I am getting sick of High-End Elitists... Grrr!!!

I agree that people should not put people down because they can only invest a small amount on a knife, or related product. This is not something that I am seeing. As a matter of fact what I see is the opposite. People on this forum seem to do their absolute best to give honest advice.
This has been a great help to me and been greatly appreciated, let me tell you.
I have seen some sarcastic remarks, but for the most part they were warranted.
It seems to me that you are reading something into these repliesthat is not there. That just my opinion and i could be wrong, but I don't think so.
 
First, I did not write this post in response to any of the answers that I had gotten from other posts. Rather, I wrote this to point out a perceived, if non-specific, flaw in the way that some people respond.

I cannot recall exactly when or where I have seen these posts, because I have bee active for many months and have probably read thousands of responses.

I realize and enjoy the fact that the VAST majority of people on these forums are very well-meaning and not at all condescending or scornful in their replies. I have gained huge amounts of knowledge thanks to the beneficience and honest care of the many helpful people that share this forum.

I have, however, had experiences with people who were far less than helpful. Once, when I was just starting out, I made a post that was deemed to be in poor taste. I was merely expressing some creative writing inspirations dealing with the beloved Lynn S Thompson. I was chastised very harshly by some senior members, members who disregarded the fact that I was a newbie.

Now, I am not saying that this happens often, in fact it is quite the opposite.

Summarily, my motivation in writing this post was to bring attention to rarely seen but none-the-less disturbing occurences.

I only hope that you will take this positively and think twice about the way you say things before you click the "SUBMIT REPLY" button next time.

And please don't think that I have lost my sense of humor. I enjoyed the witty bit about the Microtech.
 
Stiletto, I know what you need! A Changbenza knife! Definately not elitist in terms of cost, but as my happy customers would all agree, we are the elite in terms of quality. How about $10 cash and Chang work out a Changbenza just for you?
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Chang and the Rebels of the East!
Southern Taiwan Will Rise Again!
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[This message has been edited by Comrade Chang (edited 07-27-2000).]

[This message has been edited by Comrade Chang (edited 07-27-2000).]
 
SR. Yep. Been there, done that, seen the elephant. What you have to understand is the tendancy of forums to imitate life. Open a knife and it goes clique.
 
I agree that there is quite a lot of attitude here on the forums. It rises to the level of ignorance when one realizes that most of the day to day cutting chores in households around this country are performed with 420 or even lesser steels.
 
Call me an elitist but I'm starting to prefer French-made knives. I seem to be carrying my Opinel more than my Sebenza lately. Don't let the $10 price tag of the Opinel fool you. It is a knife for the pure snob.
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Hoodoo

And so, to all outdoor folks, the knife is the most important item of equipment.

Ellsworth Jaeger - Wildwood Wisdom
 
Hey, Us High-End Elitists are gettin' pretty sick of you too.

It's a two way street, Boy.
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Full Tang: Welcome and well said.

I have been here for a while and have not experienced elitism in any form. There are many well meaning and informed persons on this site, many of which have expressed strong opinions on various products, but each question generally recieves a fair answer.

If the answers appear elitist its probably because the question was poorly stated. Lets face it; the market is generally good at pricing an item. If the knife carries a higher price tag, it generally has something going for it that a cheaper knife did not have.

Does that make it a "better" knife? Yes

Is a "better" knife always best for what you are trying to do? No

It would be pretty reckless/wasteful to use a $10,000.00 knife to scrape paint, and almost sacrilegious to use a rare antique. Beyond the economics we each use knives differently; we vary in style, talents, approach - so when some wants to know what is "best" they should expect a wild gambit of answers.
 
Look, I am going to try to explain this purely and simply. I will probably fail.

This is not one of those "Sebenzas are no better than Gas Station brand" type posts.

I understand why people buy expensive knives, and I hope to acquire a few in the future.

I know that some of the harshness that I see may just be misconstrued humor.

I know that a Carnivore is indeed tougher and stronger than a Schrade Cliphanger.

BUT, when people get harsh with lees knowledgable people for saying that their "lesser" knife is a good knife, that is unacceptable.

And often it is directed at newbies who feel awkward in being around the "big dogs", and who rarely would stand up for themselves.

I did not name any names, becasue frankly I can't remember the offenders. Whether they meant to or not, the damage was done, not to me, but to the targets of their remarks. They may or may not have come back, but we need to keep this forum open to newbies (maybe a little ignorant, NOT stupid).

I would like to thank everyone who posts on this thread, whether friendly or not, because I feel that this is an important issue.
 
Personally,I'm going to take the post as constructively as possible and as a reminder that everyone interested in knives deserves some respect and helpful rather than belittling or disdainful comments. I don't think I've ever been snarky or elitist, but it's not out of line, IMHO to be reminded that sometimes there can be an overemphasis on high end, expensive knives and experienced users at the expense of people who love knives just as much but aren't at the same point as the obsessed fanatics. The acerbic wit of some of the members here also takes some getting used to. But I do think it's worth the effort. Noone should be oversensitive or show a kind of reverse elitism [my Ginsu can do anything your Hattori can do, for $5], but I'll take the original message as intended in good faith.

 
Best 18.00 knife I own is a Camillus 4 bladed army US camp knife. GREAT value. Made in the us. Takes a lickin and keeps on tickin.


CHANG you are the man!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

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Web Site At www.darrelralph.com
 
Chang,

Hey good buddy...
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, by ANY CHANCE do you have that gals' telephone number, that you could share with me?

Damn...
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.

BTW, guys, MY favorite knife is my Large "combo-edge" CRKT "Kasper Folding Fighter", that I just paid a whopping total of $30 for, and my favorite wrist-watch is my $60 Casio G-Shock!.
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.

...Does THAT make me an "anti-elitest", or simply a guy that knows a GREAT value "for the money spent"???

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Dann Fassnacht
Aberdeen, WA
glockman99@hotmail.com
ICQ# 53675663
 
Man did I miss this thread!

Hey all you elitists... KISS MY ASS!

Hey all you poor bastards who can't afford the good ****... KISS MY ASS!

Now that I am Switzerland again... The math is simple.

Buy the best you can afford.

I am often asked "what is the best knife?". The best knife is the one that does what you want it to do at a price you can afford.

I used to carry a cheap Buck 110 knock off. It did what I wanted it to do, but obviously not as good as a real 110 but I simply could not afford a 110. I grew up in the projects and trailer parks of Tallahassee. The important thing was that I carried a knife. I did not give a rats ass what brand it was.

A guy called me yesterday and asked, "what is the best knife for under $20?". I told him that I had a knock off of an Emerson knife I was closing out at only $12.99 and IMHO it was the best deal I had under $20 for what he was plannning on using it for. I also told him that if he liked the knife and ever got a extra $100+ lating around to buy the real thing so he could appreciate the difference.

I used to wear fake Tag watches because I like the style but could not afford the real thing. In fact I still have the fake Tag and Rolex in my jewelry box to this day. I now wear a real Tag. Now that I wear the real thing am I an elitist? Nope, not by my definition.

I like what I have and I like what I want, I just wish I could have what I want and still like what I had.

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Best Regards,
Mike Turber
BladeForums Site Owner and Administrator
Do it! Do it right! Do it right NOW!
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Hey...we all have to start somewhere. Most of us start "at the bottom." Ya just work your way up. When I first joined...I couldn't get anyone to reply to my posts...now look, I figured out how to get the reply...by pissing everyone off.
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Now, don't be a pu$$y.
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-AR
 
Glockman, I don't have that girl's phone number. Wish I did. But uh... aren't you already in a commitment?

Darrel, I will sell you a Changbenza for $8. Shipping included.
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Just e-mail me. Gosh, kids find new ways to make money these days don't they? I don't believe in mowing lawns or selling lemonade. I make Changbenza's!
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You get Serial Number 2 Model 760 Changbenza if you interested.

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Chang and the Rebels of the East!
Southern Taiwan Will Rise Again!
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Originally posted by Mike Turber:
I am often asked "what is the best knife?". The best knife is the one that does what you want it to do at a price you can afford.


Exactly. Sure, my dad's Rolex is a longer-lasting, more finely crafted watch than my 40 dollar armitron, but nobody in their right mind would play paintball or go camping in a Rolex.

It is important to know and accept that money does make a difference in the quality of knife you will get, but sometimes the "best" isn't the best for your purposes. I, too, had a 110 rip-off for a few years. It was my first lockback, and it served me well. It was probably 420j or some other cheap steel, but it cut. If someone had told me that the knife was terrible and worthless, I would have been discouraged.

Thanks to those guys who understood my intentions with this post: take it positively, and remember what it was like to think that fifty bucks was a DAMN expensive knife.
 
I think that some of the negative spins on replies to posts could be in part a result of the nature of the post. Stiletto, your post said clearly, "Best fixed blade under $75" O.K., you know that you can dismiss anyone who says, "buy a folder" because this isn't what you asked, but for the most part you won't get these types of responses, as people *should* be listing FIXED blades UNDER $75.

However, there was a post not that long ago that asked what we thought of a certain knife; I believe it was a tacticaldeathmaster or something like that. I believe it was from United cutlery and it was made out of 420j2. Notice that this person asked, "what do you think of this knife". That opens up the doors, in my opinion. In these types of posts, I warn against 420j2, probably with sarcasm added. I did say that it would make a nice wall hanger, but if the person was lookign for a real user, I suggested they find something else. If they had said that they only had X dollars and wanted something that looked cool, and this knife was the best deal at that price, I would have said, "go for it". Get the best you can afford. Ever use a Craftsman drill? Ever splurge and get a DeWalt? BIG difference in quality!!!! Same things I said above would apply when recommending a drill to a friend. If they are looking for a really great drill, I'd recommend the DeWalt without reserve. If they asked what kind of drill they could get for under $100, I would offer suggestions, but also probably tell him/her that they may want to keep saving for the DeWalt, or at least consider it in the future. I carried a Fury pocket knife made of "440" steel for a year, then I bought a benchmade, and now I have another. I see a similar trend with others too, and it is not wrong to suggest to others that they go for higher end stuff, as in knives there is often a performance reason that they are higher end knives.

Also, many people do use knives of 420 quality or lower every day. No argument there, and they do work. Stick a Spyderco kitchen knife in their hand, and they immediately feel a difference. Often these poeple are not knife nuts, and believe that those knives that say, "never need sharpening" actually never need sharpening, or things like you can't cut steak inless you have a serrated knife. My aunt ALWAYS uses the Cold Steel kitchen knife I bought for my Mom on Mother's day when she is over every week-end. Reason being is that it works so much better than what she has. Many people only buy $100 or less bicycles and ride them everywhere and can't understand how a person could drop $1500 and WAY more on a bicycle. I went from a sears nuclear bomb proof bike to a Trek which was something like 4-5 times the price. HOLY CRAP!!!! I'll never go back now, and wil only buy higher and higher end bikes now.

What I am gettign at is that we often take things out of context on the forums, or do not specify our context enough. Don't ask, "can you recommend a good knife that I'll use for hiking.." as that is very vague. IF you intend on spending no more than $40, SAY SO!!!! Or else you'll get many posters listing $300 customs. If you are looking for xyz steel or such and such properties, SAY SO!!! THis will help our posting and replying out so much better. Also, If someone posts a question about fixed blades under $75 and you want to tell them to get folders, consider whether your "reply" would make a better brandnew "post". A post about folders that offer more performance for certain criteria at a given price range over $75 fixed blades would prove more fruitul and interesting than telling a guy who asked specifically about FIXED BLADES and a certain rpice range to go out of that price range and knife type.

Don't think I am getting down on you Stiletto; I think that this is an excellent post, and a great reminder for us. I will watch the sarcasm, and ensure that I am extra helpful to new members. That being said, if anyone asks how I like 420j2 blades, I'll offer my opinion, unless it doesn't fit their criteria!!! Oh, I liked what you said about thinking before hitting the reply button: Same holds true for the new post button too. And for everyone, your sack full og grains of salt should be handy when reading posts. Math soembodyorother (sorry I forgot your name) made a post about self defence/killing and such, and got a plethoric amount of posts that were quite vicious. I hope math and those that read/post take/took their grains of salt, as it was a discussion of a serious matter, people shared their opinions, people argued, and sometimes it got a bit hot. But I am happy that MAth posted it as it is a very interesting subject and very much worthwhile discussing. And anyone posting a question of that nature or posting a reply ought to know that it will get hot in advance. If I mad e apost that said that Sal Glesser makes ridiculous knives out of inferior material and should switch to another business, as he and Spyderco are ripping us off, I should very well expect a volly of vicious responses. If I feel that way and want to still post, then I should do so. But again notice how unqualified my made up question is. What do I mean by Inferior material? Ripping us off? Ridiculous knives? If I said that Sal glesser makes the model ABC which is made out of a lesser quality steel, not as functional a design for its intended purpose, too soft on the heat treat and twice the price as compared to knife XYZ by someone else, I would get quite a different response!!!

Good post Stiletto. I shall think before posting, take my grains of salt, and let'em have it when they ASK for it!

P.S., after benchmades, what am I supposed to collect?

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"Come What May..."
 
frankly...i think you have it all out of perspective.....a sebenza is NOT a high end knife...most tactical folders...although not cheap...are NOT high end....go to http://www.knifeart.com/ and you can see some HIGH END knives.....I think the problem is people fail to realize what goes into a custom knife, and what really good materials go into a knife like the sebenza. For most of the people i know....the sebenza is a GOOD work knife...nothing high end about it. If its too expensive for you....stick with what you like. A knife that is under $500 is not an expensive knife.

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http://www.mayoknives.com


 
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