I don't care if clips are black or shiny, but I still want to suggest something

G

Griffon

Joined
Mar 25, 1999
Messages
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<A HREF="http://www.canit.se/%7Egriffon/diverse/knives/clip.jpg">
See the whole sketch</A>
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I don't use the clip, much, on my Starmate, because the knife protrudes too high with it, so for example I can't close the pocket flap.

There is of course a reason for this "low clip", so some like it as is, but for us others, I'd like to suggest an alternative clip like the one in the accompanying sketch. It would increase the overall dimensions of the knife by a little, but it's not going to get wider where you hold your fingers, so I don't see any reason why it couldn't be fitted. <small>Comments?</small>

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Urban Fredriksson
www.canit.se/%7Egriffon/

[This message has been edited by Griffon (edited 03 August 1999).]

[This message has been edited by Griffon (edited 12 November 1999).]
 
Very interesting idea Griffon - nice Spyder
smile.gif
,

The design you suggest could have a couple of potential problems:

1. clip would sit low in pocket, but the thickness would increase by at least 3/16" to 1/4" - this would make the knife bulge out, or press into yourself a little more.

2. having worked with various materials in the past, it would be very difficult to make all those bends: clip has to have some spring to it so it has tension. Even if you used titanium, these bends may be hard to produce.

A suggestion would be to mold in a slot/depression into the G-10, zytel, steel to accept the clip in a simple inverted 'U' shape. Clip material would be titanium. Screw would be countersunk flat threading into a steel plate that is molded into the handle. Which ever side you use you have a dumby plate to cover the other side, or both sides if you chose not to use clip (this plate would be made out of a piece of hard rubber for traction/grip purposes. This just came into my head - I have no sketches on this.

Take a look at a EDI Genesis I style clip - sits real low, but it can make knife hard to grip to pull out quickly (though some guy has demonstrated the quickest draw using the EDI system). Many designs are made for good access/grip: trade offs for stealth, low/deep carry, too
frown.gif


The industry needs to divert some attention to the clips for sure. Hard to break away the design engineers from making all those other cool lock mechanisms and innovativations that sell knives
frown.gif
. Just my 2 cents worth.

md2020

[This message has been edited by maddog2020 (edited 03 August 1999).]

[This message has been edited by maddog2020 (edited 03 August 1999).]
 
Lots of good stuff already.

There was an earlier thread where Sal said that time is being put into other clip designs.

Maybe Spyderco could use the EDI/Stealth style, but with the three screw base.

That would alleviate the metal issue and simplify, merely alter prior art to fit a Spyderco.

And I definitely, absolutely think this should be done, even if we have to order them from the Spyderco Factory Outlet for 5 or 10 bocks. Yeah, that is right, I would pay 10 bucks to get a low profile clip.

My Military is screaming "ME, ME, ME, ME, ME, ME, I want one, I do, I do, I do, I do, I want one."

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[This message has been edited by Marion David Poff (edited 03 August 1999).]
 
You overestimate the thickness, I think. The sketch was exaggerated for clarity, if the first bend can be made really flat, the only added thickness would be to the top of the screws, which I make out to be about 2mm.

Still not ideal for a new design, but as a relatively cheap (not much more material, additional processing required is two holes, one tight bend, one bend 180deg instead of a little and possibly a little on one more) retrofit to an existing design I think it's feasible. It's the first tight 180deg bend which is critical I think.

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Urban Fredriksson
www.canit.se/%7Egriffon/

 
Looks great, Griffon. What about a hole to access the pivot so that when the pivot bolt needs adjusting/removal, you don't have to remove the clip?

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Dexter Ewing
Knife Reviews Moderator
AKTI Member # A000005

"Spirits fly on dangerous missions, imaginations on fire.
Focused high on soaring ambitions consumed in a single desire."

 
Is a pivot access hole really necessary? I figure you only have to adjust it seldom, so then you can take the time to unscrew the three clip screws.

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Urban Fredriksson
www.canit.se/%7Egriffon/

 
Griffon,

Ummmm...metal doesn't like to be bent 180 degrees - you always have to have a radius there, or else many times the material just gets sheared/breaks. The radius looks like it needs to be at least 1 mm on inside and 2 mm on the outside. I just a quick AutoCAD layout of your clip - assuming 1 mm material - the thickness comes out to be 7 mm. Current production clip thickness is 4mm. Your clip would be ~1/8" thicker. Not too bad
smile.gif
. It would still be very difficult to find a material that you could bend like this , retain its shape, and still have spring to it.

Dexter - yes, it would need a cutout/hole access to adjust blade tension
smile.gif
. Generally, the tension adjustment isn't needed all the time, Griffon, but it can still loosen up. We could get around this by having the adjustment on the otherside, but if you do that then you run the risk of it loosen it self up from rubbing against your side, or whatever. Facing outward it is protected a bit. Remember, the more times you take the screws in and out of the threaded holes, you can wear out the holes since the material isn't that abrasive/strong (unless it is steel)...eventually the holes wear and then could strip.

Gotta run.....lets see what Sal thinks
smile.gif


[This message has been edited by maddog2020 (edited 03 August 1999).]
 
Looks pretty good, but why does it bend 180 degrees twice? Seems like you could achieve the same thing with only one bend.

-Drew
 
The "S" bend is there mostly in order to clear the heads of the screws and in part because otherwise the clip might end up too high relative to the rest of the knife. I'm not sure I'd like it to go outside the profile of the G10.

This latter can of course be cured by placing the bend a bit further down, thereby clearing the top screw and at the same time removing the need for the two access holes, which may make sense from both an economic and materials standpoint.

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Urban Fredriksson
www.canit.se/%7Egriffon/

 
I agree with md2020. That extra 180 is going to be a real bear to manufacture and will certainly add thickness to the overall package. If it's beaten flat, it would be weak. I suspect that you'd do better with, as md2020 put it, a simple inverted U that could be applied in either of 2 ways. You could either have a version with a fairly tight U all on outer (from the body) side of the knife OR you could have a clip that goes over the end of the knife in a U shape. The advantage of the latter would be a larger and less problematic radius of curvature, which would be both easier to manufacture and less prone to either break or stick out. It would obviously
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work only as a tip-up carry option, so it may be less suitable for most Spyderco designs. OTOH, a butt-end clip would eliminate the problems with pivot-screw adjustment.


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Paul Neubauer
prn@bsu.edu

 
I would like to see "deep pocket" style clips available from Spyderco, as I wouldn't mind paying for them at all. I like your design, Griffon. EDI immediately comes to mind for my favorite deep pocket clip in production right now.



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savsport@aeroinc.net

AKTI Member #A000094

Honey, I swear that's the last knife I'm going to buy...


 
I tried to scan all the responses, and didn't see anyone mention this. Instead of the S bends, why not just invert the portion where it attaches to the scale. Sort of like this: instead of having a clip that is kinda like a capital A, with a T coming out the bottom that is the just before the first bend, make it and inverted Y.

Just a thought.

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Work hard, play hard, live long.
Outlaw_Dogboy

 
I truly believe the way to make this happen is to take the EDI style of clip and alter it to the Spyderco style of attachment.

Maybe shape it differently, but one turn only.

MDP

Following should be a pic of an EDI clip.

genesis.jpg


 
My $0.02

I think the idea has merit but you only need one 180 degree bend. The clip needs to be wider and have two sets of three holes in line with each other to provide access to the screws holding it. The extra width is due to the outer set of holes being slightly wider. I think the 180 bend can be achieved if the metal is heated and bent hot and later heat treated.

I think its a good idea. It adds more stealth, especially if Sal could hold the spyder advertisement.
 
EDI has no patent to my knowledge.

That is why Mike of WOW has them too.

There was prior art on them, whch killed the patent application.

MDP
 
Just my 2 cents: I would also like to see deep pocket clips for all of the "regular" Spyderco's like the Delica, Endura, . . .

Bernie
 
I agree with everyone who's said that 2 180 degree turns are unnecessary. Using three screws like this, they don't need to be all that big, so their profile can be small. Essentially, we are talking about some kind of modification of the EDI clip. As far as low profile carry, I think they have the best solution so far.

I would like to see this as an option on all Spyderco's, but I think the tip-up carry would have to be given up in most cases. This means a redesign of the clip on these knives, which is significantly more to ask for, but still something to hope for.

Either way, I'd like to see a Spydie low profile clip, if only on a few models

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JP Bullivant
 
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