I need help choosing between these two blades.

I

IamL3G10N

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Jan 24, 2017
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I'm either going to buy a Benchmade Crooked River, or a Zero Tolerance 0452cf.

Not sure which one to get. Specifically I never had an axis lock knife before, and am wondering how reliable they are?
Which locking system is more reliable the ball bearing frame lock on the Zero tolerance, or the axis lock on the Benchmade?
Also how much of a difference is there between sv30 and sv35 steel? (My current folder is a Kershaw blur with a sv30 blade, so I am familiar with sv30.)
If I was to get the Benchmade is their any difference related to durability, between the wood handle option or the g10 handle option?
I'm torn between the better steel of the zero tolerance or the axis lock on the benchmade.

Benchmade Crooked River
af4bf867c1938750a043b87b68910b5c.jpg


Zero Tolerance 0452cf
649730088e8d5785ce3eae6cf324de20.jpg


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i would get the ZT (i already have one) . the fit and finish on Benchmades are horrible ( i have a few benchmades, not the one above, because of f&F issues benchmade refuse to work on or acknowledge)

The axis lock is reliable but some have had issues from time to time. i wouldnt use that as a reason not to get one tho.
the framelock is a better bet in comparison. the axis lock is fun tho. so is flipping the 0452

g10 vs wood - up to you, g10 is better for grip and weather, where as wood looks way nicer.

s35v is way better than s30v if you have the choice. s35vn is easiler to sharpen, easier to obtain a mirror finish, is slightly better edge retention you wouldnt notice... but s30v is not a bad steel at all. your blur is probably a much softer in comparison than the benchmade, but its a moot point probably.
 
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I second that BM has poor quality control. The ZT is pretty well guaranteed to impress with its fit and finish.

s35vn is virtually indistinguishable from s30v in edge retention and corrosion resistance, but boasts an impressive 15-20% increase in toughness


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The F&F on Benchmades is just fine.....any production knife can have issues. I have a Manix II I just got that is slightly off centered when locked up...OMG F&F of SPYDIES IS TERRIBLE....give me a break. I got a ZT 0450 with terrible detent...OMG ZT IS TERRIBLE....

To the OP. I love both my Benchmade Mini-barrage and my ZT 0450. One will be Axis lock, which is extremely solid and the other frame lock, one is a flipper, the other is a regular thumb stud manual opener. S35V and S30V are extremely similar performance wise:

http://bestpocketknifetoday.com/discovering-the-best-knife-steel/

Both are great knives and looking at two with such similar styles I would simply ask myself do I want a flipper or a thumb stud opener and let that be the deciding factor. Both come from strong companies with great warranties.
 
Amoo said:
The F&F on Benchmades is just fine.....any production knife can have issues. I have a Manix II I just got that is slightly off centered when locked up...OMG F&F of SPYDIES IS TERRIBLE....give me a break. I got a ZT 0450 with terrible detent...OMG ZT IS TERRIBLE....

To the OP. I love both my Benchmade Mini-barrage and my ZT 0450. One will be Axis lock, which is extremely solid and the other frame lock, one is a flipper, the other is a regular thumb stud manual opener. S35V and S30V are extremely similar performance wise:

http://bestpocketknifetoday.com/discovering-the-best-knife-steel/

Both are great knives and looking at two with such similar styles I would simply ask myself do I want a flipper or a thumb stud opener and let that be the deciding factor. Both come from strong companies with great warranties.
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its not bad? because its worse than you think. also if your dead set on buying one, do it, they are nice other than the f&f. but money is better well spent elsewhere imho due to F&F at the ridiculously high cost.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jnwUEgwWzII
 
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Oh man, Nich Shabazz put it out on Youtube, definitely true now.....I'd be glad to take detailed photos of my mini-barrage for you which I just received recently and let you be the judge on F&F....Production knives are just that, mass production. Like I said I have a Manix II with an issue and a ZT I had to exchange because it was bad. It happens. Neither are bad companies.
 
Being a lefty I'll always choose an axis lock over a righty frame lock.
That notwithstanding, I still think the Crooked River is one of the most "custom" looking productions out now. Bolsters, wood handle scales, an anodized pivot collar, and matching backspacer. Quality wise they are on par, with a slight edge going to ZT because BM sometimes does have some QC issues of late. However BM has (IMO) the best customer service of all the production companies. So that issue is negated if you send it in.
To me the Crooked River just has a lot more character than most other productions available now.
 
Mo2 said:
i would get the ZT (i already have one) . the fit and finish on Benchmades are horrible ( i have a few benchmades, not the one above, because of f&F issues benchmade refuse to work on or acknowledge)

The axis lock is reliable but some have had issues from time to time. i wouldnt use that as a reason not to get one tho.
the framelock is a better bet in comparison. the axis lock is fun tho. so is flipping the 0452

g10 vs wood - up to you, g10 is better for grip and weather, where as wood looks way nicer.

s35v is way better than s30v if you have the choice. s35vn is easiler to sharpen, easier to obtain a mirror finish, is slightly better edge retention you wouldnt notice... but s30v is not a bad steel at all. your blur is probably a much softer in comparison than the benchmade, but its a moot point probably.
Click to expand...

Benchmade F&F is easily on par with that of Zero Tolerance. Benchmade is well-known for it's impeccable F&F and it has been since I started on the forums. In fact, I would say that you and the other individual discussing BM's poor F&F are in the very very small vocal minority. I'd wager most people feel the exact opposite.

As for the knife selection, you really can't go wrong either way. I'd take the gray G10 over wood though in that BM model.
 
Honestly I wasn't too impressed by my Benchmades either, but even considering the f&f of the two knives is on par, I'd go with the ZT.

I prefer s35vn and carbon fiber over s30v and dymondwood. But they both look like capable knives.
 
Murdamook said:
Benchmade F&F is easily on par with that of Zero Tolerance. Benchmade is well-known for it's impeccable F&F and it has been since I started on the forums. In fact, I would say that you and the other individual discussing BM's poor F&F are in the very very small vocal minority. I'd wager most people feel the exact opposite.

As for the knife selection, you really can't go wrong either way. I'd take the gray G10 over wood though in that BM model.
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I don't agree with you. seeing that I spent over 200 a 484 and 940-1 and have fit and finish issues, a majority of people have also said so and even collectors. its a large problem.

and I never said and never will say that other manufacturers don't also have fit and finish issues. every manufacturer does, its just that benchmade has a larger issue than most with it. if you don't agree fine, but don't go stating so as fact when a bunch of reviews and people say otherwise.

edit and honestly its just fit and finish its not like its horribly not functional... but for the price it shouldn't be so wide spread.

unless you don't like blade play which is almost guaranteed.
 
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I've never had serious fit and finish issues with a Benchmade. I think a few bad apples have gone a long way to perpetrate that urban legend. Benchmade makes fine knives and have arguably the best service and support of the major US knifemakers.

Axis locks can fail, although I've never had one do so. Failure wil require sending the entire knife back for service as they don't send out repair parts for the lock. That being said, the Axis Lock is the MOST fun knife lock to play with. Absolutely addicting!

There's no huge difference between S30V and S35VN. The S35VN MIGHT hold an edge a little longer but the S30V MIGHT be easier to sharpen. Anyone who tells you they can see a big difference probably sees angels too, if you get my meaning. Technically the S35VN is a better, newer steel...but only by a few molecules.

The handle materials are very equal. The Crooked River isn't wood so much as a stabilized wood product. I think they call it Dymondwood. It's probably almost as tough as carbon fiber (depending on the quality of the CF), but it may darken in tone with use due to the natural fibers. Neither material is very grippy, certainly much less than G10 or the traction tape on your Blur.

When the 0452 first came out there were a lot of issues with frame lock problems, I don't remember exactly what it was, but several respected BF members were very critical of it. I'd make sure you get a newer 0452 to avoid any early production issues.

Either way, they're both great knives. If I sound like a downer, I'm just trying to touch on minor but overlooked issues. I think the ZT is a better knife but it does cost more. The BM might be more sheeple friendly with the bolster/wood look.

I don't own either knife but I have a bunch of other ZTs and BMs and would love to own either of these. At the end of the day, if I were you, I'd go with the ZT and look to pick up a used Crooked River in the future.
 
Mo2 said:
I don't agree with you. seeing that I spent over 200 a 484 and 940-1 and have fit and finish issues, a majority of people have also said so and even collectors. its a large problem.

and I never said and never will say that other manufacturers don't also have fit and finish issues. every manufacturer does, its just that benchmade has a larger issue than most with it. if you don't agree fine, but don't go stating so as fact when a bunch of reviews and people say otherwise.

edit and honestly its just fit and finish its not like its horribly not functional... but for the price it shouldn't be so wide spread.

unless you don't like blade play which is almost guaranteed.
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Mo, you are just as guilty of throwing your opinion around as fact. Blade play that is almost guaranteed? Pffft. Okay. :rolleyes:

"Benchmade has a larger issue than most", and "a majority of people have also said so and even collectors"... Opinions unless you have some sort of industry metric.

And you don't.

You've had issues? Fine, don't buy any more Benchmades. I'm sure they'd be happy to see you go.

Oh, and to the OP... get the Crooked River. I like the Gray G-10 better as well. :)
 
I have had issues with both brands. But between the two brands I think ZT is easier to deal with and has less likelihood of a problem. If I were to get a zt in the 045X series I would try to find the Russian exclusive as I find it to be a superior knife in the fit and finish department and to me just feels better. My 0452cf had some hiccups. But from what I have been reading they may have addressed the issues. The only issue my Russian version had was a little bit of chatter in the hole for the lanyard but every one I have seen has that. Either way If you can get a decent example from either brand you should be happy. Both are great knives but you just have to ask yourself what you want. Axis lock and thumbstud or a flipper. I usually like flipper.

Mo2 said:
its not bad? because its worse than you think. also if your dead set on buying one, do it, they are nice other than the f&f. but money is better well spent elsewhere imho due to F&F at the ridiculously high cost.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jnwUEgwWzII
Click to expand...

my problem with that video is he (Maybe you? I have no idea who this reviewer is) is there is absolutely zero detail in what was actually wrong with the knives. And it doesn't account for knives that could simply not have been adjusted properly. IMHO that video amounts to "don't buy a benchmade sight unseen in 2016. Why? because I said so".
 
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Personally I'd get the 0452CF. I like the blade profile better, and the CF will be lighter than the BM.
Good luck with whatever you choose!
 
PURPLEDC said:
I have had issues with both brands. But between the two brands I think ZT is easier to deal with and has less likelihood of a problem. If I were to get a zt in the 045X series I would try to find the Russian exclusive as I find it to be a superior knife in the fit and finish department and to me just feels better. My 0452cf had some hiccups. But from what I have been reading they may have addressed the issues. The only issue my Russian version had was a little bit of chatter in the hole for the lanyard but every one I have seen has that. Either way If you can get a decent example from either brand you should be happy. Both are great knives but you just have to ask yourself what you want. Axis lock and thumbstud or a flipper. I usually like flipper.
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What about the axis lock, I heard even a perfectly functioning axis like will have some side to side play? Is the zero tolerance is going to lock up tighter simply because of the frame lock?

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IamL3G10N said:
What about the axis lock, I heard even a perfectly functioning axis like will have some side to side play? Is the zero tolerance is going to lock up tighter simply because of the frame lock?

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*** Sorry about the Grammer let's try again... What insight do you have on axis locks? I heard even a perfectly functioning axis lock will have side to side play? Will the zero tolerance lock up tighter simply because of the frame lock?

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You heard that a perfectly functioning Axis lock has side to side play?

Wow.

I fear you are just going to have to buy both, just so you can quit listening to all of us. If not, find a retailer who carries both and see them in person.

Here's what I know to be a bona fide fact. Either of their locks "fail" on you, the company behind the knife is going to treat you right.
 
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