Hultafors Too Afraid to Sell Axes to Americans

IIf a product is "unreasonably dangerous for its intended use or [Get this!] a reasonably foreseeable misuse" the manufacturer, distributor, and retailer are liable in all most U.S. states states for injuries proximately resulting.

For fifty years the law has changed in one direction only: in favor of the plaintiff and his sharecropping lawyer. One plaintiff's firm in Ohio contributes more to politicians than all the defense firms COMBINED. (Defense fees have gone up less than 20% in thirty years.) It's the best legal system money can buy. The more they make, the more they get the law changed so they can make more.

And they have no or relatively little "skin in the game," because, unlike Europe, the loser does not pay the legal fees of the winner. Might as well sue.

Why do you think the sharpeners warn you that (GASP!) they make knives sharp? Why the warning on the very top of the stepladder that if you stand there you might fall? Why does the iron say to remove the clothes from your body before ironing? Are the manufacturers crazy? No balls? Hardly. These warnings are all markers of lawsuits that were lost by the manufacturers and sellers for big bucks. McDonalds? Hot Coffee is --- hot? $Millions? Remember?

While you weren't looking, the plaintiff's bar stole a good portion of your country. The nanny state is not just just the product of the legislative branch. The courts are doing their level best to "compensate" every injury to "spread loss." (See also "spread wealth.")

Grow a pair? That is BS unless it's your money is on the line. These companies have owners and employees who would kinda' like the company to survive. Many have not. They died of lawsuititis,

I can hire an expert to say that any axe intended for cutting is unreasonably dangerous per se because it is not a saw. He'll be a Phd in industrial design for a prestigious university in the state where the suit is going to happen.

A 19-year-old girl fainted and drove her Buick into a 24" diameter Oak tree at 50 mph at a time before air bags and without having bothered to put on her safety belt. Her expert engineering Phd testified that Buick should have built the car to protect her from serious injury in such a crash. (Buick looked like a bomb hit it - a big bomb.) That case went all the way to the jury, which first voted 5-3 for the plaintiff but ended up voting 6 -2 that GM was not responsible for the girl's injuries. And it's gotten thirty years worse since that trial.

More horror stories on request, but you should find them yourselves via Goggle, if you care.

I think that's the problem. We tend to use Google for legal research way too much, and it leads us to perpetuate rumors and half truths. After a while we forget that there was even a truth to begin with. I certainly don't blame us for using Google while we surf the net, but I would expect a real company to use a lawyer instead of Google.

The legal standard you mentioned above is correct (with variations in each state), and I find it to be a completely reasonable one. If while splitting wood my axe hits the ground, causing it to explode and take off my arms (yes, an absurd hypothetical), I don't think the company should be able to get away by just saying "oh, you were not supposed to hit the ground". It is a foreseeable misuse, and I think they should be held liable, and will be similarly held liable in every other western country.

Conspiracy theories aside, every other axe manufacturer manages to sell axes in the US with absolutely no problem, and many of them have done so for centuries. Maybe it is same amazing luck, or maybe we are just exaggerating the problems with our legal system.
 
Google has zip to do with what I posted. I defended the dealer who sold the Buick.

Find me an axe company that has been selling for centuries in the U.S. Must be at least one. Not Kelly. Not Plumb. Not Vaughn. Not Bridgeport. Not Collins. Not Keen Kutter. Not whoever it was selling "Norlund" back in the 1970's. Not GB.

The idea of "reasonably foreseeable misuse" means a jury decides if the very first time in history a product was misused in that way was "reasonably foreseeable" misuse That's just nuts. 20-20 hindsight by a jury is not justice, but it makes a lot of money for the "loss-spreading" industry. (And since less than half the money spent to litigate and pay judgments and settlements goes to the "victims" it's really not about loss-spreading.)

Driver, while legally drunk, tries to take a surface street corner at 65-70 mph (in a 25 zone) and wraps his Ford around a light pole (NOT "breakaway"). Car is literally bent at a 35 degree angle. The gas tank doesn't like to be bent and leaks. The car catches on fire and the driver ("Born to Lose" was the prison tat on his left forearm.) is burned on one leg before passing strangers pull him free. Sues the City for having a dangerous pole but that is thrown out due to governmental immunity. So he sues Ford on the theory that gas tanks should survive any collision without leaking. "Foreseeable misue." You could have made it "safer." Case went all the way to a jury verdict after a nine-day trial. Had to come to trial from prison 'cause he had been a bad boy again. He lost. Cost Ford over $250,000. Cost the City about $100,000. Cost the County about $150,000.00. Cost him nothing. Filed a poverty affiliated so he didn't even have to pay Court Costs. Tax-payers paid 'em.
 
Google has zip to do with what I posted. I defended the dealer who sold the Buick.

Find me an axe company that has been selling for centuries in the U.S. Must be at least one. Not Kelly. Not Plumb. Not Vaughn. Not Bridgeport. Not Collins. Not Keen Kutter. Not whoever it was selling "Norlund" back in the 1970's. Not GB.

The idea of "reasonably foreseeable misuse" means a jury decides if the very first time in history a product was misused in that way was "reasonably foreseeable" misuse That's just nuts. 20-20 hindsight by a jury is not justice, but it makes a lot of money for the "loss-spreading" industry. (And since less than half the money spent to litigate and pay judgments and settlements goes to the "victims" it's really not about loss-spreading.)

Driver, while legally drunk, tries to take a surface street corner at 65-70 mph (in a 25 zone) and wraps his Ford around a light pole (NOT "breakaway"). Car is literally bent at a 35 degree angle. The gas tank doesn't like to be bent and leaks. The car catches on fire and the driver ("Born to Lose" was the prison tat on his left forearm.) is burned on one leg before passing strangers pull him free. Sues the City for having a dangerous pole but that is thrown out due to governmental immunity. So he sues Ford on the theory that gas tanks should survive any collision without leaking. "Foreseeable misue." You could have made it "safer." Case went all the way to a jury verdict after a nine-day trial. Had to come to trial from prison 'cause he had been a bad boy again. He lost. Cost Ford over $250,000. Cost the City about $100,000. Cost the County about $150,000.00. Cost him nothing. Filed a poverty affiliated so he didn't even have to pay Court Costs. Tax-payers paid 'em.

Well, two things. The first is that yes, several of the companies you listed still sell axes under those names, and even the ones who no longer do, operated for nearly a century under the same legal system. I'l toss Council Tool in the mix just for good measure. They just celebrated their 125th year anniversary.

Now, as far as what the law should be, I'm afraid I don't see the outrage with anything that you listed. I think that a company being held liable for damages resulting from reasonably foreseeable misuse is perfectly reasonable. In fact, I am fairly certain that this same legal standard exists all over the world. It does at least in the UK.

I am perfectly okay, and even insist that if my car explodes when it hits a poll, the manufacturer be held liable. A car that explodes during an accident (Pinto anyone?) should not be on the road. Again, if I end up hitting the ground with my axe while splitting wood, and the head busts apart with pieces going every each way, I think the manufacturer should be held liable. I don't think they should get away by saying that the axe was intended just for wood. Most axe users will at some point hit the ground. If the result does not comply with the industry standard, then yes, I think the company should be held liable. This of course is a very different issue from unreasonable use or just an accident.

I am not aware of any western country where a company would not be held liable for damages resulting from the tool failing to meet industry standards during reasonably foreseeable misuse. As such, I don't know what that has to do with Hultafors. I fully appreciate general concerns with our legal or political system, but I think most of them are a direct result of oversimplification of both the issues and the process.
 
I'm sorry, unless you have a law degree and you are a practising attoreny in this field of law it all amounts to YOUR opinion and speculation. Wow and to make assumptions regarding other countries legal systems is outrageous. They wont sell to us.. who cares. It is their choice, are your feelings hurt? Do I understand their position?...no, but I dont have to. There are many other companies to choose from that would be happy for my business. Not looking to upset anyone just my 2 cents
 
Well, two things. The first is that yes, several of the companies you listed still sell axes under those names . . .
No. The names are there but the companies went under long ago.

and even the ones who no longer do, operated for nearly a century under the same legal system.
No; they did not. There was no product liability law until the late 1950's. Until then, even 1% of fault on the part of the unjured user absolutely barred any recovery by an action at law AND the plaintiff had to prove negligence - lack of due care under the circumstances.

I'l toss Council Tool in the mix just for good measure. They just celebrated their 125th year anniversary.
I missed them since their first trademark was in 1961. They only record from before WWI shows them excluded from the 'axes" category and listed under "turpentine tools." Perhaps those were axes as well.

You might have mentioned Snow & Nealley. After laying off their seven employees who made and shipped axes and other tools in 2003 "because the company was unprofitable" and a brief gap in production, S&N had one employee making axes. Recently, they shifted to assembling axes friom forgings made in Mexico. They started as a ship's chandler in 1864 and started making axes at some point.

Now, as far as what the law should be, I'm afraid I don't see the outrage with anything that you listed. I think that a company being held liable for damages resulting from reasonably foreseeable misuse is perfectly reasonable. In fact, I am fairly certain that this same legal standard exists all over the world. It does at least in the UK.
If you are OK with McDonalds case, most Americans are not. The notion that virtually every misuse of a product is the fault of someone other than the person who misused strikes us as fairly nuts.

I am perfectly okay, and even insist that if my car explodes when it hits a poll, the manufacturer be held liable. A car that explodes during an accident (Pinto anyone?) should not be on the road.
I didn't say the car exploded, and as it happened it did not. Any car can be made safer. The incremental cost of that last 1% of safety will insure that no one will buy it. I think someone who did what the driver did in the case I cited should have some responsibility for the consequences. You apparently do not.

Again, if I end up hitting the ground with my axe while splitting wood, and the head busts apart with pieces going every each way, I think the manufacturer should be held liable. I don't think they should get away by saying that the axe was intended just for wood. Most axe users will at some point hit the ground. If the result does not comply with the industry standard, then yes, I think the company should be held liable. This of course is a very different issue from unreasonable use or just an accident.
No, axes are not made to hammer into rocks. There is no "industry standard" to that effect. I can imagine a rock-proof axe. It would not hold an edge. Probably, to be safest, would not be made of steel. Rubber would be good. Certainly not wood. Was the axe unusually brittle, as some CHINA brand axes I have seen "afterwards"? Sure. Stick it to them. (Although collecting from a company owned by the Peoples Army can be tough.) But idiot-proof? That's crazy stuff.

Nor is compliance with "industry standard" a defense in a product liability case in most states. Instead, the manufacturer is held to a 20/20 hindsight standard under which it must anticipate what a jury THINKS should have been anticipated in the way of misuse of the product for purposes, and in ways, it was not designed to handle.

I am not aware of any western country where a company would not be held liable for damages resulting from the tool failing to meet industry standards during reasonably foreseeable misuse.
Neither am I, but that is irrelveant in a product laibility case in most states. Would be in a negligence case, but why would a plaintiff's lawyer go that route when he has products liability?

As such, I don't know what that has to do with Hultafors.
Neither do I. But if I ran Hultafors, I would prefer that you not buy one of my not-rock-proof axes. No offense, but put yourself in their shoes. You want their axes to hold together when they hit that piece of basalt buried in the dirt when you fail to use a chopping block or just miss badly. They don't want a jury deciding if their idea of an axe is "unreasonable" if it can be avoided.

I fully appreciate general concerns with our legal or political system, but I think most of them are a direct result of oversimplification of both the issues and the process.

So the Delta punch press was 45 years old and had passed through several owner's hands, some unknown. At some point, someone had removed a safety device that made it impossible for the operator's hands to be in the path of the descending die. The current owner then disabled another safety device that prevented "repeating" - where the die cycles down without the operator pushing the switch. In fact, he taped down the peddle so the press constantly repeated - up and down and up and down. The operator employed by that owner lost part of a hand. The hand was in the path of the die when the press repeated. Since the employer was broke, the injured man sued the original maker of the press. The theory was that, 45 years previously, Delta should have made the press so its safety devices could not be illegally disabled (in violation of OSHA). That case also went to the jury, at considerable cost only to the manufacturer and the public.

Just what is your experience with the process?
 
Ross, you should edit the title of this to "the thread that won't die" or "Why did I post this?"

But to say something on topic. Clearly there is legal risk to every business. I think the issue here is one of two things. other priorities or whatever and they figured the legal excuse would stop the arguing the fastest. Or #2 their legal or management is just thick skulled.

Seriously, when a company gets large enough that management doesn't see the operations of the business happening, that is the point that decision making starts down hill. As we know HB is owned by Hultifors, so everything HB is just stuff on paper in meetings where the number one priority is personal career advancement and getting bonuses. I'm not a socialist type or anything like that, Government is far worse then big corporations. Just telling you how it is. I have seen these things over and over again.
 
@Thomas Linton-I think it all comes down to the fact that we disagree with what the legal standard should be. I see no problem with product liablity that comes from foreseeable misuse of the product. You clearly see a big problem with it. I don't see the need to exagerate and say that a company will be held liable for ANY misuse (or twist my examples), as this is not at all a part of our legal system. I agree that not every misuse should lead to liability for the manufacturer (for example, chopping concrete with an axe is not reasonable misuse, while the axe hitting the ground during splitting wood is), and our legal system agrees as well. That is why only reasonably foreseeable misuse may trigger such liability. Similarly, the the industry standard funcions quite a bit in determinig the liability of the company. I think we also agree that there are idiots who will sue for anything, but they exist in every country.

Again, this is the standard in just about every western country. No other company seems to have a problem with it or suffer any consequences. GB even has a whole office in the US-gasp! They must know that they will go out of business soon. As far as the fact that many of the US axe manufacturers have been sold and re-sold throughout their history has little bearing on the fact that they seem to function without a problem under the US legal system, and have done so for the better part of a century and continue to do that, of course now joined by every other European axe manufacturer.

I think you are grossly oversimplifying the legal system, and that is why it appears to be so absurd to you. There is no 20/20 hindsight standard, nor is there laibility for ANY misuse, nor does anything have to be "idiot proof". If you actually believe that to be the standard, then yes, the system would certainly seem crazy and absurd. Fortunately, that is not the legal system in the US. Believe it or not, 90% of cases never reach a trial of any kind. A pre-answer motion to dismiss will remove most unreasonable cases, and a post trial motion will set aside most other verdicts. For the rest, we have the appeal system, which is not jury dependant. Is it possible to get a stupid verdict? Sure. That of course is possible in any system. I think that is the biggest problem with basing opinion on anecdotes rather than the actual cases. Newspapers don't have an interest is making it clear that after the insane judgment, the judge reduces the award a hunderd fold. It's just not good news. Few people mention that the amount of the judgment in the McDonald's case which you mentioned was set aside by the judge and that the parties settled before any appeal. It is just much better news to leave that part out and say "Jury gives $2.86 million for hot coffee". If that is how Hultafors gets their news, I can certainly see why they are afraid of the US legal system. Although, as has been mentioned, it is most likely not the actual reason for not selling axes in the US.

@cckw-You could not be more correct. I did not think this post would turn into a "the US legal system is crazy" thread. It is an interesting topic, but as people who are more familiar with the company have mentioned, it seems to have little to do with the reason why we don't have Hultafors axes in the US.

@wizzard1717-if it makes you less upset, I know some of the people commenting here are attorneys who do this for a living. It is not something that is particularly relevant, as I don't think a degree is required for a person to speak intelligently on an issue. I think the reason why people write here is because they actually do want to understand certain things and are not happy to just shrug their shoulders and say "things are what they are".
 
Personally, I think this thread is pretty much fun ;-)

Just a comment to cckw re: Government is far worse then big corporations.
Government is RUN by big corporations.

Best regards

Robin
 
rg, I am more and more convinced this discussion is sufficiently off topic to be deleted.

But someone might think what you are saying is accurate.

Let me first say that reasonable and informed people like the current system. I think they are wrong.

Let me also say that some lawsuits have done the public good by forcing changes in products. A nuke dropped on a city will also likely do away with some very bad people.

You may be reasonable. You sorta sound like it, but informed you are decidedly not.

You posted that we have had the same laws for over a century. That is clearly incorrect, and the Courts say so.

You implied and then said compliance with industry standard is a defense in a products liability case, but the courts do not agree. That is a defense in a negligence case, but fewer and fewer product liability cases are based on a claim of negligence. I agree with this point of law on policy grounds. Why should an industry, in isolation from the rest of society, decide what "safe" means?

You don't see 20/20 hindsight at work. Obviously you are not familiar with jury instructions. Read some jury instructions and the appellate cases that approve them. Could Delta have reasonably foreseen that someone would change their press in the ways I described? The jury was instructed, 48 years later (Takes time to get from injury to trial. 45 +3) that it was their task to decide if Delta should have reasonably foreseen the series of misuses in that case. The jury decided "no." That was an expensive "no" for Delta.

It's more like 95--97% that do not go to trial. Most cases settle, even those where the defendant is convinced the claim has no merit. Settlement is not usually a calculation about truth and justice. Sometimes, but rarely. Its about spending as little as possible to make the lawsuit go away.

You say "A pre-answer motion to dismiss will remove most unreasonable cases." That is not the law. The judge can only dismiss a case on summary judgment if, and only if, resolving all disputed facts in favor of the plaintiff and resolving all ambiguities in the evidence in favor of the plaintiff, a "reasonable" jury "could not" find for the plaintiff. That's a tough standard and judges very seldom grant summary judgment on weight of evidence. The appellate courts are constantly reminding trial judges that they are not to usurp the role of the jury. And by the way, motions for summary judgment are not pre-answer. They are post-answer and post-discovery (document production; depositions of witnesses; testing) And, as a result, they usually come after considerable money has already been spent by the defendant.

You say, "a post trial motion will set aside most other verdicts." May I assume you mean "most other verdicts" with which you would not agree? Wrong again. If it is tough to get summary judgment on weight of evidence, a motion to set aside a verdict or even for a new trial is much harder to obtain. The courts award an almost sacred status to the decision of the six, eight, or twelve voters left after the unselection process called "jury selection." (And in most states, a verdict only requires a majority vote, sometimes a 3/4 majority). The process starts with the presumption that the verdict is correct, and it goes down-hill from there for the loser seeking post-trial relief. When a verdict is set aside or a new trial granted in a civil case, it is the talk of the bar in that legal community.

You say, "For the rest, we have the appeal system, which is not jury dependant [sic]." In fact, the appellate courts are bound to both presume the jury was correct and to reverse only if "no reasonable mind" could find the verdict to be sustained by some evidence. The appellate courts have repeatedly said that they do not retry the case or substitute their judgment of the facts for the judgment of the jury. If the plaintiff presented three theories about why the defendant was liable and only one is sustained, it is conclusively presumed that the jury decided for the plaintiff on the basis of the one theory that was supported by some evidence. Reversal are almost 100% for a legal error by the trial judge in admitting or excluding evidence during trial, issues unrelated to the merits of the case.

Win an appeal? Congrats. 99% of the time you have won the right to a second trial with all the attendant expense. That is why reversal on appeal usually lead to a settlement. The parties habitual behavior shows how unpredictable the system is.


Judges do reduce verdicts. Not often. If a verdict "shocks the conscience" or appears to be the result of "passion and prejudice," the courts at some level may reduce the verdict. We had a verdict reduced from $4million to $1.5 million here a couple of years ago. But you do not get a new trial although your liability was found by a jury that acted is such an inappropriate way. So usually, after the reduction, if by a trial or intermediate appellate court, the case settles for something between the "shocking" verdict and what the court ordered to avoid the risk and expense of further appeals.

"No other company" "has a problem" with products liability law? As a group, manufacturers and retailers speak through trade associations and chambers of commerce with a voice that cannot be misunderstood. They hate our product liability law. What do you think all this talk about "legal reform" is about? How could you miss it? That does not mean they are "right" (whatever "right" means), but they sure "have a problem."

And I have no idea why any company decides not to do business in the U.S. -- going or coming. I assume its usually an economic calculation. If they don't take legal exposure into that calculation, they are foolish.
 
I think we actually agree on most facts, we just don't agree on whether or not that is a bad thing, or more exactly, how dangerous that is to business. The only place where we disagree is that a pre-trial motion to dismiss is not the same thing as a summary judgment motion. Also judges set aside jury awards all the time, including the case you mentioned as an example of a jury gone wild. You will see it with great frequency in personal injury cases. Whenever you see an advertisement for a lawfirm saying "won a $20 million judgment for man hit by a car..." if you look at the bottom corner, you will see something like "reduced to $20,000 by the court". Not that you are wrong; there are certainly stupid cases out there. However, every legal system has its gems. All it takes is some searching.

Like I said, I think we both describe the legal system in about the same terms, I just happen to think that those terms are reasonable, while you do not. I'm sure we can fight over minor points, like for example, while we agree on the standard for an appeal, I think that the part of a judgment which we most often find unreasonable, goes beyond the scope of the fact finding function of the jury. I think that is precisely what makes a verdict unreasonable. Or, while a reading of a negligence jury instruction might sound like 20/20 hidsight, it is based on well thought out legal standard (or at least I see it as such). There are of course judgments that I do not like, or that I do not agree with, but that does not make them unreasonable, nor are they an indication of a defective legal system.

In my opinion it is absolutely unreasonable for a company to say that a person with an axe will create liability for them, and as such they will not sell axes in the US. It is just such a simplistic and poorly though out view, that it can not be based on any research other than anecdotes and stories from friends. Product liability from a simple tool like an axe or a knife is so far fetched (assuming a non defective product), that I think it belongs well within the spectrum of the unreasonable. Of course, if one believes that our legal system has gone insane and is unreasonable to begin with, then perhaps that makes their position a reasonable one.

All that being said, at the point where I am looking up jury instructions on Westlaw so I can post on Bladeforums, my love of axes has taken me down a very wrong path. :) As such, I am going to have to retire and make a note to never again mix sharp objects with the law.
 
Personally, I think this thread is pretty much fun ;-)

Just a comment to cckw re: Government is far worse then big corporations.
Government is RUN by big corporations.

Best regards

Robin

therefore a whole new higher level of ineptness
 
Shame that the pricing works out to be roughly the same as GB's offerings, with the exception of the full sized american felling axe. I guess import costs will do that...

Anyone know if this axe is the same as the one SKwoodsman uses in this video?
[video=youtube;8gv_tbHWbPg]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8gv_tbHWbPg[/video]
 
Product liability from a simple tool like an axe or a knife is so far fetched (assuming a non defective product), that I think it belongs well within the spectrum of the unreasonable. Of course, if one believes that our legal system has gone insane and is unreasonable to begin with, then perhaps that makes their position a reasonable one.

There you have it. Spend some time in Sweden and you'll see how their culture differs from US culture. You'd understand better why they choose not to participate in the insanity. While I am a US born citizen, my wife was born in Sweden and has all her family there. We visit often and I am always impressed with their philosophy of common sense and practicality. They can't conceive of a level of sue-happy society that has evolved in the US. So that Hultafors chooses not to participate in the insanity is not surprising to me. Alas, I do wish I could get my hands on a Hults Felling Axe. I guarantee my next visit to the in-laws in Sweden will include such a purchase!
 
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