i need help

S

spyderco_freak

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Feb 12, 2013
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REALLY!!!!!!!! dumb question but I can't drill through my knife tang. I'm using a drill press and titanium coated drill bits. I'm trying to drill a 1/4" hole through i think it's 1084 stainless steel that is not treated.
 
1084 isn't stainless.
Coated drills are no better than cheap bits ( which they often are).
Speed, pressure, and coolant are the tricks in drilling.
 
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bladsmth said:
1084 isn't stainless.
Coated drills are no better than cheap bits ( which they often are).
Speed, pressure, and coolant are the tricks indrilling.
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TiN coated HSS twist drills do perform better than their uncoated counter parts, though it also comes down to the brand as well.

spyderco_freak said:
REALLY!!!!!!!! dumb question but I can't drill through my knife tang. I'm using a drill press and titanium coated drill bits. I'm trying to drill a 1/4" hole through i think it's 1084 stainless steel that is not treated.
Click to expand...

You should ALWAYS center drill whenever you're using twist drills, a #2 center drill should suffice in this case.

These speeds are assuming that you're using a 1/4 inch HSS twist drill as you said before, so they'll have to be changed if you go to a larger or smaller diameter drill.

1084 with a brinell hardness of 175-225, 1222 RPM.

1084 with a brinell hardness of 225-275, 993 RPM.

1084 with a brinell hardness of 275-325, 764 RPM.

If your material is softer or harder than those I listed let me know. Just set your drill press or Mill to the speed settings as close as possible to those listed and you'll be fine.

Make sure to use enough preasure to keep the chips flowing steady, but don't use too much to where the drill starts to deflect and bend.

You should also use a soluble oil coolant if you have access to some.
 
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For a drill not used in production, just used for a couple of holes now and then, the TiN coating is almost useless.
TiN coating is on there to help resist heat and aid in lubricity, up to 650 degrees.
A regular HSS drill with a polished finish is more than adequate. HSS is a very heat resistant material. It'll keep cutting way above 650 anyway.
The added lubricity is minimal.
As stated above, just use plenty of lubricant, slow-medium speed and a nice steady pressure.
And yeah, center drill first for sure.
 
I agree with you that they don't truely excel untill you're using them in a production setting, I was responding to stacy's general statement with one of my own. Which in general TiN coated twist drills perform better than their uncoated counterparts, and that is irrefutable.
 
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Just a thought.... if you think its 1084 but don't know for sure, then how do you also know that its not been heat treated? Sounds to me like you are working with an unknown and just guessing. In that case, be prepared to trash out many more drill bits. I have used one drill bit to drill at least 30 holes in 1095, 5160, and 52100. All without lubricant. Just the right speed, and feed rate. The bit finally trashed out on some cpm s30v. Then I resharpened the bit and finished. When drilling, its better to go slow then fast. Its very easy to overheat a bit if you're not using a coolant/lubricant. And the most important thing.... know exactly what you are drilling!
 
I know that it's not heat treated because a friend gave it to me and if I recall right he said that it was 1084. And thanks for all the help.
 
Ocelot85 said:
I agree with you that they don't truely excel untill you're using them in a production setting, I was responding to stacy's general statement with one of my own. Which in general TiN coated twist drills perform better than their uncoated counterparts, and that is irrefutable.
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I agree 100%, if I was coming off as contradictory that was not my intent at all.

Oh, and ease up on the pressure, just a bit, when you're just about to break through, you'll feel it when you're close, that way your bit won't bite into your part and start it spinning.
 
Is it shiny or does it have scale on it? It could be hot rolled which typically isn't annealed (not purposefully/consistently anyway.

Its therefore harder to drill than cold rolled annealed.
 
What I was saying is that the coating does not change the bit quality or drilling ability any more than a painting a number on the hood of a Chevy Nova changes it into a race car. TiN is a lubricating coating. In most home setups, used by people who have limited drilling skills and basic equipment, it will not cut the hole any better than a regular bit. It is the metal that the bit is made from ( not the coating), the cutting tip's shape, and the angles of the point and relief that determine what materials and how well the drill will cut.

The TiN coating will help a bit in a factory last longer due to reducing friction and corrosion prevention, but it won't make a HSS bit drill hardened steel like a carbide bit will.

The TiN bits I see in most hardware stores and places like HF appear to be cheap Chinese bits with a pretty golden plating.

The point of my post was to that drilling technique and the bit metal are probably the biggest things people need to think about.
 
Well it sounds like you either have a dull drill bit or that your tang has been hardened somehow....or both! I know you say it hasn't been heat treated (hardened), so that only leaves a dull drill bit.

Go to a hardware store and buy you another one. Doesn't matter what it is coated with/not coated with, just make sure it's sharp. This is not rocket science! When that one dulls, either throw it away and buy another or sharpen it. Don't keep using them when they get dull. Drill bits are cheap, buy lots of them or learn how to sharpen them. McMaster-Carr has good prices on HSS bits. A sharp bit should last through many knives if used correctly.

If after buying a new bit and it still won't drill through, then you've probably got a hardened blade somehow. You'll need a carbide bit to drill through it if that is the case. Those aren't cheap!

Life is too short to use dull drill bits!
 
"Life is too short to use dull drill bits! "

I may make a sign of this and hang it on the shop wall :)
 
bladsmth said:
What I was saying is that the coating does not change the bit quality or drilling ability any more than a painting a number on the hood of a Chevy Nova changes it into a race car. TiN is a lubricating coating. In most home setups, used by people who have limited drilling skills and basic equipment, it will not cut the hole any better than a regular bit. It is the metal that the bit is made from ( not the coating), the cutting tip's shape, and the angles of the point and relief that determine what materials and how well the drill will cut.

The TiN coating will help a bit in a factory last longer due to reducing friction and corrosion prevention, but it won't make a HSS bit drill hardened steel like a carbide bit will.

The TiN bits I see in most hardware stores and places like HF appear to be cheap Chinese bits with a pretty golden plating.

The point of my post was to that drilling technique and the bit metal are probably the biggest things people need to think about.
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I don't disagree with anything you've said in this post. I wasn't trying to say before that TiN coated HSS drill bits are going to compensate for poor technique, which is why I told him to use a center drill, use the proper speeds, etc.

Also I don't advocate buying a cheap poorly made product from harbor freight to save money in the short term, because you'll lose it in the long term.
 
I don't see where anybody mentioned: quality cobalt drills do seem to outlast regular HSS
 
That would probably be best left to another thread, before this one get's completely hi-jacked by debate.
 
Ocelot85 said:
That would probably be best left to another thread, before this one get's completely hi-jacked by debate.
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I respectfully disagree. It is directly on topic as I have had situations where a cobalt drill cut right through stuff that was eating up HSS drills.

P.s. nice handle, I wanted ocelot, but it was taken...
 
Cobalt High-Speed Steel alloys have higher red hardness than standard high-speed steels, permitting drilling of materials such as heat-resistant alloys and materials with hardness greater than Rockwell 38 C. These high-speed drills can withstand cutting speeds beyond the range of conventional high-speed-steel drills and have superior resistance to abrasion but are not equal to tungsten-carbide tipped tools. - 29th edition Machinery's Handbook.

Personally unless the material specifically calls for Cobalt HSS-E, I go with Carbide drills if regular HSS twist drills can't handle it.
 
What are Norseman bits made from? I drilled over 30 1/4" holes 1 7/8" deep in annealed A2 with a cheap, underpowered drill press by using good bits, good coolant, and proper feed and speed. The bit was still good afterwards too. My 3/32" bits I use for my slipjoints, I just use for one blade and throw them out. They are too cheap to mess with not having a fresh drill bit each time.

Never skimp on anything that cuts, shears, drills, or abrades. It is a false economy.
 
Just for the record, the steel is 1084 Carbon steel, came from knifemaker.ca, is annealed, and does not have scale. I gave him the steel, but have not been around to see the thread. I use a bit of rapid tap while drilling with my press and have neve had any issues drilling it, I do always drill a pilot hole however for a hole that large. Issue is probably with the hand drill. Too much speed and no pilot will kill the bits quickly.
 
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