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I'm SICK of the PRYING LECTURES!
- Thread starter fulloflead
- Start date
- Joined
- Apr 28, 2001
- Messages
- 125
fulloflead said:Rant mode ON:
I'm SICK and TIRED of all the LECTURES every time I ask about hard-use knives!
People keep sending this quote about, "A knife is the most expensive prybar you'll ever own."
So, the next time you see someone asking about prying or any other use of a knife...
you should just GO SCHIT IN YOUR HAT.
Thank you!
Sorry to have bothered you. Please feel free to use your knife for any purpose you see fit. And by the way, go schit in YOUR hat.
Grahamknives said:
No not at all. What I was getting at was the ignorance of someone wanting to use a knife for say, a log splitter, or trying to pry a door open...or using it as an axe and bypassing all the proper tools that may only be a few feet away. Why? Just for the "thrill"? I've seen people complain of chipped blades when they were using a knife for something better suited to a crowbar or an axe or chisel. I'd be embarresed if I were them.
But hey, thats my opinion. Each to their own.
MelancholyMutt
Doggy Style
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- Apr 13, 2002
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- 3,906
It's just the guy put up a post about using his knife as a prybar and now he's upset that people aren't telling him what he wants to hear.
- Joined
- May 9, 2000
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- 29,205
If a knife is the only option I have in an emergency then I will use it for jobs it was not really intended to do. This is not something I will do for the fun of it.
There is a distinct difference between improvise and design, no matter what the tool, no matter what the circumstance.
Can I fry an egg on the lens of my SureFire M6? Certainly, but it probably wouldn't work as well as it would as a flashlight.
Can I race my street-car? Certainly, but it would be both faster and safer if I made a few changes first.
Can I intubate you with a straw on top of your dining room table? More than likely, but I'd rather do so with the proper instruments and in a more controlled setting.
Can I use a good knife as a prybar? Certainly, but if given the choice, would I?
Proper tool for the proper job. That's by design.
Don't confuse that with improvising.
Allen
aka DumboRAT
Can I fry an egg on the lens of my SureFire M6? Certainly, but it probably wouldn't work as well as it would as a flashlight.
Can I race my street-car? Certainly, but it would be both faster and safer if I made a few changes first.
Can I intubate you with a straw on top of your dining room table? More than likely, but I'd rather do so with the proper instruments and in a more controlled setting.
Can I use a good knife as a prybar? Certainly, but if given the choice, would I?
Proper tool for the proper job. That's by design.
Don't confuse that with improvising.
Allen
aka DumboRAT
- Joined
- May 3, 2002
- Messages
- 6,192
MelancholyMutt said:
[Edit: Never mind. I don't want to stir up more crap or get banned. I'll leave the Mutt alone.]
t1mpani
Platinum Member
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- Jun 6, 2002
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- 5,517
I'm afraid many people are always on the extreme end of this thought process, thinking that when prying is mentioned the person is going to be attempting to bust a rusted leaf spring off a truck with their knife. Common sense should be used by people using their knives, and it would also be remarkably refreshing if people would use it when posting responses. I broke a hunk out of the front of a Kabar years ago when I was digging foxholes for a training exercise. No, I was not digging with the knife, I had a shovel. When I came upon some thick, gnarly, dried up old roots (which were attached to a nearby thick, gnarly, dried up old tree) I found that my shovel wasn't making much headway going through them. They were too hard to saw at with a non-serrated edge, so I put my knife down on one and gave the spine a few whacks with the butt of my flashlight to start the split, and then started bending and pulling at the root, and twisting with the knife to break it apart. This worked well, so I moved onto the next. On that one, I apparently twisted a little too much, as I heard a snap and found that there was a roughly half-moon shaped section broken out along the edge right where the straight edge turns into the belly. I was irritated at having damaged my knife, but moved to a new section of the blade and kept going until I was done.
If I'd had a better tool available, I'd have used it. As it was, I had my knife, and I ended up damaging it. I was not filled with a desire to find an ultimate blade so that I could take out my revenge upon all gnarly tree roots for the rest of my days, but I decided that for what I used a big knife for, I'd rather replace the Kabar with a beefier blade. This is not anything against this well respected knife, it's just that for my purposes a heavier blade would work a bit better, since the need for a knife balanced as a fighter hadn't ever arisen. So, I carry a heavier duty blade (for my big knife). If I come upon the same situation again, and I have access to a small saw, some heavy shears, or a file so that I can sharpen up my shovel and put all my weight on the root, I'll do it and leave the knife in its sheath. If not, I'll pull the knife out and be a little more confident that the same won't happen again.
But whether you find such use reasonable or abusive isn't the point here, is it? Someone who does use their equipment in a certain way has every right to ask about what will best fill THEIR needs without being lectured or talked down to. No matter what field or topic is being discussed, you'll have "experts" with vastly different opinions and methods, simply because there is no single, best way of doing anything. So before I respond to someone asking about getting a custom made version of Rambo's knife with, "That knife is all show an you're clearly a wannabe loser for liking it..." or questions on edge-holding super steels with "What's so hard about sharpening?!" I try to keep in mind that the other person is an adult, and has made it thus far in life without my assessment of their actions. How many here would appreciate the guy down at Discount Tire responding to the question of what size of slicks to put on your corvette with, "If you're driving responsibly, you won't need them. Come here and let me show you our wet weather tires..."
So, my suggestion here would be that we all, when feeling the urge to bypass answering specific questions and instead impart unasked-for wisdom on those we deem foolish (and to do so in as condescending a manner possible) we take our example from Ben Franklin and, "doubt a little of our own infallibility." I realize that answering (or not) questions and keeping our extraneous personal opinions to ourselves is a rather adult concept, but I contend that the mere fact that the internet is filled with adolescents does not mean that we all must do our utmost to act like them.
If I'd had a better tool available, I'd have used it. As it was, I had my knife, and I ended up damaging it. I was not filled with a desire to find an ultimate blade so that I could take out my revenge upon all gnarly tree roots for the rest of my days, but I decided that for what I used a big knife for, I'd rather replace the Kabar with a beefier blade. This is not anything against this well respected knife, it's just that for my purposes a heavier blade would work a bit better, since the need for a knife balanced as a fighter hadn't ever arisen. So, I carry a heavier duty blade (for my big knife). If I come upon the same situation again, and I have access to a small saw, some heavy shears, or a file so that I can sharpen up my shovel and put all my weight on the root, I'll do it and leave the knife in its sheath. If not, I'll pull the knife out and be a little more confident that the same won't happen again.
But whether you find such use reasonable or abusive isn't the point here, is it? Someone who does use their equipment in a certain way has every right to ask about what will best fill THEIR needs without being lectured or talked down to. No matter what field or topic is being discussed, you'll have "experts" with vastly different opinions and methods, simply because there is no single, best way of doing anything. So before I respond to someone asking about getting a custom made version of Rambo's knife with, "That knife is all show an you're clearly a wannabe loser for liking it..." or questions on edge-holding super steels with "What's so hard about sharpening?!" I try to keep in mind that the other person is an adult, and has made it thus far in life without my assessment of their actions. How many here would appreciate the guy down at Discount Tire responding to the question of what size of slicks to put on your corvette with, "If you're driving responsibly, you won't need them. Come here and let me show you our wet weather tires..."
So, my suggestion here would be that we all, when feeling the urge to bypass answering specific questions and instead impart unasked-for wisdom on those we deem foolish (and to do so in as condescending a manner possible) we take our example from Ben Franklin and, "doubt a little of our own infallibility." I realize that answering (or not) questions and keeping our extraneous personal opinions to ourselves is a rather adult concept, but I contend that the mere fact that the internet is filled with adolescents does not mean that we all must do our utmost to act like them.
Common sense indeed, and all too true about the Errornet.- Joined
- Dec 27, 2003
- Messages
- 1,983
Fulloflead, I am sorry if I offended you by my answer on the other forums, You ask a question on the SOG forums, and I had a gut feeling that it would be a touchy subject, that is why I almost passed on an answer, but when I joined these forums after reading for about a year, I thought I had read enough threads to get an idea how to answer someones question, as long as it were my honest opinion, in a touchy area. As long as I said that it is my opinion, and surely not written in stone. Your question about the Tiger Shark blade breakage was answered with a fact answer, I have not heard of a tip broken on this model, but I can't say it has never happened, just that I have never heard of it.
That is why I thought out my answer to you and had read enough of the blade tip breakage post in the past, to know that if I answered with a direct, solid, factual answer, written in stone, that it might cause a problem. So I answered with an honest opinion that was my opinion, no one elses. I stated this very clearly a couple times on my post to you. I gave you an answer that I think applied to me and only me, If I did not make this clear enough, then please forgive me, I made a mistake, and I will definatly learn from it.
In my answer to you, I stated that there would be many different opinions concerning this question, I did not realize you would be offended if I answered giving you my opinion. I am a little confused now as to the right answer given to you, but I still feel I gave you an honest answer that applies to me, no one else. I think if every one read the answer I gave you, they would see that it is no different than any other opinion answers they may have given many times on these forums.
Your post is the first time I have ever had someone seem upset by the answer I gave, I consider myself new to this forum, but I learn something new about knives almost every day. I am having a hard time understanding the right answer that you would accept, so as not to have offended you. I could have stated, yes, you can use any knife for pry bars, but it would not be my true feeling, and it may have provoked a worse response than the answer I gave, from some other people, who feel different.
I learned a lot from this post, and that is there are certain subjects you can not really give a right answer, because there really is no right answer, there are many different answers, but almost all the answers given by everyone would in truth be their opinions, and in certain areas, opinions just won't work. Again, I am sorry if I offended you, and certainly would not mean to offend any one one these forums. I thought you would not mind if I gave you my honest opinion on a knife question, and I sure did not realize it would provoke the response on another forum like it did.
Your answer to my opinion did not reveal to me that your were upset about my answer, as a matter of fact, I thought I may have given you some decent thoughts about this matter, by your answer to me by saying, "Good points" thanks a lot.
Please accept my opology if I offended you. And also, Bobby B, is a fine person, and I know he was just trying to help you by giving you his opinion also. My last sentence on my answer to your post, I added just for this type of possible response, hoping it would make you understand it is sure not written in stone, because I had a gut feeling I was answering a question I should not answer with an opinion, I said.... " I would like to add, this is my opinion only, some people may feel different about prying, but I just don't do it.
Robbie Roberson
That is why I thought out my answer to you and had read enough of the blade tip breakage post in the past, to know that if I answered with a direct, solid, factual answer, written in stone, that it might cause a problem. So I answered with an honest opinion that was my opinion, no one elses. I stated this very clearly a couple times on my post to you. I gave you an answer that I think applied to me and only me, If I did not make this clear enough, then please forgive me, I made a mistake, and I will definatly learn from it.
In my answer to you, I stated that there would be many different opinions concerning this question, I did not realize you would be offended if I answered giving you my opinion. I am a little confused now as to the right answer given to you, but I still feel I gave you an honest answer that applies to me, no one else. I think if every one read the answer I gave you, they would see that it is no different than any other opinion answers they may have given many times on these forums.
Your post is the first time I have ever had someone seem upset by the answer I gave, I consider myself new to this forum, but I learn something new about knives almost every day. I am having a hard time understanding the right answer that you would accept, so as not to have offended you. I could have stated, yes, you can use any knife for pry bars, but it would not be my true feeling, and it may have provoked a worse response than the answer I gave, from some other people, who feel different.
I learned a lot from this post, and that is there are certain subjects you can not really give a right answer, because there really is no right answer, there are many different answers, but almost all the answers given by everyone would in truth be their opinions, and in certain areas, opinions just won't work. Again, I am sorry if I offended you, and certainly would not mean to offend any one one these forums. I thought you would not mind if I gave you my honest opinion on a knife question, and I sure did not realize it would provoke the response on another forum like it did.
Your answer to my opinion did not reveal to me that your were upset about my answer, as a matter of fact, I thought I may have given you some decent thoughts about this matter, by your answer to me by saying, "Good points" thanks a lot.
Please accept my opology if I offended you. And also, Bobby B, is a fine person, and I know he was just trying to help you by giving you his opinion also. My last sentence on my answer to your post, I added just for this type of possible response, hoping it would make you understand it is sure not written in stone, because I had a gut feeling I was answering a question I should not answer with an opinion, I said.... " I would like to add, this is my opinion only, some people may feel different about prying, but I just don't do it.
Robbie Roberson
- Joined
- May 3, 2002
- Messages
- 6,192
Robbie Roberson said:
It wasn't you. I actually liked your answer a lot. It was the "other" one that irritated me, and having seen that kind of reply happen again and again to people on these forums I had to vent.
Man I tell ya ..... I get the same kind of grief over at PrybarForums.com. They are always on my back. They tell me, if I want to cut something to use my knife. That a prybar is for prying not cutting. Is it too much to ask that a $100.00 prybar be able to perfrom more than one task, like cutting ..... sheesh.
fulloflead ...... I am kidding, kidding I say. I agree with you, I was just givin' you the business.
Mike
fulloflead ...... I am kidding, kidding I say. I agree with you, I was just givin' you the business.
Mike
- Joined
- May 3, 2002
- Messages
- 6,192
yam said:
Yeah, I've been getting that lately.
I'm still looking for a place to dump the schit out of my OWN hat.
- Joined
- Apr 28, 2001
- Messages
- 125
fulloflead said:Yeah, I've been getting that lately.
I'm still looking for a place to dump the schit out of my OWN hat.
Well its good to see that you can take it as well as you hand it out.
Cheers,
Bill
- Joined
- Jul 1, 2001
- Messages
- 236
Hey FoL: I'm with you about this. I just pulled out my Ontario Pilot's Survival knive that was issued to me back in 1987. This thing was constantly around a marine enviroment for at least 8 years and was never wiped down. I dug and pried with it many times over the years. Still, it is in decent shape and the tip is still intact.
In fact, I would recommend this knife to anyone who needed an "abuser" knife instead of a "user". Keep the safe queens "safe" and get a REAL knife.
Hey WadeF: Do the gerbils really get that big in PA!?!?!
In fact, I would recommend this knife to anyone who needed an "abuser" knife instead of a "user". Keep the safe queens "safe" and get a REAL knife.
Hey WadeF: Do the gerbils really get that big in PA!?!?!
I think that prying ability is an important thing to discuss so that we can be informed about the limits of our tools. It is no different than discussing lock reliability. Yeah if I had a fixed blade, I wouldn't have to worry about lock reliability, but I'm talking about a folder so lets figure out where the limits are and what we can expect from it.
If we're going to use common sense with our tools, we need to know the facts.
If we're going to use common sense with our tools, we need to know the facts.
I could not agree more with Josh Graham and t1mpani. I don't make many post because most of what I am interested in is already answered or I can find it in a search, but I gotta tell ya, there are times that the forums seem to be a bit over the top on some of the responses. Just my 2cents.
Phil
Phil