I must say I can't see the point in bringing both a 9"-10" knife and a machete. My favorite machete right now is a Cold Steel Panga and a Cold Steel Barong. I added a primary grind to the Barong, and will do the same to the Panga one day. After some recent work with the Barong and a Kukri machete from Cold Steel, I think you could probably get a way with a bevel in the range of 10 to 12 degrees per side on a machete, if it didn't have a primary grind. I've been leaning toward large knives being too short lately. Like above, the speed and impact in a 12-16 inch blade is incredible. IMO, based on the chopping and splitting I've done in the back yard, clearing branches up to 4" across, there is a gap between 4"-5" blades and 12"+ blades that doesn't really need to be filled, with respect to cutting only.
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If you have a good machete, what's the point of having a large knife?
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Me2, I just want to point out that the blade designs of Condor, and Cold Steel differ greatly. CS manufactures their machete line from plate steel, which I suspect is stamp cut out from the sheet, and then heat treated and painted, handles melted on, and then the grinder destroys the HT by working the piss out of the blade to put the grinds on. Condor, is an actual forged Barong with a long distal taper and thick spine at the handle. CS is a uniform 2.75mm the length of the blade. Not the same class of blade maybe.
As to my earlier claims of Golok mod fun, I got that picture snapped. you can see how on my second (the one with the holes in the tang) I started removing the meat from the blade, and I am using the paint as a guide to keep me from messing up the distal grind at the spine with my hack work
As to my earlier claims of Golok mod fun, I got that picture snapped. you can see how on my second (the one with the holes in the tang) I started removing the meat from the blade, and I am using the paint as a guide to keep me from messing up the distal grind at the spine with my hack work
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Or you can just carry the saw and drop the chopper completely.
I dunno about this. I think edge geometry and what is being chopped is more at play here then hitting the sweet spot. Unless of course we're talking about kukris that don't carry the full hardness the entire length of the blade. My ding came from hard wood and a too thin edge profile.
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Or you can just carry the saw and drop the chopper completely.
I dunno about this. I think edge geometry and what is being chopped is more at play here then hitting the sweet spot. Unless of course we're talking about kukris that don't carry the full hardness the entire length of the blade. My ding came from hard wood and a too thin edge profile.
It's possible to have edge damage from the edge being too thin and hitting something hard, for sure. However, I firmly believe that the vast majority of edge dings, chips, and rolls that folks experience with machetes are due to hitting with the edge out of alignment with the target, overstriking, understriking, or hitting dirty targets.
To me, with my admittedly limited experience with machetes but hearing of this chipping thing coming up quite often, it seems like a good argument for going to a convex edge on a machete. It would give you a little more strength on the edge grind itself, but if done right, it would not hurt its chopping ability at all. I think one of the things right now that is causing my new Golok to be merely a good chopper rather than a GREAT one, is the fact that the factory edge is thick. I narrowed the edge near the front of the blade just using a hand Diafold sharpener, and it already feels much sharper than the factory edge that remains on the rear part of the blade. I'll bet it chops better too next time I try it. But, with the thinner v-edge it'll probably also be more prone to chipping.
There's a professional knife sharpener in my town (Bronk's Knife Works) who is quite an accomplished sharpener and knows a lot about putting convex edges on stuff. For $8, he'll put a beautiful convexed edge on my Golok and I'm thinking that might be well worth the money, to get the thing set up right to start with.
There's a professional knife sharpener in my town (Bronk's Knife Works) who is quite an accomplished sharpener and knows a lot about putting convex edges on stuff. For $8, he'll put a beautiful convexed edge on my Golok and I'm thinking that might be well worth the money, to get the thing set up right to start with.
Me2, I just want to point out that the blade designs of Condor, and Cold Steel differ greatly. CS manufactures their machete line from plate steel, which I suspect is stamp cut out from the sheet, and then heat treated and painted, handles melted on, and then the grinder destroys the HT by working the piss out of the blade to put the grinds on. Condor, is an actual forged Barong with a long distal taper and thick spine at the handle. CS is a uniform 2.75mm the length of the blade. Not the same class of blade maybe.
I'm sure the end product on the CS and Condor models is quite different. CS could do a lot to improve their line of machetes. I've said before that the "utility edge" they come with appears to be applied by letting a beaver chew on it. But, once you get past that, they are surprisingly good. I don't really have a need for a chopper as thick as the Condor tapered models unless it has a primary grind. For heavens sake, I'm adding primary grinds to my machetes that are only 1/16" thick, then using them to cut roots without gross damage, just dulling from the dirt. My definition of machete is quite narrow and is pretty much exactly how CS does it. Profiled sheet metal, hardened, with an edge. Any more complicated than that and it moves into bush knife territory to me, especially with a primary grind.
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Some jobs you just need or want a blade with backbone. Machetes are great chopping tools, but they are thin and flexible by nature.
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there's a difference between manufactured quality and functionality. Condor has good manufactured quality and great functionality. Cold Steel has poor manufactured quality, but it doesn't mean it's not a capable tool. What few CS machetes I have have different, but great functionality as well.
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I am pretty stingy with the flexibility of the words in my vocabulary too, thank you for helping me understand your view.Cols Steel delivers a lot of metal at the price, but for your money you should really give the way Southern americans a try before your next Taiwanese tool, i think you will be converted in short order.
I get the difference between an edge versus a primary grind. He just quoted me this price over the phone, he hasn't seen the blade yet and so it's possible he isn't clear on what I want. The point is though, when I think of either sitting there for hours, trying to reprofile that Golok by hand, or buying a bunch of belt sanding equipment, or just paying this guy $8 to rework it for me (assuming that we're on the same page about what he's going to do), that seems like a bargain and saves me a lot of hassle. And if he's able to convex it for me, to just MAINTAIN the edge after he's done shouldn't be that big a deal.
Funny you should mention that. I find the CS machetes from China to be much better made than the ones from South Africa. I intend to just make my own if I need another. They are so simple if you have some basic tools and steel. I'll likely never wear out my Barong or Panga, if I'd just leave them alone and quit tinkering.
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The Condor Golok is about a quarter of an inch at the ricasso, but it drastically tempers towards the point. Things are pretty fuzzy as far as that's concerned... I just use the damn things...
Machetes are AWESOME !!! LOL Ok, now that i got that out of the way, the machete is an under rated, overlooked blade by many. A quality machete can be had for a reasonable price, and, with a few modifications to make it work better for your particular need, can be one of the best investments as far as "bang for the buck $$", that you will ever make in a usefull all-around blade. I like mine so much now, that it will be wearing some custom pants one day, because the sheaths are either non-existant or just plain suck, at least in my humble opinion anyway.
My modified 12" Ontario.
Ok, now that i got that out of the way, the machete is an under rated, overlooked blade by many. A quality machete can be had for a reasonable price, and, with a few modifications to make it work better for your particular need, can be one of the best investments as far as "bang for the buck $$", that you will ever make in a usefull all-around blade. I like mine so much now, that it will be wearing some custom pants one day, because the sheaths are either non-existant or just plain suck, at least in my humble opinion anyway.
My modified 12" Ontario.
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CapitalizedLiving
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Not sure how a chopping knife, a machete, and an axe can really be compared.
If I was in a Scandinavian forest I'd want an axe and not a machete. If I was in the Amazonian jungle I'd want a machete and not an axe. If I am in my backyard in the Rockies I want a chopper instead of the other two, except for when I want one of the other two and have to go in the house to get it.
Not sure if that answers the OP's question but that's how it works for me.
If I was in a Scandinavian forest I'd want an axe and not a machete. If I was in the Amazonian jungle I'd want a machete and not an axe. If I am in my backyard in the Rockies I want a chopper instead of the other two, except for when I want one of the other two and have to go in the house to get it.
Not sure if that answers the OP's question but that's how it works for me.
I understand the value of specialized tools, and I own and have used all three of these tools (although in the original post, I wasn't asking abot axes, I was comparing machetes and large knives). However, usually on backpacking (and also in a survival situation), I want to pack lightly and minimally--I don't want to bring all of these tools. And in a typical backpacking or survival situation, I want the tool that is the most VERSATILE for the widest array of tasks that I do, while also being safe to use, and light/compact enough to carry. If I knew exactly what I was going to run into, I could always bring the perfect tool (an axe, or a machete, or a large knife, or a shovel, etc.). But because I have weight limitations to what I can carry, and don't always know what I'll run into, it makes sense to bring the one tool that is able to do the widest range of tasks, and also to do well at the most common tasks that I need it for.
My hunch, is that either the machete, or the large knife come the closest to being this multipurpose tool for me. And I think that has kind of been confirmed in this thread. The axe has a place for certain kinds of uses, for instance, if I were building a more semi-permanent wood shelter, or clearing a large forested area by hand, I'd want an axe for sure. However, for handling a wide variety of backpacking/survival tasks with one tool, it seems hard to beat a machete or a large knife for versatility. The machete guys on this thread have convinced me that the machete--if you have a quality one and a good blade grind--probably wins even over the large knife in overall versatility. A properly sharpened large knife may be a LITTLE better at certain things--possibly at splitting wood, and definitely at detailed carving tasks--than most machetes, and it's usually going to be more portable well.
Bottom line: I'll probably keep my Junglass, because I can still see cases where I'll want it and it's more compact than most machetes. But at the same time, I'm going to start taking my golok on backpacking trips when I can, get it sharpened up better, and learn to use it for more tasks, and see to what extent it can compete with or even outdo the Junglas.
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An axe is really only preferable to a machete for dedicated felling or splitting tasks. If I'm going to fell several trees or split a cord of wood I'll want an axe. But 90% of the time or more, you're cutting smaller trees, scrub brush, briar patches, or dense tick-infested grass just so you can get from point A to point B. You can walk around most large trees. You can fell and split with a machete (albeit not as well) but you can't clear brambles or green vegetation with an axe. I live in Maine, which isn't too different from Scandinavia in a lot of ways (lots of trees and frickin' cold in the winter
) and I use a machete as my go-to woods tool.Thread over. There's simply nothing else to discuss now.
LOL, Thats funny and that made my night ! :thumbup:It seems to me anyway, that it is harder to do big jobs with a small knife, than it is to do small jobs with the proper big knife.
Bring enough knife !