Is Cryo Really Neccesary?

Antlerhog said:
It is used in industry to treat tool steels (both trim steels and punches) for the tool and die trade. Cant imagine these big companies are spending the resources if there wasnt some published data supporting it. Just a thought!

Jay
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You've got a point there.......
 
I wonder if I should share my instant sub-zero quench method.... It allows instant sub-zero dry ice quenches any time of the day. Any hour of the week without having to go and get dry ice. Can be done once a week or once every 6 months. And needs no electricity to store the dry ice.
 
Brian Ayres said:
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I am a plumber by trade. I freeze water lines that are live. I have a couple of these tanks that draw liquid Co2 off the bottom of the tank and it squirts it into a clamp I place on the pipe made of ABS and silicone. You need the silicone to vent off the gas but it will coat a blade in dry ice in 2-3 seconds. For a sub-zero this is as quick and easy as it gets.
 
for me since i HT in house and have a kiln and LN dewar anything with more alloy then 10xx gets LN over night. i get rid the RA with cryo and nto the triple temper called for some die steels (they use a high range temper temp)
i cant see how anyone woudl do SS heat treat and not use cryo. send off or get the proper gear
 
Brian Ayres said:
I wonder if I should share my instant sub-zero quench method.... It allows instant sub-zero dry ice quenches any time of the day. Any hour of the week without having to go and get dry ice. Can be done once a week or once every 6 months. And needs no electricity to store the dry ice.
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That is really neat. I like the idea but, what is the smallest tanks and what are the costs?
 
can you guess about how many blades you can do on a tank. i get 30-60 blades out of my 20l LN tank if i plan my HT schedule right (its more about it evaporating between uses)
 
butcher_block said:
can you guess about how many blades you can do on a tank. i get 30-60 blades out of my 20l LN tank if i plan my HT schedule right (its more about it evaporating between uses)
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I would be interested to know those numbers also....I use a 30L LN dewar and my numbers are close to yours if I've done my homework and have 'em all staged over a short period of time.
 
I don't think you have a choice because, as I understand it, CO2 does not really have a liquid state at ambient pressure. If you were ever crazy enough to puncture an old CO2 cartridge or take one out of the BB gun bemire it was totally empty, you could shake it and hear the rattle of the little dry ice pellet that formed after the pressure got low enough for it to solidify,
S.Alexander said:
That's interesting... Making your own dry ice...
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Antlerhog said:
It is used in industry to treat tool steels (both trim steels and punches) for the tool and die trade. Cant imagine these big companies are spending the resources if there wasnt some published data supporting it. Just a thought!

Jay
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I don't have enough experience with such things to say that they make a difference or not. I would like to think it does, but I rely on those with more wisdom than I on this topic (like you guys :D) That being said I also don't think that all big companies are beyond making an investment to do something like a cryo treatment, when it can be used as a marketing ploy to inflate the MSRP of their equipment by 15%. Even if the effects were just meh...
 
Jemblade said:
I don't have enough experience with such things to say that they make a difference or not. I would like to think it does, but I rely on those with more wisdom than I on this topic (like you guys :D) That being said I also don't think that all big companies are beyond making an investment to do something like a cryo treatment, when it can be used as a marketing ploy to inflate the MSRP of their equipment by 15%. Even if the effects were just meh...
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Also a valid point........
 
I hate to get off topic, but I've also considered nickel plating, I've looked around and haven't found much on it, think it would be durable?
 
huntingsgr8 said:
I hate to get off topic, but I've also considered nickel plating, I've looked around and haven't found much on it, think it would be durable?
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Yes, I'm not a metallurgist but Nickel plating is usually used on tools with moving parts to increase durability. It's kind of over kill, besides if you use Stainless Steels there usually is some chromium & Nickel in the mix.

If I remember correct the Knife in that now silly movie, "Crocodile Dundee" was Nickel or Chrome plated.
 
If all you are doing is coating the blade in dry ice thick enough to drop its temp to -109 I would hazard a guess at doing 100 blades a bottle with the right clamp. That would be 1/8 of a pound per blade coating allowing for 30% off gassing. I did a 15n20 necker from .100" damascus stock a month ago and simply walked up to the bottle, opened the tap and squirted it with the liquid and coated the blade in about 2 seconds.
 
I'm also working on a few other uses. Instant chilled beer coasters.
Beer chillers for ski boats cup holders and home wart removal but my lawyer said no to all of them.
 
I don't do much stainless, but what I do I use liquid nitrogen. Mostly folder and smaller blades. My method is a stainless steel thermos that I took the cap seal out so it wouldn't build up pressure and put it in the center of a 5 gallon bucket packed with old towels around it. Put it in the back of my truck and off to the local welding shop where they will fill it for 5$. This will let me do a half dozen or so blades at once and will last most of 24 hours. For any larger stainless blades I just send them out for heat treat.
 
Will, that is an interesting idea of how to get LN at a reasonable cost. Sandvik maintains there is NO benefit to LN on their steels. That -95ºF is just fine, and even a -5ºF freeze treatment is of benefit.

Ken H>
 
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