it to be a problem, and the feeling that it won't ever break is worth a lot to me.

Again based on what you're saying I would go with Fallkniven's THOR model bowie. It is a tank of a blade. Laminated VG-10 and it could pry a boulder from what I've seen. Not to mention it has great blade steel. Fallkniven is a company I respect a lot and I've not seen a production bowie better than the THOR. It's pricey though >> somewhere around the $400 mark the last I checked.

But the Temperance 2 is definitely beefier that the Temp 1 for sure. It's blade is somewhat thicker, longer and I think a bit wider as well. It's still got my vote for a camp knife for all kinds of chores. And I truly don't think the Temp 2 is overpriced based on the vast improvements over the Temp 1. Like I said when you get a piece of VG-10 bar stock that long the price shoots upward. Not to mention the custom grade handle on that knife is a dream IMO.

If you want a knife you can be outright brutal with>> I recommend you finding one of Cold STeel's older Gurkha Kukri models with Carbon V steel. I've been really brutal with both my CS Gurkha Kukris and they have held up admirably.

 

[Buffalohump]

Its over $400 actually, a lot of bread!

Personally I think the whole 'toughness' issue is very much overplayed. I mean just how much prying do you intend to do with your $400+ knife? Craziness....

I think a knife with a good slicing edge is FAR more useful than a thick piece of steel that will weigh you down.

I have owned Scrapyards and the like and while they are undoubtedly 'tough' the slicing abilities of Spyderco knives make them the first thing I reach for when I need to cut something....

 

[JD Spydo]

Its over $400 actually, a lot of bread!

Personally I think the whole 'toughness' issue is very much overplayed. I mean just how much prying do you intend to do with your $400+ knife? Craziness....

I think a knife with a good slicing edge is FAR more useful than a thick piece of steel that will weigh you down.

I have owned Scrapyards and the like and while they are undoubtedly 'tough' the slicing abilities of Spyderco knives make them the first thing I reach for when I need to cut something....

That was the point I was trying to get across to Philwar. If you read his last 2 posts he indicates that he factors in whether or not you can pry or use the knife in other manners which a well made fixed blade hunting type knife really isn't intended for. And I agree with your take on it. All I was saying is that if you need a knife that is capable of such punishment then that brings about a completely different criteria. And I do think that a tank of a bowie knife like the Fallkniven THOR could be used in such a manner and still be a good cutter as well.

Personally I agree with you BH because that's what I've always believed a knife to be>> A tool for cutting chores.

That's where I think either a Kukri or a well made Machete comes into play. That's why I take both; a good fixed blade knife along with a machete or Kukri. I still maintain that the Spyderco Temperance 2 may be the best constructed production fixed blade on the market at this time. I'll put it this way>> It's my first choice.

But there are a lot of good quality fixed blades out there. But I do believe that Spyderco's fixed blades are some of the most enduring.

 

[philwar]

Its over $400 actually, a lot of bread!

Yeah, retail. I've never paid retail in my life. You can get it on Ebay for less than half.

Personally I think the whole 'toughness' issue is very much overplayed. I mean just how much prying do you intend to do with your $400+ knife? Craziness....

I don't see what price has to do with it. You either need your knife to do a certain chore or you don't. And then it matters if your knife is up to the task, wether it costs $40 or $400.

I think a knife with a good slicing edge is FAR more useful than a thick piece of steel that will weigh you down.

It's not a matter of either/or. Some knives are good slicers but are capable of more demanding tasks as well.

I have owned Scrapyards and the like and while they are undoubtedly 'tough' the slicing abilities of Spyderco knives make them the first thing I reach for when I need to cut something....

Sure, when you have a choice (ie you're at home). I own a Swamp Rat Vex and it is every bit as good or better as the Temperance, just an inch shorter. But if you're out camping, how many knives are you gonna bring? A good slicer is still nice to have, but can you be sure the knife won't be needed for anything else? Is it worth it to sacrifice a little bit of fine cutting capability for added ruggedness?

If I go camping for more than 1 night, my folder will be doing all the fine chores. My fixed blades will all be tough. That's just how I do it. I'd love to own the Temperance. But it wouldn't come camping with me.

 

[Razorsharp1986]

Wow, I find myself strangely agree to almost all the comments posted.
But it seems that still some of you are actually arguing who's right, while you all share some truth in your opinions.
I agree that taking a big tough blade to the bush, together with a sharp sturdy folder is a good option. But I also think that a machete or a big chopping knife would go very well with something like the Temperance 2.
I really don't believe in taking only one knife to the woods. I actually take at least 3 knives, or more. Two of these knives will be fixed.

I truly do think, that it makes more sense to buy a beauty like the Temperance 2, and use it in the woods is a great idea, as long as you'll have a beater big blade for the tougher chores. That way you'll enjoy using the Temperance 2, making every buck worth it, and still be able to chop, hack, and do whatthefl@k.
I think that spending that much money on a really heavy duty knife, and beat the crap out of it every time you go camping is silly. Or maybe I just have a different appreciation for high priced knives...

Also, you might want to look into another astounding Spyderco - the Bushcraft. I think that this is one Spydie that can take on all tasks in the wood, no matter how tough.