Is a cryo treated knife really that good?

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Sage Creek

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I was looking at a knife at the knife show this weekend and the maker said it is heated treated and cryo treated (double tempered) He stated that cryo treating makes the blade much stronger and holds a edge longer. However, I've heard that it really doesn't make that much of a difference and can make the blade a bit more brittle than a standard 440C that has just been heat treated. Is that really the case? What do you think about cryo treated knives?
 
What flavor?

How was the heat treat done?

Cryogenic is a buzzword until you know how it was done, on what, and by whom. It shows extremely good results(more ideal molecular structure of the crystalline matrix, translating to a tougher knife that holds an edge longer) in the hands of those that know what they are doing, and when to do it and for how long :D

Best Regards,

Steven Garsson
 
I have read varying opinions on this. The opinions have run from "Does nothing" to "Makes a huge difference". I would love to see some definitive testing done on this subject. This is a topic where an input from mete would be appreciated. Being a metallurgist, he would probably have a fair bit of knowledge on this subject.
 
I know in softball bats it works wonders, lasts twice as long easily

I would think that for a knife blade to be treated cryo...that it would be expensive and very difficult(due to thickness of blade)

good topic, I am curious now :cool:
 
Kevin McClung said:
Now on to tempering. If steel is not properly hardened, no amount of tempering will help it. Tempering is a lower temperature process than hardening, designed to reduce stresses in the blade while ideally maintaining some quantity of abrasion resistance. Cryogenic treatment in liquid Nitrogen is really useful only in steels that have so much chrome in them that they tend to retain austenite after hardening as opposed to precipitating martensite and bainite to the exclusion of all else. Austenite is a spongy, rather amorphous crystal, very ductile and soft, with face centered carbide. Cryogenics help transform more of the austenite to martensite, in a sort of accelerated aging process. This is one way to get 440C, ATS-34, or 154CM to teeter on the brink of adequacy as cutlery steels.
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Taken from Mad Dog's website.
 
I thought I read Sal from spyderco saying that they cryo'd some of their steels and if that's the case it works damn good.

N2
 
You may want to do a search in the shop talk forum, we have dicussed this in the past. I can tell you this from first hand experience, I have my D2 knives cryo treated and from three customers that gave me feedback, edge holding was far superior then knives I've used that were not cryoed.
scott
 
Proper cryo treatment allows the steel to perform to its maximum potential in a knife.

As the article above said, it allows a better austenite to martensite transformation.....

as for the comments about 440c and 154cm.....they are not simple steels, it takes some experience to h/t them properly...........and they DONT have to be hard chromed!! :rolleyes:
 
I could be wrong but,I seem to remember Bob Dozier saying or posting that he leaves some austenite left in his heat treatment of D2 for some perpose. So, maybe cryo isn't the best treatment depending on the steel and/or what your after. Why would you want all the austenite converded?
 
db said:
I could be wrong but,I seem to remember Bob Dozier saying or posting that he leaves some austenite left in his heat treatment of D2 for some perpose. So, maybe cryo isn't the best treatment depending on the steel and/or what your after. Why would you want all the austenite converded?
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Leaving a very small amount of a blade's steel as unconverted austenite will make the blade less brittle. Some steels will benefit from this, others will not. If you want to optimize edge retention then you want as little austenite as possible.
 
Wayne Goddard wrote an article in Blade about D2 and said that D2 will benefit from being cryo treated and from my experience with it it, it does.
Scott
 
It was worth reviving just for the quote about certain steels “teetering on the brink of adequacy as cutlery steels”.
 
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