Is Elishewitz custom or production?

E__WOK

E__WOK

Joined
Aug 8, 1999
Messages
406
I have been told that he has other people make and/or assemble his knives. All he does is grind the blade himself.
They also said the quality of his knives are getting worse. One or two good for every five to seven put out. Is it true? The ones I handled seem to be well made. I would like to know the truth before I spend a couple of c-noted.
 
I don't know where your information comes from but Allen Elishewitz is a custom maker.
I also have heard of what you speak.
I have handled a lot of Mr Elishewitz's knives and I assure you they are all of great quality.Next time he is at a show check out his merchandise.
PS I own six of his knives.
wink.gif

PSS SEMPER FI
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have a"knife"day

[This message has been edited by nifrand (edited 03-18-2000).]
 
I understand that his wife helps assemble the knives, but he does everything on most of his pieces but the heat treatment and some laser cutting.

I have a Cortex that is only a few weeks old, and the work on it is excellent. Superb fit and finish, excellent lock-up and blade grinds, overall a great design well executed.


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James Segura
San Francisco, CA
 
Don't listen to stories that the quality is getting worse. That is far from the truth. Go to a show,handle some of the knives and make your own judgment. I wonder if the people that tell these stories have even seen the mans work. I think you did the him an injustice by even putting a statement like you did in a public forum without knowing anything about him of his knives.


 
I have owned several of his knives. I have had ones from 5-6 years ago up to a new Janus. I can say that even thought the ealier ones were great, he has only gotten better with time.

Rich
 
Hi E_wok!

I too own several of Allen's knives and can vouch for their high quality and attention to detail.

Allen & I talk on the phone several times a week about knives and knifemaking. Based on our conversations, I can honestly say that he does build and QA each and every one by himself. His wife, Valerie also QA's the knives and is probably his worst critic.

Allen is very conscious and concerned about his products and reputation and always gives his best effort.

I personally think that the designs and quality of his knives are continually improving. The all-damascus Persian model I recently took delivery on is nearly flawless.

Allen would personally answer your concerns, but as I write this, he is on his way to France for a 2 week vacation.

Stay sharp!

Jim



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Jim O'Young
www.speed-techknives.com
Home of the Speed Tech "SYNERGY" (tm)
1999-2000 BLADE Magazine "Most Innovative American Design"

 
Tom W, why don't you read my post again, tell me where I said that Elishewitz knives were not good. ------->It's not in there.
Isn't the purpose of a forum to find and share information?
Now I know for sure that he makes his knives without help.
The knife in question was an Elishewitz automatic knife that wouldn't fire each and every time the button was pushed.
However, the few manual knives that I have handled are probably the smoothest opening knives that I have felt. They also had perfect lockup.
IMO, for the money, that they are one of the best looking knives.
Thank you all for your replies. Semper Fidelis
 
Tom, I don't know if I agree with your criticism of Ewok, but I do understand it. I've heard similar rumours and Allen certainly is making alot of knives nowadays. Maybe it's better to get the gossip out in the open here so it can be refuted. That's one of the useful functions served by the forum, provided it's done in good faith. I don't doubt Ewok's good faith here at all.
I don't have first hand knowledge that Mr. Elishewitz does all his work himself, but I would be amazed if he didn't, except maybe the heat treat and a minor step or two. I'm 100% sure that he does everything that he or Val says he does, so maybe we could ask them. Seriously, why not ask? Allen has long been a custom maker of extraordinary ability, [the phantom was one of my first customs]and he seems to be getting better with time. I just wish he would keep the specter design a little longer, but he's got so many new ideas and designs that he wants to move on. That's a strong sign that he is completely custom;if he had a staff and just wanted volume, he'd just bang out more old models. He's not doing that at all.
As far as quality is concerned, I don't know why every once in a while I'll hear someone denigrate the quality of the recent work and say it's not what it was. I've seen no evidence of that being true at all. I don't see enough of his work to pretend to be able to make a statistical analysis, but what I have seen suggests to me that Allen's work is very, very good and I wish I owned more and could buy more of his current work. Have you seen the all damascus folders? Wow. In the unlikely event you an Elishewitz knife does develop a problem, I have no doubt Allen and Val will deal with the problem and give satisfaction. I've seen them do it even perhaps when they shouldn't have.
No, I think Ewok's question was a fair one. If he saw an automatic that had problems, I'm not going to doubt him. But one imperfect knife doesn't taint the whole line. Automatics are sui generis and pretty sensitive. A problem doesn't necessarily signify an error by the maker. If there was a maker's problem with any Elishewitz knife, or even if the problem wasn't a flaw, I'm sure Allen and Val would deal with it very fairly. Their customer service and integrity are extraordinary, in my small experience with them. Anyway, that's my 2 cents.
 
Got to agree with Tom on this. Allen does fine work and stands behind it. To top it all off Valerie and Allen are amoung the nicest folks out there. Take some time to meet him and see his work. I think you will agree.
 
Nobody doubts E-woks intentions. It''s obvious that he's just trying to find out information. But my point is valid and I stand by it. In his attempt to find information he also continued to spread a false roumor in a public forum read by thousands of people. One that I feel is probably spread by people that know nothing about the man or his knives. If a reporter interviews the governor and asks if it's true that you slept with your secretary does that make it right? What do people remember?
The fact that he said no or the roumor? It's human nature to spread gossip and an injustice to the person being gossiped about no matter how good the intentiond were.
 
I have two Elishewitz folders. Compared to the new models I saw at the ECCK Show a few weeks ago, I prefer the aesthetics of my earlier models...at least this is what I thought before I handled the new knives!

On a whim, I just started to play with the knives on his table and I must admit that they are superior in quality, action, and overall construction to his older models. It is almost as if the knives are made by a completely different maker - the sign of an authentic, creative mind. I still prefer the overall visual appeal of my older models, but the action, fit/finish, and his amazing new integral lock are first class. There are some newer features that are very nice however, such as the anodized spacer pins, anodized, lock bar, and new style clip.

I thought I had enough Elishewitz folders, but I think I may order a Phantom with integral lock in the near future. His work is always interesting because he keeps changing. I don't think any other big name tactical knife maker follows suit.

[This message has been edited by Ronald Reagan (edited 03-21-2000).]
 
You're sure right about the creative mind comment Ronald.
It seemd like it's getting to where you almost have to look at the name on some tactical knives to see who made them with all the copycat jump on the bandwagon knifemaking. That has never been the case with Elishewitz. His designs are his designs. From back in the days when the tactical boom was only a rumble he has always been ahead of the pack.
 
TomW, read my posts again, especially the second one. Where's the rumor?

TomW,
Go to a show,handle some of the knives and make your own judgment.
Click to expand...

Fact
The knife in question was an Elishewitz automatic knife that wouldn't fire each and every time the button was pushed.
Click to expand...
 
I've owned a few of Allen's knives, and handled many others. I think they're a pretty good entry-level knife for the asking price, but I've seen a few that were definitely not up to snuff, primarily in the lock department. Admittedly, these were the older liner locks; the integral locks seem better. Personally, I wouldn't buy one of his knives sight unseen, I'd go to a show and handle as many as possible. I had a Specter that I returned to him with a bad lock; I'd break my thumbnail trying to release it. When I got it back, it was worse; the liner barely engaged the tang and the lock could be defeated with moderate hand pressure to the back of the blade. I returned it a second time, and still no real improvement. This knife also had noticeably uneven primary bevels, which I've seen on several of his knives, as well as thumb studs that rotated freely. On the plus side, the ergonomics are as good as it gets on a using knife, and I like the fact that Allen's not a slave to the "tactical" look.

As to whether Allen's knives are custom or production, I personally put them in the "cookie cutter custom" category. Allen, and many other makers, build their knives from a box of vendor-cut parts. The blades are bevel ground and the knife is finished and assembled. Aside from (IMHO) unintentional variations in the grind, and some differences in materials, all the examples of a particular model are pretty much identical. There's nothing wrong with this approach, but to me a true custom knife is comparatively unique, not one of hundreds just like it.

[This message has been edited by Rick (edited 03-20-2000).]
 
Rick, you're the first one to put some meat on the bones of the rumours that I referred to. I guess I've been lucky at never having seen a bad one. Maybe the moral of the story is to see what you're buying or be sure of the return policy. But boy, the ones I've handled have been nice, and the new ones look even nicer. This convinces me even more to move away from liner locks, although a custom specter stills looks really tempting.
 
HJK Every knifemaker that is making a lot of liner locks gets a percentage of them returned. Some of the more prolific knifemakers spend a good deal of time tuning knives and returning them to their customers. That's just the nature of liner lock knives. Don't let that discourage you from buying that kind of knife if it's what you like. If you're at a show go to the table of liner locks and try a bunch of them. You'll notice subtle and sometimes not too subtle differences in most of them. If you like a certain knife and there is only one of them ask the knifemaker if he might have another of that model that's not out.
One knife might feel real nice in your hand until you have another to compare it to that might feel a lot better but you wouldn't notice it if you couldn't compare them.
A returned knife does not substantiate a rumor because all of them get knives returned. The best way to judge a knife is with your own eyes and hands. If you're lucky enough to live near where the shows are it's easy but a problem for those that don't.
 
I'm not trying to substantiate any rumors, but I do think that "some of the more prolific makers" (those who really crank out one knife after another) need to spend a few more minutes per knife assuring that the Lock is right. I've watched a top of the line art knife maker dial in a liner lock, and a few extra minutes can make a world of difference. If Allen had spent five more minutes checking his repair on the above knife, I might have kept it instead of selling it for a loss in disgust after having twice returned it. Same goes for the blade grind; aren't both bevels supposed to look the same? A few extra minutes are all it takes. You can't see esthetic flaws like the latter without handling the knife, and it's doubtful that the maker will correct them later.

 
I think some of the makers who are producing an extraordinary amount of knives need to spend some more time with Q.C.It's great that most of these makers have no problem fixing something when its sent back but these knives should of never left the shop!I inspected a very well known maker(known by some as the father of the folding tactical)and was shocked by the differences in quality of the knives on his table.Some were ground unevenly,the liners on some barely touched the tang on opening,others went past the half way point on the tang.He also had some folders that I could'nt find any fault with.I overheard a customer talking to him.The customer was asking him why when the liner lock was pressed all the way in and the blade was half way closed,he could move the blade in and out slightly(some slight blade play-not side to side but the other way).This would'nt happen if he let go of the liner because of the pressure of the liner.The maker sort of thought about it for a while and all he could answer was why does this bother you.Maybe the customer was'nt that knowledgeable but he could'nt give a reason,he just felt uncomfortable about it.
As for Elishewitz I have followed him since he first started making folders.He has improved by leaps and bounds.Especially with his latest bolster lock.Every time he comes to a N.Y. show I check his knives out.This last show I inspected at least 10 of them.(yes I got there early on Fri.)All the folders were very impressive.They were well worth the money.Check his web site and you'll find a lot of his new models start at $400
 
I just bought a Spectre and was just about breathless when I held it. It is totally flawless and very impressive.
 
i just received my first elishewitz knife today,an ares model.i can attest that allens work is top rate!there isn't a single flaw anywhere,the fit ,finish,blade grind are all perfect.i hope that i can save up for another in the future.
 
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