I was afraid this would happen with the new steels CS is using...

UCPOPO said:
I've seen the CTS-XHP American Lawman preorder priced for $94 with free shipping. The same dealer sold the AUS8 model for $67.
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Well, the regular Lawman is now being sold at alot of places for $43, so $94 is still more than double in price.
 
IMO, they will need to step up the F&F with these higher prices too. I just got a Recon 1 XL at a great price. However, the knife needs to be taken apart and dialed in right out of the box. Super gritty, crunchy lock, even for a new tri ad. Rattling stop pin and blade closed pin (whatever it's called). Loose pivot screw with no loctite. I'm fine fixing these things with what I paid, but if this had been a $150 knife I would probably just send it back and look elsewhere.

ETA: Also, the whole "stupid tight for no reason" pocket clip thing should be addressed as well with the price increases.
 
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I'm not interested in the new super steels. My vg10's/ats34's/154cm's all do everything I need to them to do. I still prefer good old carbon tool when it's available.

Mike Sastre, good to see you still posting here :)
 
jonnyfgroove said:
IMO, they will need to step up the F&F with these higher prices too. I just got a Recon 1 XL at a great price. However, the knife needs to be taken apart and dialed in right out of the box. Super gritty, crunchy lock, even for a new tri ad. Rattling stop pin and blade closed pin (whatever it's called). Loose pivot screw with no loctite. I'm fine fixing these things with what I paid, but if this had been a $150 knife I would probably just send it back and look elsewhere.
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I have a couple dozen Cold Steel blades, and not a one of then sounds remotely like yours.
 
Neomentat said:
Well, the regular Lawman is now being sold at alot of places for $43, so $94 is still more than double in price.
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They're being sold for $43 cause they've been discontinued. If the new one wasn't coming out, they wouldn't be selling for $43.
 
I don't understand why people are saying they are done with cold steel now because of some of the increased prices coming up. If you like the previous, less expensive models, buy them up now while they are at their cheapest price. Why does that mean you won't buy Cold Steel anymore? It just doesn't make sense. I guess you can never please everybody.
 
UCPOPO said:
I guess you can never please everybody.
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Can I quote you on that? ;)

People were complaining that CS wasn't keeping up with the competition because they were using an inferior alloy (AUS-8). Now they're complaining that CS is too expensive because they've upgraded their alloy (CTS-XHP). You can't have it both ways, boys and girls. There is no free lunch.
 
Insipid Moniker said:
Honestly, to me this move seems like it really restores the value proposition of some of the models they're producing. I've really liked the direction Cold Steel has been going with their design language ever since Andrew Demko came on board, but price to performance has kind of held me back. It's hard for me to drop $60-70 on a great design with AUS8 when I can spend $80-90 and get a great design in D2 or S30V. With the step up to XHP and given the pricing we've seen so far, I'd say these knives are going to be very, very hard to beat for the money. The American Lawman is suddenly neck-and-neck with knives like the Manix 2 and Paramilitary 2 is terms of bang for the buck and that's damned impressive.
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I absolutely agree. As one who really appreciates the value in certain Spyderco knives, and has the PM2 and Manix 2 in my edc rotation, after handling the Cold Steel Lawman and Recon 1 at the b and m store, I m going to buy my first Cold Steel (or two) when they are available in cts xhp. The knives I handled were well made and extremely strong feeling.. Might get a new addition to my edc rotation.
I think they customer base is going explode with growth. Good going Cold Steel.
 
Cold Steel are offering XHP and BD-1 in their lines to offer value differentiation.

What was the largest competitor to Cold Steel's Recon 1?

It wasn't the Spyderco Endura, it wasn't the Buck Vantage.

It was Cold Steel's Voyager range.

Same lock, same blade steel, about as easy to carry, about 2/3 the price.

Now the Recon 1 is in XHP and the Voyager in BD-1 there is actually a reason to pay extra to get the Recon. On the other hand the BD-1 Voyager is only marginally more expensive than its AUS8 predecessor, and they've even come out with fully serrated versions of the clip point and tanto blades. BD-1 is better than AUS8 too, at least going from reports by people who've used it in Spyderco knives.
 
UCPOPO said:
I don't understand why people are saying they are done with cold steel now because of some of the increased prices coming up. If you like the previous, less expensive models, buy them up now while they are at their cheapest price. Why does that mean you won't buy Cold Steel anymore? It just doesn't make sense. I guess you can never please everybody.
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I was super excited about the new line up and was waiting to buy a whole bunch of CS until I saw just how much $$$ it increased by. Now CS is in direct competition price wise with some really big name knife companies and that's where the problem comes in.

For the same amount of money for a CS with new steel, I can purchase a variety of knives with better fit and finish, made in USA, and much better customer service.

For CS to price their new line in this category they need to step up on quiet a few things. One of which is their severely lacking customer service department.

A month ago I contacted the CS rep here on the forums for a replacement pocket clip. I was instructed to call CS customer service line. Called, explained issue and was given an email to one of the person who "handles" it. Email the said person and ..... NOTHING.

If CS wants to play in the $100+ market, they need to step it up.
 
Neomentat said:
I was super excited about the new line up and was waiting to buy a whole bunch of CS until I saw just how much $$$ it increased by. Now CS is in direct competition price wise with some really big name knife companies and that's where the problem comes in.

For the same amount of money for a CS with new steel, I can purchase a variety of knives with better fit and finish, made in USA, and much better customer service.

For CS to price their new line in this category they need to step up on quiet a few things. One of which is their severely lacking customer service department.

A month ago I contacted the CS rep here on the forums for a replacement pocket clip. I was instructed to call CS customer service line. Called, explained issue and was given an email to one of the person who "handles" it. Email the said person and ..... NOTHING.

If CS wants to play in the $100+ market, they need to step it up.
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Not to be unfair, but if you look there are quite a few stories like that about customer service at almost every company. The customer service might be great, it might be terrible, it's just impossible to say without a decent sample size.

And honestly, what US made knives are out there with equivalent materials, similar price and better F&F than the new CS models? Golden made Spydies are great knives, but their fit and finish isn't particularly spectacular and most other US offerings are either significantly more expensive (ZT and Benchmade) or just not using the same class of steel (Hogue and Buck).
 
Neomentat said:
I was super excited about the new line up and was waiting to buy a whole bunch of CS until I saw just how much $$$ it increased by. Now CS is in direct competition price wise with some really big name knife companies and that's where the problem comes in.

For the same amount of money for a CS with new steel, I can purchase a variety of knives with better fit and finish, made in USA, and much better customer service.

For CS to price their new line in this category they need to step up on quiet a few things. One of which is their severely lacking customer service department.

A month ago I contacted the CS rep here on the forums for a replacement pocket clip. I was instructed to call CS customer service line. Called, explained issue and was given an email to one of the person who "handles" it. Email the said person and ..... NOTHING.

If CS wants to play in the $100+ market, they need to step it up.
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My experience with Cold Steel Customer Service was quite different.

I acquired a Vaquero Grande in VG-1, circa 2007/2008 last year.
The knife was a bargain at $40 on craigslist and in NM condition, but the clip, like most, was chipped and the black paint coming off in spots.

I called Cold Steel and they said they still had a few of those clips left and sent me one at no charge and I got it in a few days.

As for pricing, ignore the MSRP -- they will be about 40% less on the secondary market and still a bargain compared to similar knives in most cases.

Pricing on the Black Talon II pre-order is $110.00 -- compare that to the Spyderco Civilian at $150 minimum.

Not only does the Black Talon use better steel, it appears to have better ergonomics and a thumb plate instead of a bird's eye opening on the blade.

Blade length, grind, weight, etc are virtually identical. Plus the CS has the Tri-Ad lock.

I have the Civi and it does not have a provision to put the clip on the other side for left-handers, plus I don't care for the ergonomics.

Admittedly, I haven't yet held a BT II yet, but it looks to have better ergonomics, a clip provision for left-handers and uses CTS-XHP instead of VG-10

I wish I had held off on buying the Civi, but didn't know at the time that CS was coming out with a similar but better knife.
 
UCPOPO said:
I don't understand why people are saying they are done with cold steel now because of some of the increased prices coming up. If you like the previous, less expensive models, buy them up now while they are at their cheapest price. Why does that mean you won't buy Cold Steel anymore? It just doesn't make sense. I guess you can never please everybody.
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Yep. Hoping their will be some close-out sales on the AUS-8A knives.

When the 4" Vaquero was being discontinued, I bought one for $20.00 online and have since bought one with a PE although I prefer a SE

I will probably buy one or two more of them on ebay.

Had I known that I would have loved this knife so much, I would have bought 3 or 4 at $20 each instead of just one.

It remains my favorite CS knife. Love the grippy Grivory handle as well. I wish they would bring that back.
 
Glad to see a movement to USA blades in high quality american steel with a mild cost increase.

Aus-8 is OK for folders, but for fixed blades I find it underwhelming. Sharpening a small blade isn't that big of a deal, doesn't take that long. Sharpening a large blade is a much more demanding undertaking.
 
Buffalohump said:
I am seeing a number of the AUS8 models on sale at the moment so those of you who like the steel and want to score some bargains have plenty to choose from.

The sooner you get them bought, the sooner they can stock the new stuff so have at it! :p
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My thoughts exactly. Picked up a Mini Lawman last week for $40 just for the heck of it. I sanded down the G10 on my first Mini and forgot how aggressive it was when new. Recon 1's are going for less than $45 on Amazon, which imho is a huge value. I'm pretty sure I paid around $75 for mine a couple of years ago. Which makes $100 for a new Recon with CTS-XHP steel seem like a bargain if it lives up to what everyone is saying.
 
The pre-order Recon 1s are $99.95 at one popular online dealer. Last summer, the AUS-8A Recon 1s were going for $65 on several sites. Given the change in steel, the upgraded blade coating, and the money that Cold Steel probably had to invest in order to make so much change for 2015, I think that's a reasonable price increase. But to each his own.

One things for sure. If you want to buy an AUS-8A folder, there are probably going to be some incredible sales this year. It sounds like they're already starting.
 
Have to admit I'm kind of enjoying the clearance prices on Cold Steel. I won't be needing to buy any AUS 8 models for a while lol.
 
Can't believe this whining, I had no idea CS fans were such a bunch of cheapskates. :p

Dont forget the upgrade also includes DLC which is a far superior coating to teflon. Given how many people used to bitch about the coating its interesting to see that pretty much nobody is mentioning it now.

I guess you just cant please people. :rolleyes:
 
Buffalohump said:
I guess you just cant please people. :rolleyes:
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I think CS will gain many more customers and fans with these changes than they will lose. I've never been one of those calling for CS to upgrade their steel, but now that they have, I can live with it. I'm also willing to entertain the possibility that I'll like the new steels (XHP in particular) even more than AUS-8. I don't know that I'll replace any of my AUS-8 stuff with the same models in BD-1 or XHP, but I'll certainly be buying some of their new models in the new steels. The prices of the new stuff have increased, sure, but I don't think they're outrageous by any means.
 
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