I have an Etching a Damascus guard conundrum...

- kAd - · Oct 1, 2012

Hey guys!
So i'm working on a knife that is aldos 1084, and I'm cutting a slotted guard out of mystery Damascus from a eBay India knife tang...
I plan on fitting it post heat treat, dont think I'll be drilling holes for pins (hoping a slots in the tang-and guard, and JB will hold it)...

My question is: how would yall go about etching it?

If I etch and fit it pre-handle sanding, the etch will be sanded off. If I tack and fit/sand the handle and guard, then remove, etch, and refit, I'm afraid the refit will be sloppy. Handle material is up in the air still and maybe a possibility would be to etch the whole knife, yes handle and all

, if the handle and JB will hold up... maybe micarta (would be homemade).

Also: Lemon Juice? Electro-vinager? FC? what to use???

Thanks! will post pics soon

SunsetFisherman · Oct 1, 2012

etch and fit, then cover with tape while finishing handle or vice versa

- kAd - · Oct 1, 2012

Tape might not work. The guard is to be flush with the handle. Now I haven't tried it, but I cant see the handle sanding to be flush with tape on the guard....

javand · Oct 1, 2012

This is where index pins, and bedding the handle come into play, and what seperates the big boys from the little ones.

Also, a uniform "tapes" thickness of slightly raised edge of handle material to guard transition can actually be a highly desireable finish, and can be difficult to accomplish. Referred to as an "heirloom fit", it allows for shrinkage and expansion of the handle material due to climate without detriment. I've been working on this myself since being introduced to it.

Anyway, what I'm saying is that you ideally want aa method of shaping the guard and handle independant of each other, and being able to remove those seperate components so that you can have them basically finished, etched etch, before final glue up. That's where the index/locating pins and bedding the tang come into play.

I highly recommend trying to make it to the next ABS Handles and Guards class at Haywood, I went this past June and it was the most educational experience I've had in regards to advanced details of high end knife making.

- kAd - · Oct 2, 2012

Hey Asheville!!!

Sorry I wasn't clear. I will be using some Ti rod to pin the slabs. I wont be pinning the guard.

I'm not liking my visualization of a handle just slightly raised off the guard edge... guess I'd have to see it...

Basically I will probably be taking your recommendation to fit-finish-and refit...

Trial and error- gotta love how challenging it is to learn to make a fine knife

P.S. love the "Big Boy" challenge! will be posting pics! I didn't see any of your knifes when looking at your forum posts.... I'll look again

NickWheeler · Oct 2, 2012

I totally agree with Javan on this. One of the few things I will say is the wrong way to do something in knife making... is to put a knife together and THEN etch anything on it. It opens up the chance of all kinds of problems, but even if it didn't, you'll never get it to look as good as if you make the knife so that you can etch and then final assemble.

When Javan said indexing pins, he's not talking about something through the side of the guard. An indexing pin is one that is hidden. Most often two pins are used. They are small, precision ground pins (I use 1/16" diameter dowel pins) that go into the underside of the guard, and then into the mating end of the handle. They line up the two mating parts for assembly.

You said you don't like what you are visualizing, and I'm not surprised because most folks tend to think it's some kind of sloppy, weird fit.

When in reality, it is a lot harder to pull off then parts that are simply ground flush with each other, IMHO. And it adds an element to a knife that helps put it in a finer class... again, IMHO.

Not to be including myself in the big boy class, but here are some photos of a bowie I did with the handle 0.010" proud of the spacer (which was damascus and had to be etched before final assembly

). From a distance, it looks flush.... look at it up close and you see it.

parbajtor · Oct 2, 2012

Brick cleaner or spirits of salt is hydrochloric acid in differing concentrations. Paint it on with a (disposable) paintbrush. You can mask off with tape or nail polish if you don't have a steady hand.

mgysgthath · Oct 2, 2012

I was having a hard time visualizing that as attractive as well Nick, but not now. That looks really good!

FYI those pins are mentioned and briefly shown in Harvey Dean's D Guard Bowie video. It's a bit more advanced video than some others but it's full of good info, even if I can't use it quite yet. I will certainly be using pins on any guards I do (or trying).

P. McKinley · Oct 2, 2012

Nick posted while I was searching.

This is the same idea but I used etched wrought iron on this on rather than Damascus steel. There are two 1/8" pins aligning the guard with the spacer assembly and into the handle. You can barely see the forward edge of the handle sits just proud of the spacer.

javand · Oct 2, 2012

- kAd - said:
Hey Asheville!!!

Sorry I wasn't clear. I will be using some Ti rod to pin the slabs. I wont be pinning the guard.

I'm not liking my visualization of a handle just slightly raised off the guard edge... guess I'd have to see it...

Basically I will probably be taking your recommendation to fit-finish-and refit...

Trial and error- gotta love how challenging it is to learn to make a fine knife

P.S. love the "Big Boy" challenge! will be posting pics! I didn't see any of your knifes when looking at your forum posts.... I'll look again

Pinning slabs? Titanium pins? We are talking about a hidden tang piece?

Anyway. Nick and Peter's knives showcase what I was describing, and I think it's hard to argue with. Beautiful btw, guys.

Don't want to place myself in the big boy category either, and I'm not real prolific, but I know some of those guys, and have had the priviledge to learn from them. Jim Rodebaugh taught me most of what I know about guards and handle construction at his class this year, and corrected many mistakes, and he's undoubtedly in the big boy class.

Since you're pretty local, and you've got a Heinlein quote in your sig, pm or email me if you want, and I'll give you my number. I'm over in Candler.