- Joined
- Dec 3, 2000
- Messages
- 2,998
I went into the local knife store the other day with a handful of trade fodder. While perusing my trade options, my eyes fell upon a Camillus Cuda Talon, designed by Rob Simonich and made with the Talonite that he helped popularize. I asked to look at it. One thing was readily apparent-That man knew his way around a knife. The Talon is easily one of the most absolutely versatile EDC/outdoor knives I've ever stumbled into. I honestly had little idea what Talonite was- I just remember all the noise about it at a time when I didn't even acknowledge it's existence due to it being so far outside of my price range.
On impulse, it came home with me. I immediately took a dive to learn what Talonite and Stellite are and are not, and that is not anything like typical knife steel. Edge rolls easily, but doesn't chip easily, holds an edge for a very long time in soft to medium materials, does not rust, non-magnetic, HRC of 40-45, carbide embedded, doesn't take a super edge, gotta have pretty shallow blade angle, Poor choice for heavy use, etc.
When pulling my nose from my phone, I started checking on much of what had been said. My results are a mixed bag as far as the story line goes.
Can't get very sharp: it felt very dull when I got it. I stropped it for a minute or so on a 4K grit strop and had a hair popping edge. It is not as keen feeling as my knives that can whittle hairs, but it was undeniably sharp enough for any task a common man may undertake.
I decided to cut free hanging paper with it. The knife positively sailed through free hanging paper. Over and over and over again, strangely better than some of my sharpest knives.
Same results on kitchen duty, cutting up meat, tomato, bell pepper, onions, etc.
After that, I had a small mountain of cardboard to cut up for the burn barrel. It continued to cut very efficiently. It finally quit shaving arm hair with ease and got a bit more "draggy" but that was in that one minor endeavor...as far as working, it never changed perceptibly.
It's performance is truly much more impressive than a cursory feel of the edge would lead you to believe.
The edge will roll if you hit bone, wood, etc.
I had some brand new sharpeners I was itching to use anyways, so I decided to take that to task.
Due to the shallow edge angles, it did not fuzz stick super well. Good enough, but...not a champion. I whittled a couple of 1"x3" boards, and went in on some pretty deep cuts. No ill effects noted.
I then hacked at a board a minute or so. Edge was still just fine. Then I picked up my dogs chew toys (either cow or caribou bones, I forget which) and sliced into it with medium effort. No edge deformation noted. Did it again while starting to horse on it some. Nothing.
Finally, I snap cut at the bone a dozen times or so, and the edge rolled in a couple spots. This was more noted in observation than in function-It still cut just fine.
My take home from this was that yes, it may be a bit softer than most respectable steels, but as much of a ham fisted clumsy buffoon as I can be at times, I can't imagine striking bone hard enough to have that effect while cleaning an animal. I brought the edge back in very short order on a diamond stone. A minute or so of stropping had it back to hair popping sharp.
This blade is really fascinating to me, because I've never seen anything quite like it. Comparing it to most knife steels really is kind of an apples and oranges comparison.
When I was learning about it, someone compared the carbide embedded cobalt to looking like a bowl of Jello with fruit in it, the fruit in the jello being compared to the carbides in the cobalt.
My daughter and I looked at it under a microscope this morning and found that to be a very good analogy, with the caveat that the "fruit" in the Jello is VERY thick. Like...no holding back, someone had ten cans of fruit fixing to expire and used them all for the church picnic. If I had an SD card handy I'd take a picture. It really is quite fascinating.
BUT CAN IT BATON??!!
I get a feeling this stuff is tougher than it gets credit for from some folks, but I ain't gonna be the one to find out. Talonite is a curious blast from the past, and I doubt anyone really cares that much anyways.
At this point, I may or may not use this Summer as a knock around hunting/fishing/foraging/canoeing knife. If I have to find out whether it can baton, there are many, many layers of things that have gone very wrong in my ho-hum little world.
As I recall, when Talonite was a thing...like...approximately 2000-2004 S30V was the greatest bestest steel ever to have been created. I guess the question arises "How does it compare to XYZ super steel?"
If I were on an uber hard core survival mission, I wouldn't take chances with either myself. If I had to choose one of the two, I would choose the super steel. I think for my mundane, boring, unremarkable life, Talonite is likely capable of a life time of performance. I dunno how much it really gives up to super steels in toughness, but in my experience it gives up nothing in cutting ability or edge retention. I've not messed with Maxamet, but I have used ZDP 189 and CPM20V, and the Talonite ain't giving nothing up to them.
The Camillus Talon is more of a curiosity than any thing. To me it is a bittersweet reflection of good things that are no longer with us. Rob Simonich, Camillus knives, and Talonite. I think I'd like to keep this one.
On impulse, it came home with me. I immediately took a dive to learn what Talonite and Stellite are and are not, and that is not anything like typical knife steel. Edge rolls easily, but doesn't chip easily, holds an edge for a very long time in soft to medium materials, does not rust, non-magnetic, HRC of 40-45, carbide embedded, doesn't take a super edge, gotta have pretty shallow blade angle, Poor choice for heavy use, etc.
When pulling my nose from my phone, I started checking on much of what had been said. My results are a mixed bag as far as the story line goes.
Can't get very sharp: it felt very dull when I got it. I stropped it for a minute or so on a 4K grit strop and had a hair popping edge. It is not as keen feeling as my knives that can whittle hairs, but it was undeniably sharp enough for any task a common man may undertake.
I decided to cut free hanging paper with it. The knife positively sailed through free hanging paper. Over and over and over again, strangely better than some of my sharpest knives.
Same results on kitchen duty, cutting up meat, tomato, bell pepper, onions, etc.
After that, I had a small mountain of cardboard to cut up for the burn barrel. It continued to cut very efficiently. It finally quit shaving arm hair with ease and got a bit more "draggy" but that was in that one minor endeavor...as far as working, it never changed perceptibly.
It's performance is truly much more impressive than a cursory feel of the edge would lead you to believe.
The edge will roll if you hit bone, wood, etc.
I had some brand new sharpeners I was itching to use anyways, so I decided to take that to task.
Due to the shallow edge angles, it did not fuzz stick super well. Good enough, but...not a champion. I whittled a couple of 1"x3" boards, and went in on some pretty deep cuts. No ill effects noted.
I then hacked at a board a minute or so. Edge was still just fine. Then I picked up my dogs chew toys (either cow or caribou bones, I forget which) and sliced into it with medium effort. No edge deformation noted. Did it again while starting to horse on it some. Nothing.
Finally, I snap cut at the bone a dozen times or so, and the edge rolled in a couple spots. This was more noted in observation than in function-It still cut just fine.
My take home from this was that yes, it may be a bit softer than most respectable steels, but as much of a ham fisted clumsy buffoon as I can be at times, I can't imagine striking bone hard enough to have that effect while cleaning an animal. I brought the edge back in very short order on a diamond stone. A minute or so of stropping had it back to hair popping sharp.
This blade is really fascinating to me, because I've never seen anything quite like it. Comparing it to most knife steels really is kind of an apples and oranges comparison.
When I was learning about it, someone compared the carbide embedded cobalt to looking like a bowl of Jello with fruit in it, the fruit in the jello being compared to the carbides in the cobalt.
My daughter and I looked at it under a microscope this morning and found that to be a very good analogy, with the caveat that the "fruit" in the Jello is VERY thick. Like...no holding back, someone had ten cans of fruit fixing to expire and used them all for the church picnic. If I had an SD card handy I'd take a picture. It really is quite fascinating.
BUT CAN IT BATON??!!
I get a feeling this stuff is tougher than it gets credit for from some folks, but I ain't gonna be the one to find out. Talonite is a curious blast from the past, and I doubt anyone really cares that much anyways.
At this point, I may or may not use this Summer as a knock around hunting/fishing/foraging/canoeing knife. If I have to find out whether it can baton, there are many, many layers of things that have gone very wrong in my ho-hum little world.
As I recall, when Talonite was a thing...like...approximately 2000-2004 S30V was the greatest bestest steel ever to have been created. I guess the question arises "How does it compare to XYZ super steel?"
If I were on an uber hard core survival mission, I wouldn't take chances with either myself. If I had to choose one of the two, I would choose the super steel. I think for my mundane, boring, unremarkable life, Talonite is likely capable of a life time of performance. I dunno how much it really gives up to super steels in toughness, but in my experience it gives up nothing in cutting ability or edge retention. I've not messed with Maxamet, but I have used ZDP 189 and CPM20V, and the Talonite ain't giving nothing up to them.
The Camillus Talon is more of a curiosity than any thing. To me it is a bittersweet reflection of good things that are no longer with us. Rob Simonich, Camillus knives, and Talonite. I think I'd like to keep this one.
.........
........ Materials and looks
